Armory Sponsor
Posted: 7/30/2013 1:26:47 PM EDT
| Should these be bolted down? It's 3500lbs, are you not losing fire resistance in Lieu of perceived increase in theft? Looking at going with one of these and keeping my liberty rsc for a few cheaper rifles, |
|
Should these be bolted down? It's 3500lbs !!! Wow !!! 3500 lbs! Man, I think you could just velcro that down to the carpet and it would be fine!  Unless you are worried there are some pretty sophisticated crooks checkin' your place out and doing some major planning...I doubt you have to worry.
|
|
I am pretty sure those do not come with factory bolt holes so you need to specify on the order, assuming it is a special order, and there is an extra charge as I recall from the AMSEC price sheet.
The AMSEC Safeguy should be along shortly to answer any questions. It is always safer to bolt down and my TL which is slightly heavier than the RF6528 was moved in by two men. In theory, two men in two men out! |
|
Quoted:
Should these be bolted down? It's 3500lbs, are you not losing fire resistance in Lieu of perceived increase in theft? Looking at going with one of these and keeping my liberty rsc for a few cheaper rifles, Think about it this way. A 3500 LB safe has to be on the main floor where the installers can roll and place for the most part. Perhaps a basement or Garage. If they can get it in in less than an hour, which will likely be the case, someone can just as easily get it out unless you change the room layout/security. In my mind, it would be foolish to buy a safe of that caliber for less than 50K of items. I also think it would be foolish to purchase that safe and not have insurance. If your insurance is OK with it not bolted down, then I say go for it. Quality gun insurance is dirt cheap compared to jewelry or other insurance. Investing in a uber-safe is almost a fools errand compared to the cost of insurance unless you have some super expensive items. Think about buying a small high end tl30 safe that can be well hidden deep in your house bolted down for your valuables and a separate bulky gun safe for guns. |
|
You can get a TL-30 delivered and installed for under $5000 in many situations, an upgraded Sturdy or Ft Knox will easily run $4000. The extra $1000 gets you an exponential jump in security. This kind of weight is not for everyone, there are drawbacks.
I mentioned my TL was moved in by two men, they jacked up the pallet with a pallet jack, pull, push, tug, they could not get it to move, One said to the other, "I told you we needed the walkie" (which is a powered electric pallet jack), they finally got it but it was not easy. When I said two men in, two out, it wasn't easy for them. |
|
Quoted:
You can get a TL-30 delivered and installed for under $5000 in many situations, an upgraded Sturdy or Ft Knox will easily run $4000. The extra $1000 gets you an exponential jump in security. This kind of weight is not for everyone, there are drawbacks. I mentioned my TL was moved in by two men, they jacked up the pallet with a pallet jack, pull, push, tug, they could not get it to move, One said to the other, "I told you we needed the walkie" (which is a powered electric pallet jack), they finally got it but it was not easy. When I said two men in, two out, it wasn't easy for them. Thats kinda my point. Are you better off with a nearly impenetrable vault in your garage or a Lighter RSC bolted to an interior closet/basement totally out of sight of contractors, friends, UPS guy, etc. Could they get to your safe with preplanning, a crow bar, and a forklift in 15 minutes? |
|
Two guys can move it out with the correct equipment in short order (depending on the obstacles blocking their clear path).
With a towtruck, it will be out in 5 minutes; albeit, a little noisy. If your house is in a city or dense suburban residential area surrounded by neighbors, yanking your safe with a towtruck cable might garner unwanted attention. If you are in a rural location there is increased vulnerability. Even if it is not removed from your house, the ability to lay it down facilitates an attack on the safe. A prudent person would probably always bolt down anything (if at all possible), as it does reduce potential losses. Fire protection is not reduced by anchor bolt holes, which are essentially being sealed by the bolts and washers, and are located on the bottom of the safe, which has the least exposure to fire and heat. |
|
Well that kills the idea of taking one from stock. It would be a special order, hope amsec is not taking long. Guys I had ordered a summit ds60, came with a paint issue. Since I am looking at 5-6 months for a replacement I started rethinking my security needs. The rf6528 is only $400 more than the summit ds60, yes it's a lot bigger, but...
