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[ARCHIVED THREAD] - For you 10mm guys! 400 Legend (Page 1 of 2)
Posted: 2/2/2023 1:55:19 AM EDT
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https://saami.org/wp-content/uploads/2023/01/Public-Introduction-400-Legend-2023-01-30.pdf Better start saving those 10mm bullets. Looks like a 6.8 bolt and a regular AR mag. Another rebated rim case that you will not be able to convert to this. I am surprised they didn't release this at Shot?? https://saami.org/wp-content/uploads/2023/01/Public-Introduction-400-Legend-2023-01-30.pdf link made hot. dryflash3 |
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Quoted: Neato. I’m guessing it’s yet another cartridge aimed at the straight wall hunting states, although it’s a little late to the party. Yep, right in between 450 Bushmaster and 350 Legend. If the cases are readily available might be a good basis for some wildcats although not much different than 6.8. |
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Quoted: Why would I want this if I have 458S? I guess if you wanted projectile interchangeability, maybe. I guess another offering is never a bad thing. It is intended for hunting in straightwall restricted zones. If you don't have that requirement it prolly serves no purpose for you. |
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Quoted: Meh… if I wanted a 6.8 size bolt head gun, it would be 338 spectre. That's a really nice cartridge that needs more traction. There are one or two states that it meets hunting requirements for as well as just in general being a nice step up from 300blk in performance. |
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Quoted: I guess you gotta make money somehow.. Wonder if we’re getting a new .400 bullet? Who’s the brain child of this? The SAAMI page lists Winchester-Olin. 215gr @ 2,230 fps. Don't think I've seen a 215gr bullet for 10mm so likely something new made for the cartridge. They get this to market fast enough I'd be happy to test it on a deer next winter. |
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Quoted: The SAAMI page lists Winchester-Olin. 215gr @ 2,230 fps. Don't think I've seen a 215gr bullet for 10mm so likely something new made for the cartridge. They get this to market fast enough I'd be happy to test it on a deer next winter. Also 200 gr plated from extreme work well in 10mm. But these are non expanding bullets. |
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(Apparently this was not a me-too subsonic entry, but a different mission statement. See below.) |
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Quoted: I would say introducing the 5th iteration of yet another AR15 subsonic round that caters best to a rifle configuration that just got banned, probably isn't going to be home-run they were hoping for. Quoted: I would say introducing the 5th iteration of yet another AR15 subsonic round that caters best to a rifle configuration that just got banned, probably isn't going to be home-run they were hoping for. The SAAMI page lists Winchester-Olin. 215gr @ 2,230 fps. |
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Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: I would say introducing the 5th iteration of yet another AR15 subsonic round that caters best to a rifle configuration that just got banned, probably isn't going to be home-run they were hoping for. The SAAMI page lists Winchester-Olin. 215gr @ 2,230 fps. (see bellow) |
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Quoted: The case could almost be just a preliminary step in the manufacture of 6.8 cases. That’s exactly what the basic brass is. Attached File Quoted: ? That makes it even more pointless, IMHO. Straightwalled hunting restricted states |
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Seems silly… it’s a straight walled hunting cartridge right between .450BM and .350L. But Why? .350 legend gives you capacity and ease of suppression (Large 9mm Cans) .450 bushmaster brings the thump and can use beefy .45 cans. Does it do anything better than eiither of these have been doing for years? Is there a bunch of better bullets in .40/10mm for carbine velocities? |
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Quoted: That’s exactly what the basic brass is. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/129950/1D6135EB-E5B2-462D-BD19-C3C0ABE06355_png-2698885.JPG Straightwalled hunting restricted states Quoted: Quoted: The case could almost be just a preliminary step in the manufacture of 6.8 cases. That’s exactly what the basic brass is. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/129950/1D6135EB-E5B2-462D-BD19-C3C0ABE06355_png-2698885.JPG Quoted: ? That makes it even more pointless, IMHO. Straightwalled hunting restricted states Ah. Didn't know that was a thing. Wait, that's a thing? How is that a thing? Edit to update: Well learn something new. Several good hunting states apparently do this, due to population density. And with that, the race is on for a good straight wall hunting case. Which, in all honesty, this actually is probably going to be pretty good at. So.. cool. |
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Hopefully it will not be as temperamental as the 350. Being the lower psi will help. The larger capacity will move the powder speed up to more powders that will work. My guess is 4198 and 1680 is going to be the powder of choice. This has more appeal to me than the 360bh or the 350 L. I might have a barrel spun up for my Ruger American. |
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Quoted: Seems silly… it’s a straight walled hunting cartridge right between .450BM and .350L. But Why? .350 legend gives you capacity and ease of suppression (Large 9mm Cans) .450 bushmaster brings the thump and can use beefy .45 cans. Does it do anything better than eiither of these have been doing for years? Is there a bunch of better bullets in .40/10mm for carbine velocities? Well, you know how gunnies are. There is no "need" for a 41 Magnum either, and yet there it is. If there is a gap, even only a perceived gap, someone will want to fill it  |
