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Posted: 11/24/2010 3:30:31 AM EDT
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Maybe some of you can help me out. I have been tossing a idea around for a few years to get a mill. Due to space and power the largest i have considered is the rf45 size. The problem is i'm a total noob other than a manual mill/lathe combo and operating much larger vmcs with 4 sided jigs the size of a rf but that has been years and other than push play all i did was set up bits on the comparator ,chamfer and take naps.
I won't be a button pushing monkey if i do this so i'm wondering if i could get away with something like a g0704/bf-20 sized mill. I have played with programs a little so i'm confident there. The largest low tolerance part i can see me messing with would be a 80% lower or 1911 sights/dovetails for myself but most of the ideas i want to make are smaller and 1 to maybe 5 thousandth off would be ok. Obviously i'll have a lot to learn but would like to make my own parts other than ball screws and will have to order an extra saddle or farm that out to convert to cnc. Just doing a cost analysis and going rather cheap i'm at 3 times the cost of the g0704 in tooling not even counting the conversion. Then add in ball screws and electronics for 4 axis and it sounds dumb. The rf45 is more capable but the cnc cost goes up alot and tooling a little even though the machine is only %50 or so more unless you go IH size. I'm looking at it as the smaller mill is limited but would allow me to learn while being easier to work on plus i could carry the tooling over to anything larger in the future. Some of the limitations should be more easily fixable than on the larger bf45 if you take the size in consideration. I just want to be able to do prototyping ,limited production and learn on a garage toy. I know neither would be a leblond, haas, makino ,fadel, hardinge etc vmc. I guess i ask those who have done it or know what you are doing would i be wasting my time and $4-6,000? |
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When I was just getting started and had 4-6k to spend. I bought one just like this.
http://www.hoffhilk.net/cgi-bin/mnlist.cgi?hoffhilk45/37 |
That is just being mean if they are in good shape and going that cheap. 
I don't think that would fit well in my residential 9'H garage with underground service on a 200A panel either. Then getting it here and set up + tooling. I know my limits and they are much smaller. I wouldn't be buying it all at one time either. I need to learn how to crawl before i walk so to speak. You do have a nice shop and like the table. It's good to see people passing on knowledge. |
Thanks for the compliment. I wasn't trying to be mean, now I will.
That machine will fit under a 7' garage door, with a 9' ceiling no problem. I ran mine off of a 20hp rotary phase converter that did just fine on my residential 200 amp service. My wife slept while I was making parts. Our bedroom was just on the other side of the wall at the time. Milltronics still services those machines. If the control blows up it will cost you less than $2000 to completely rebuild it. You can get by with about six tool holders. Until you can afford more. I could talk you through your first few programs on any machine with a cent 5 control or newer. So easy to program a kid could do it. And unlike the Grizzly machine this one can actually cut metal. [rimshot] Seriously though. You know what would fit you best, and the kind of tolerances you would like to hold. If I was looking for a "bench top" type machine I would be looking for one that had a 3 axis CNC control on it. There are a few software packages to get you up and running pretty quickly. You'll always be able to use it as a manual machine for the quick jobs. |
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Take a look at Industrial Hobbies. They sell a manual RF45 type machine (it's bigger and heavier) and CNC versions, too. I've heard no complaints about their manual machines, but after the original company founder died they appear to have problems getting CNC conversion parts out in a timely way. But who knows, that might be fixed by now.
Even if you don't like their machines, their web site has lots of information worth reading and downloading, such as the home built work center cabinet. The other seller to check out is Quality Machine and their Precision Matthews line. They sell an RF 45 type and a line of X3/RF 20 size mills that come with a built in VFD. |
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Quoted:
Thanks for the compliment. I wasn't trying to be mean, now I will.
That machine will fit under a 7' garage door, with a 9' ceiling no problem. I ran mine off of a 20hp rotary phase converter that did just fine on my residential 200 amp service. My wife slept while I was making parts. Our bedroom was just on the other side of the wall at the time. Milltronics still services those machines. If the control blows up it will cost you less than $2000 to completely rebuild it. You can get by with about six tool holders. Until you can afford more. I could talk you through your first few programs on any machine with a cent 5 control or newer. So easy to program a kid could do it. And unlike the Grizzly machine this one can actually cut metal. [rimshot] Seriously though. You know what would fit you best, and the kind of tolerances you would like to hold. If I was looking for a "bench top" type machine I would be looking for one that had a 3 axis CNC control on it. There are a few software packages to get you up and running pretty quickly. You'll always be able to use it as a manual machine for the quick jobs. Only 2 grand for the drivers you say? I think that and the electric bill from the converter would make my cardiologist unhappy. Having something like that to make a mill the size i'm looking for with linear rails would be great and a lot better than chicom but would also blow my budget all to hell. It would be really sweet though and 10x better in the long haul. I've never had my hands on any of these machines i'm looking at so i'm going off what i read. I do know the x2,x3 rf30 are sad. Hell the one's i'm looking at seem sad also but i think i could learn alot while efficiently making my ideas happen. It would be nice if i could get a discount and they keep the little stand if i go for the smaller one i'm favoring. I'll mostly be doing aluminum parts and there are some mods that should help. Still looking into the servo and stepper verses cost deal also. I figure when i get my hands on one and see what it's made of i'll make that decision. I do plan on 4 axis. Being a noob though i think learning set ups and methods are what i should focus on first. I can draw parts but the cam and gcode i haven't done. It will definitely be a long process and i'm not in a hurry. Mach3 seems to be a recommended controller program. I will have to look into other cad program as well since a license is really expensive for what i've been using. Here is what i'm looking at getting tortured. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5kNJ8LLhePs |
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