As far as value in the safe, add up the replacement costs for your 5 most expensive firearms, it does not take much to get to $6k. I do have a separate insurance policy but I would rather not lose firearms, many cant be replaced as far as type and most importantly condition. I live in the burbs, so guys dragging a 3500 lbs safe out of my garage will get some attention. Thanks for the feedback |
|
I usually tell people that all safes should be bolted, and all safes less than 1,000 pounds must be bolted. Even then, very residential customers do. A good portion of our commercial customers do, because not doing so may prevent the insurance company from paying in the event of a loss. We install safes of similar weight in jewelry stores, banks, department stores, etc. They are usually left up on blocks, and not bolted. It is very rare for them to walk off.
Your typical residential burglar isn't going to make much progress on a safe like this. I'm a small guy, and I make moving them easy. The difference is I have the experience and the equipment to make it look easier than it is. This isn't exactly the type of safe you're going to flip into the back of a pick up and drive off with. Now if they steal a tow truck and back it through your garage door, then that's another story. 
AMSEC is running 8 to 12 weeks on special orders at the moment. |
|
Quoted:
Well that kills the idea of taking one from stock. It would be a special order, hope amsec is not taking long. Guys I had ordered a summit ds60, came with a paint issue. Since I am looking at 5-6 months for a replacement I started rethinking my security needs. The rf6528 is only $400 more than the summit ds60, yes it's a lot bigger, but... As far as value in the safe, add up the replacement costs for your 5 most expensive firearms, it does not take much to get to $6k. I do have a separate insurance policy but I would rather not lose firearms, many cant be replaced as far as type and most importantly condition. I live in the burbs, so guys dragging a 3500 lbs safe out of my garage will get some attention. Thanks for the feedback The odds are overwhelmingly stacked in favor that nothing will ever happen to it. I'm sure its something like 99.9% safes are never touched throughout there life. I am not trying to derail, just still addressing the Why TL30 argument. If you had a bag of gold I could see it, but I'd still buy two safes. I think you are more likely to outgrow your safe than to have it messed with. I don't think 6K or 10K or even 50K is worth messing around with the baggage of a 3500 LB safe. The reason average joe millionaire buys a TL30 vs Tl15 vs RSC has alot to do with the fact that he gets a huge premium discount on expensive jewelry insurance. Gun insurance is about a quarter of the cost of jewelry insurance. Its about $40/year per ten thousand. I know some have sentimental value etc, but so do many things I have around the house that aren't secured. My wifes engagement ring cost more than all the non nfa black rifles you could cram in that tiny safe. This is Graffunders guide which is very rational. I think you should consider if you are buying into the security hype or if you really have any need for that. The next step is I would look at local ads. I see tl-15/30 pop up quite often. VALUE OF CONTENTS RECOMMENDED RATING Up to $50,000.00 USD B - RATE $50,000.00 to $200,000.00 C - RATE $200,000.00 to $500,000.00 E - RATE (TL-15 Equivalent) $500,000.00 to $1,000,000.00 F - RATE (TL-30 Equivalent) I imagine that 6528 ends up being 6-7K by the time you have it delivered. You might take a look at Brown and Graffunder and see if they compare. |
|
Quoted:
If you've got the money why not go with something rated TL30x6? Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile Not only the money but a residense that can support that much weight. I live in a home with a concrete slab foundation and I would definitely check with the home builder or a structural engineer before trying to put something that massively heavy in my home. Perhaps as technology evolves they will come up with composite fill materials that will reduce the weights of the TL rated safes thereby one day a 3500 pound safe may come in at 2700 pounds. |
| Thanks for the feedback, I am looking at it this way, if te summit costs 5k installed and the 6528 costs 5400 installed which one do you want? As for the weight I believe concrete for my garage slab is at least 3000 psi compression strength, this safe has a footprint of 35x29.5 so that's about 3lbs per square inch. It gets complicated as the front of the safe will need to be shimmed up 5/8" to be level so that means the psi load will increase a lot as the entire load will be on the back 1" and the front edges and middle. |
|
Quoted:
Thanks for the feedback, I am looking at it this way, if te summit costs 5k installed and the 6528 costs 5400 installed which one do you want? As for the weight I believe concrete for my garage slab is at least 3000 psi compression strength, this safe has a footprint of 35x29.5 so that's about 3lbs per square inch. It gets complicated as the front of the safe will need to be shimmed up 5/8" to be level so that means the psi load will increase a lot as the entire load will be on the back 1" and the front edges and middle. It has more to do with you space needs than anything. 6528 is a tiny safe. Maybe 12 -15 rifles comfortably 20-25 stacked in there with gunsocks and no organization. What was wrong with your denali? |
|
Spending 5k on an RSC (any brand) seems like a complete waste of money given the real safes that are available in that price range. If you ever plan on moving with the safe, the RF will become even more expensive in terms of your total cost of ownership. For a garage safe, I like the idea of the much better security of the RF, but I would still bolt it down.