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Quoted: The case could almost be just a preliminary step in the manufacture of 6.8 cases. Unfortunately not, due to the case dimensions. The rim is the diameter of 6.8 but the head is the diameter of 7.62x39. That allows them to get the proper case taper for feeding, without having to deal with the problem of 7.62x39 bolts and their lack of metal. They did the same thing with .350 Legend, used the rim diameter of 5.56 NATO but the head diameter of 5.45x39. In both cases you can't use any basic brass to form the new Legend cases, and you can't really use the Legend brass to make anything else. You're stuck with whatever Winchester is willing to provide the market. |
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Quoted: Seems silly… it’s a straight walled hunting cartridge right between .450BM and .350L. But Why? .350 legend gives you capacity and ease of suppression (Large 9mm Cans) .450 bushmaster brings the thump and can use beefy .45 cans. Does it do anything better than eiither of these have been doing for years? Is there a bunch of better bullets in .40/10mm for carbine velocities? Cool, we can now bring the .40S&W argument to rifles  I can see the desire for some to split the difference of the two.... I don't know that there will be any groundbreaking with the cartridge, but I'm looking at it more like "why not?" |
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Quoted: None, yet. Might be an interesting parent case for something .264 or .277. This is just a thought experiment. Quoted: Quoted: What wildcats do you have in mind that are based on the 350L case? None, yet. Might be an interesting parent case for something .264 or .277. This is just a thought experiment. I'd like .257 actually. A little hotter .25-223. |
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Quoted: A 25x68 is just that and a super easy wildcat (straight neck down). I have one. But requires a 6.8 bolt. If I’m looking at this correctly, a .350 L based wildcat could use a 5.56 bolt AND get a bump in capacity, which is usually and either/or. How many grains that is, I don’t know. Just looking at the external dimensions, I would think it to be quite modest. |
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Quoted: But requires a 6.8 bolt. If I’m looking at this correctly, a .350 L based wildcat could use a 5.56 bolt AND get a bump in capacity, which is usually and either/or. How many grains that is, I don’t know. Just looking at the external dimensions, I would think it to be quite modest. Quoted: Quoted: A 25x68 is just that and a super easy wildcat (straight neck down). I have one. But requires a 6.8 bolt. If I’m looking at this correctly, a .350 L based wildcat could use a 5.56 bolt AND get a bump in capacity, which is usually and either/or. How many grains that is, I don’t know. Just looking at the external dimensions, I would think it to be quite modest. You could neck up a 22 Nosler. Seems like less work. |
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Quoted: Lots of really good bullets in .400/.401 to run hard. Federal Fusion SP, Swift A-Frame, and the (seemingly) rare Trophy Bond. None of which are exactly "common" to come across as components these days but that's always subject to change. I think this will be a good cartridge for the straightwall hunting states. Just have to get it to market with some support. AR barrel and magazine availability are key, if Winchester kicked in a little somewhere to make that happen it would boost the cartridge a lot. |
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Quoted: Lots of really good bullets in .400/.401 to run hard. Federal Fusion SP, Swift A-Frame, and the (seemingly) rare Trophy Bond. None of which are exactly "common" to come across as components these days but that's always subject to change. Those are all handgun bullets right? I was trying to think of a 40 cal rifle round and couldn't. I see a bunch of dangerous game heavy bullets in .410 for the 450/400 but that's a whole other world. |
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Quoted: Those are all handgun bullets right? I was trying to think of a 40 cal rifle round and couldn't. I see a bunch of dangerous game heavy bullets in .410 for the 450/400 but that's a whole other world. Quoted: Quoted: Lots of really good bullets in .400/.401 to run hard. Federal Fusion SP, Swift A-Frame, and the (seemingly) rare Trophy Bond. None of which are exactly "common" to come across as components these days but that's always subject to change. Those are all handgun bullets right? I was trying to think of a 40 cal rifle round and couldn't. I see a bunch of dangerous game heavy bullets in .410 for the 450/400 but that's a whole other world. Yep. All essentially designed for 10mm. The A-Frame can be shot as fast as you want. They're basically indestructible. The Federal bullets would likely be less forgiving but fine for thin skinned game. I don't know if anyone has tested them at 2000+ FPS. |
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Quoted: Im in a forum with more than a few folk running 40 caliber smokeless muzzleloaders and finding bullets that can survive 2200-2400fps is very hard if not impossible Quoted: Quoted: Interesting. Are there good bullets for rifle velocities in available in .400? Im in a forum with more than a few folk running 40 caliber smokeless muzzleloaders and finding bullets that can survive 2200-2400fps is very hard if not impossible That ruins it for me then. There are already good bullet options for the 350 and 450, and it's hard enough to find those in stock. I went through the reloading section of a decent sized store and the bullet selection is still pretty weak when it came to hunting bullets in calibers I normally keep an eye on. |
[ARCHIVED THREAD] - For you 10mm guys! 400 Legend (Page 1 of 2)
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