If you don't have a lot of irreplaceable guns or other valuables like cash and jewlery, that heavy safe is probably overkill for a residential gun safe. However, nothing wrong with overkill when it comes to security. You are getting less usable space, despite the high purchase price, so that is something to consider in the analysis. Quoted:
Thanks for the feedback, I am looking at it this way, if te summit costs 5k installed and the 6528 costs 5400 installed which one do you want? As for the weight I believe concrete for my garage slab is at least 3000 psi compression strength, this safe has a footprint of 35x29.5 so that's about 3lbs per square inch. It gets complicated as the front of the safe will need to be shimmed up 5/8" to be level so that means the psi load will increase a lot as the entire load will be on the back 1" and the front edges and middle. |
|
Quoted:
The odds are overwhelmingly stacked in favor that nothing will ever happen to it. I'm sure its something like 99.9% safes are never touched throughout there life. I am not trying to derail, just still addressing the Why TL30 argument. If you had a bag of gold I could see it, but I'd still buy two safes. I think you are more likely to outgrow your safe than to have it messed with. I don't think 6K or 10K or even 50K is worth messing around with the baggage of a 3500 LB safe. The reason average joe millionaire buys a TL30 vs Tl15 vs RSC has alot to do with the fact that he gets a huge premium discount on expensive jewelry insurance. Gun insurance is about a quarter of the cost of jewelry insurance. Its about $40/year per ten thousand. I know some have sentimental value etc, but so do many things I have around the house that aren't secured. My wifes engagement ring cost more than all the non nfa black rifles you could cram in that tiny safe. This is Graffunders guide which is very rational. I think you should consider if you are buying into the security hype or if you really have any need for that. The next step is I would look at local ads. I see tl-15/30 pop up quite often. VALUE OF CONTENTS RECOMMENDED RATING Up to $50,000.00 USD B - RATE $50,000.00 to $200,000.00 C - RATE $200,000.00 to $500,000.00 E - RATE (TL-15 Equivalent) $500,000.00 to $1,000,000.00 F - RATE (TL-30 Equivalent) I imagine that 6528 ends up being 6-7K by the time you have it delivered. You might take a look at Brown and Graffunder and see if they compare. Quoted:
Quoted:
Well that kills the idea of taking one from stock. It would be a special order, hope amsec is not taking long. Guys I had ordered a summit ds60, came with a paint issue. Since I am looking at 5-6 months for a replacement I started rethinking my security needs. The rf6528 is only $400 more than the summit ds60, yes it's a lot bigger, but... As far as value in the safe, add up the replacement costs for your 5 most expensive firearms, it does not take much to get to $6k. I do have a separate insurance policy but I would rather not lose firearms, many cant be replaced as far as type and most importantly condition. I live in the burbs, so guys dragging a 3500 lbs safe out of my garage will get some attention. Thanks for the feedback The odds are overwhelmingly stacked in favor that nothing will ever happen to it. I'm sure its something like 99.9% safes are never touched throughout there life. I am not trying to derail, just still addressing the Why TL30 argument. If you had a bag of gold I could see it, but I'd still buy two safes. I think you are more likely to outgrow your safe than to have it messed with. I don't think 6K or 10K or even 50K is worth messing around with the baggage of a 3500 LB safe. The reason average joe millionaire buys a TL30 vs Tl15 vs RSC has alot to do with the fact that he gets a huge premium discount on expensive jewelry insurance. Gun insurance is about a quarter of the cost of jewelry insurance. Its about $40/year per ten thousand. I know some have sentimental value etc, but so do many things I have around the house that aren't secured. My wifes engagement ring cost more than all the non nfa black rifles you could cram in that tiny safe. This is Graffunders guide which is very rational. I think you should consider if you are buying into the security hype or if you really have any need for that. The next step is I would look at local ads. I see tl-15/30 pop up quite often. VALUE OF CONTENTS RECOMMENDED RATING Up to $50,000.00 USD B - RATE $50,000.00 to $200,000.00 C - RATE $200,000.00 to $500,000.00 E - RATE (TL-15 Equivalent) $500,000.00 to $1,000,000.00 F - RATE (TL-30 Equivalent) I imagine that 6528 ends up being 6-7K by the time you have it delivered. You might take a look at Brown and Graffunder and see if they compare. Good point but the graffunder b costs more than either safe, a lot more. The Denali is a rsc. If the body was 1/4" instead of 3/16 it would be a "B" rated safe. |
|
Quoted:
I am pretty sure those do not come with factory bolt holes so you need to specify on the order, assuming it is a special order, and there is an extra charge as I recall from the AMSEC price sheet. The AMSEC Safeguy should be along shortly to answer any questions. It is always safer to bolt down and my TL which is slightly heavier than the RF6528 was moved in by two men. In theory, two men in two men out! I am now being censored by the mods here. I can't say anything nice about the products my company produces any more. It seems that they are trying to force me to buy an advertising license. At this point anything I say in a positive light will be construed as advertising now. I'm not here to represent the company, so I guess I am just one of the guys now. So... have fun guys. I guess I am of no value anymore, and I'll be damned if I am buying a license so I can help other people and educate... |
|
Quoted:
I am now being censored by the mods here. I can't say anything nice about the products my company produces any more. It seems that they are trying to force me to buy an advertising license. At this point anything I say in a positive light will be construed as advertising now. I'm not here to represent the company, so I guess I am just one of the guys now. So... have fun guys. I guess I am of no value anymore, and I'll be damned if I am buying a license so I can help other people and educate... Quoted:
Quoted:
I am pretty sure those do not come with factory bolt holes so you need to specify on the order, assuming it is a special order, and there is an extra charge as I recall from the AMSEC price sheet. The AMSEC Safeguy should be along shortly to answer any questions. It is always safer to bolt down and my TL which is slightly heavier than the RF6528 was moved in by two men. In theory, two men in two men out! I am now being censored by the mods here. I can't say anything nice about the products my company produces any more. It seems that they are trying to force me to buy an advertising license. At this point anything I say in a positive light will be construed as advertising now. I'm not here to represent the company, so I guess I am just one of the guys now. So... have fun guys. I guess I am of no value anymore, and I'll be damned if I am buying a license so I can help other people and educate... What a bunch of shinola, you have contributed mote to this forum in the last month then I have seen in the last 5 years. |
|
Quoted:
What a bunch of shinola, you have contributed mote to this forum in the last month then I have seen in the last 5 years. Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
I am pretty sure those do not come with factory bolt holes so you need to specify on the order, assuming it is a special order, and there is an extra charge as I recall from the AMSEC price sheet. The AMSEC Safeguy should be along shortly to answer any questions. It is always safer to bolt down and my TL which is slightly heavier than the RF6528 was moved in by two men. In theory, two men in two men out! I am now being censored by the mods here. I can't say anything nice about the products my company produces any more. It seems that they are trying to force me to buy an advertising license. At this point anything I say in a positive light will be construed as advertising now. I'm not here to represent the company, so I guess I am just one of the guys now. So... have fun guys. I guess I am of no value anymore, and I'll be damned if I am buying a license so I can help other people and educate... What a bunch of shinola, you have contributed mote to this forum in the last month then I have seen in the last 5 years. I agree. |
|
Quoted:
I am now being censored by the mods here. I can't say anything nice about the products my company produces any more. It seems that they are trying to force me to buy an advertising license. At this point anything I say in a positive light will be construed as advertising now. I'm not here to represent the company, so I guess I am just one of the guys now. So... have fun guys. I guess I am of no value anymore, and I'll be damned if I am buying a license so I can help other people and educate... Quoted:
Quoted:
I am pretty sure those do not come with factory bolt holes so you need to specify on the order, assuming it is a special order, and there is an extra charge as I recall from the AMSEC price sheet. The AMSEC Safeguy should be along shortly to answer any questions. It is always safer to bolt down and my TL which is slightly heavier than the RF6528 was moved in by two men. In theory, two men in two men out! I am now being censored by the mods here. I can't say anything nice about the products my company produces any more. It seems that they are trying to force me to buy an advertising license. At this point anything I say in a positive light will be construed as advertising now. I'm not here to represent the company, so I guess I am just one of the guys now. So... have fun guys. I guess I am of no value anymore, and I'll be damned if I am buying a license so I can help other people and educate... This should be encouraged not chastised. Its very disappointing. I sincerely appreciate all you have offered and hope you can figure out an arrangement. People come to the site to seek out knowledge, experience, and expertise. Somehow the site views that as a threat to their commercial structure. Hopefully they will figure out that advertising $$$ follows good experiences. It is not done on the come... |
|
I am now being censored by the mods here. I can't say anything nice about the products my company produces any more. It seems that they are trying to force me to buy an advertising license. At this point anything I say in a positive light will be construed as advertising now. I'm not here to represent the company, so I guess I am just one of the guys now. So... have fun guys. I guess I am of no value anymore, and I'll be damned if I am buying a license so I can help other people and educate... Not to hijack this thread but I would like to thank "The Safe Guy" for his willingness to freely give out information that has clearly take him a very long time to accumulate. Please keep posting, don't mention brand names or the like...WE DON"T CARE! The insight you share is so helpful to many of us, even if you keep it very general, we still learn a great deal. Just as a side note, even if someone wants to try to take what is being shared as "advertising"...I think it is worth noting that his company's competitors are probably listening in as well. This informaton not only helps us here on ARF...but it may just improve the industry as a whole...even if only to a small degree! That kind of attitude in corporate America is rare indeed! |
|
Quoted:
Not to hijack this thread but I would like to thank "The Safe Guy" for his willingness to freely give out information that has clearly take him a very long time to accumulate. Please keep posting, don't mention brand names or the like...WE DON"T CARE! The insight you share is so helpful to many of us, even if you keep it very general, we still learn a great deal. Just as a side note, even if someone wants to try to take what is being shared as "advertising"...I think it is worth noting that his company's competitors are probably listening in as well. This informaton not only helps us here on ARF...but it may just improve the industry as a whole...even if only to a small degree! That kind of attitude in corporate America is rare indeed! Quoted:
I am now being censored by the mods here. I can't say anything nice about the products my company produces any more. It seems that they are trying to force me to buy an advertising license. At this point anything I say in a positive light will be construed as advertising now. I'm not here to represent the company, so I guess I am just one of the guys now. So... have fun guys. I guess I am of no value anymore, and I'll be damned if I am buying a license so I can help other people and educate... Not to hijack this thread but I would like to thank "The Safe Guy" for his willingness to freely give out information that has clearly take him a very long time to accumulate. Please keep posting, don't mention brand names or the like...WE DON"T CARE! The insight you share is so helpful to many of us, even if you keep it very general, we still learn a great deal. Just as a side note, even if someone wants to try to take what is being shared as "advertising"...I think it is worth noting that his company's competitors are probably listening in as well. This informaton not only helps us here on ARF...but it may just improve the industry as a whole...even if only to a small degree! That kind of attitude in corporate America is rare indeed! I totally agree. |
|
The truth of the matter is that you can not have anybody with serious expertise that is not "advertising" a product. As a professional safe guy, I can tell you that guys like The Safeguy are rare. I belong to two securitiy forums, and we do not have anybody with his experience posting in either one. The one engineer we did have stopped participating a few years back. To have somebody with his experience, posting in public none the less, is quite the opportunity. Not only is it an opportunity for the current members who can benefit from his experience, but also an opportunity to the forum as a whole, as people researching this topic will be brought here through Google searches. This is the same reason some of the "fan boys" post about their products of choice, exclusively, on multiple forums.
Assuming that Safeguy obtains a vendor account, do you think he would still be interested in answering questions about other competing products, let alone do so in a positive manner? I know that if I had to have such an account, I would be using it to my full advantage, by only endorsing my products. I participate in these forums because I'm into firearms, and know much less about them than many of the other participants. I figured since they are willing to freely share their expertise, one of the ways I can make up for their contributions is to offer mine on subjects that I'm familiar with. I won't speak for Safeguy, but I suspect he is similar to me in this regard. We both come from different backgrounds in the industry, and both do different things within that industry. This means we may have different opinions, different experience, and different advice. However, we both have the same desire to educate others on the topics we have experience in. It would be a shame to loose his input. |
|
Quoted:
So we looked at the rf6528 and are leaning towards getting this safe. Any issues with keeping it on 4x4 to keep it off the concrete? The dealer said I would be fine. Good god nothing else comes close in a "gun safe". If its a FEW hundred more then its a slam dunk. I keep mine on 6x6's for a little more height and some storage space below. |
|
We very rarely place these safes directly on the floor, usually because it's more complicated and makes leveling the safe more difficult. It is not uncommon for us to leave them on wood blocks. When I do this, I try to add blocking to make it difficult to simply roll a pallet jack beneath it. Doing it this way increases the weight on the smaller footprint of the blocks, so your concrete floor has to be solid.
Instead of using two longer blocks on the sides, we use four smaller blocks. This makes leveling the safe easier. Depending on how level the safe is, we will use either steel or wood shims. If you're careful when placing the blocks, it's easy to attach trim around it to give it a finished look. |
| That's exactly how they suggested the install, they said they will recess the wood blocks about 3/8" so I could attach plywood around the base and paint it black to match. Sound like a good way to go. The wife was also sold on this safe for the fire protection, hope to have it in a couple wks. Very impressed with this safe plus got the wife approval. |
|
Quoted:
That's exactly how they suggested the install, they said they will recess the wood blocks about 3/8" so I could attach plywood around the base and paint it black to match. Sound like a good way to go. The wife was also sold on this safe for the fire protection, hope to have it in a couple wks. Very impressed with this safe plus got the wife approval. Glad you found one that works and congratulations on getting a real safe. I have seen this safe in person it is really nice. |
|
I have the original prototype RF safe in my home. You would all be jealous to see the inside. It's made with tan suede covering on the entire interior, including the walls and back, and the door and back panel have mirrors inset in the stitched triangular pattern. I would love to take a few shots for you, but I think it's foolish to show the world the insides of your safe and advertise what your collection looks like. Connecting the dots between your identity and your valuables is far too easy today. Less is more when it comes to security. Go ahead, get on Facebook, Twitter and all those other social media sites, make it easy to find you, then go somewhere else (like here) and boast about the valuable toys you have... DUH, are you stupid? I have my RF sitting on 4x6's. I ran one cut to the right length in the front, between the ones running front-to-back on either side. I ran drilled counter-bored holes thru the side boards and put in three big 3/8 inch lag bolts pining the sides to the front board. The boards are inset about 1/2 inch all around. We had just laid new carpet, so I took some carpet scraps and cut a long strip and stapled it onto the face of the riser boards in one long run. The platform looks real natural and almost disappears into the flooring. |
|
Quoted:
I have the original prototype RF safe in my home. You would all be jealous to see the inside. It's made with tan suede covering on the entire interior, including the walls and back, and the door and back panel have mirrors inset in the stitched triangular pattern. I would love to take a few shots for you, but I think it's foolish to show the world the insides of your safe and advertise what your collection looks like. Connecting the dots between your identity and your valuables is far too easy today. Less is more when it comes to security. Go ahead, get on Facebook, Twitter and all those other social media sites, make it easy to find you, then go somewhere else (like here) and boast about the valuable toys you have... DUH, are you stupid? I have my RF sitting on 4x6's. I ran one cut to the right length in the front, between the ones running front-to-back on either side. I ran drilled counter-bored holes thru the side boards and put in three big 3/8 inch lag bolts pining the sides to the front board. The boards are inset about 1/2 inch all around. We had just laid new carpet, so I took some carpet scraps and cut a long strip and stapled it onto the face of the riser boards in one long run. The platform looks real natural and almost disappears into the flooring. That sounds nice, since I have every rifle in gun socks (sack ups) I just pack they in tightly. Yeah, it's not as cool looking and it's a pain to get the one in the back but I don't show this to people and getting max capacity is my primary concern. |
|
Quoted:
That sounds nice, since I have every rifle in gun socks (sack ups) I just pack they in tightly. Yeah, it's not as cool looking and it's a pain to get the one in the back but I don't show this to people and getting max capacity is my primary concern. Yea, All my long guns are in gun socks too. I can nearly double the capacity in a given rack area by stacking then guns, some barrel down, so they nest. |
Armory Sponsor