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Posted: 8/14/2013 8:44:41 PM EDT
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Have my setup for .45 ACP
Going to be using 230 gr. LRN, Win WLP primers and Win 231 powder. Looking at starting load of 4.6 gr of powder with a COAL of 1.220" Sound right? |
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Quoted:
Have my setup for .45 ACP Going to be using 230 gr. LRN, Win WLP primers and Win 231 powder. Looking at starting load of 4.6 gr of powder with a COAL of 1.220" Sound right? I just shot a test run using 231 yesterday. Got good accuracy out of a 1911 Springfield and a H&K USP. Little over 5 grains of Win231, 230 grain plated Xtreme bullets, Winchester LP primer, coal 1.260. Same everything, but using 4.9 grains Bullseye gave very good results. |
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For the most common 230 gr LRN bullet style, to feed properly and to allow for enough bearing surface for a good taper crimp, you want to be about 1.250 OAL, 1.260 will probably work too. Leave enough surface for the taper crimp, but thats all. If 1.220 works for your bullet style and pistol, then ok, but that seems like it could be a little short.
(If the OAL is too long, the edge of the bearing surface will hang the bullet up and jam, or if really too long (if it manages to feed) can hit the rifling and not fully chamber the round.) W231 and Bullseye are excellent. Around 5 gr of W231 should work fine. You can try less and see how it cycles and shoots. If it works and you like it, thats what counts. Check with some published data to be safe. Bullseye is the original powder used in .45 ACP factory loads. For me its the best in that it is consistently accurate no matter what bullet type you use. I use 4.5 gr of Bullseye in the 230 LRN. You can find the load that works well for you. Bullseye burns a little dirty, so a lot of folks dont like it. The other criticism is you can double charge and not know it. Not if you follow proper safety procedure and check your powder charges.. If you are using a single stage press, view all the charged cases under a bright light in the loading block prior to bullet seating. Make sure all powder levels are uniform. If using a progressive press, make sure the charge bar is set correctly, powder charges double checked. Do not allow any distractions while reloading. |
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From here
230 GR. LRN Winchester 231 .452" 1.200" starting = 4.3 grains 699fps 12,200 CUP max = 5.3 grains 834fps 16,900 CUP Sounds good to me. Most all of the manufacturers have data on their websites... don't depend on us to verify it for you 
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Quoted:
From here Sounds good to me. Most all of the manufacturers have data on their websites... don't depend on us to verify it for you
Quoted:
From here 230 GR. LRN Winchester 231 .452" 1.200" starting = 4.3 grains 699fps 12,200 CUP max = 5.3 grains 834fps 16,900 CUP Sounds good to me. Most all of the manufacturers have data on their websites... don't depend on us to verify it for you
I pulled up that data from Hodgdon's website. They show COAL as 1.20. If I load to that length, the top most band is below the neck of the case. At 1.220, it's right at the top of the band. Just want to verify that I'm good with the 1.220 length. |
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Quoted:
I pulled up that data from Hodgdon's website. They show COAL as 1.20. If I load to that length, the top most band is below the neck of the case. At 1.220, it's right at the top of the band. Just want to verify that I'm good with the 1.220 length. Quoted:
Quoted:
From here 230 GR. LRN Winchester 231 .452" 1.200" starting = 4.3 grains 699fps 12,200 CUP max = 5.3 grains 834fps 16,900 CUP Sounds good to me. Most all of the manufacturers have data on their websites... don't depend on us to verify it for you
I pulled up that data from Hodgdon's website. They show COAL as 1.20. If I load to that length, the top most band is below the neck of the case. At 1.220, it's right at the top of the band. Just want to verify that I'm good with the 1.220 length. As long as it will run through your gun yes. Make up a dummy round, remove the barrel and drop the round into the chamber. It should fall right in and then out when you turn your barrel over. OAL is gun specific. |
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The problem you can have with COAL is that bullets of the same weight and type ( 230 gr LRN) can have different contours. Some have more base and less nose, some have more nose and a shorter base. So unless the contour of your bullet exactly matches that of the bullet pictured in the manual or used by another reloaded, you cannot make valid comparisons
Ideally the ogive of the bullet ( the point where the curve of the nose meets the flat of the bearing surface) should be about 1/32" above the case rim. You can look for the ogive by placing the side of the bullet against a straight edge and seeing where the curve starts. Many lead bullets have a "shoulder" instead of an ogive. Treat this shoulder just like the ogive: it should be 1/32" above the case rim. This gives you a surface to which you can apply your .002 taper crimp |
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Quoted:
I pulled up that data from Hodgdon's website. They show COAL as 1.20. If I load to that length, the top most band is below the neck of the case. At 1.220, it's right at the top of the band. Just want to verify that I'm good with the 1.220 length. Quoted:
Quoted:
From here 230 GR. LRN Winchester 231 .452" 1.200" starting = 4.3 grains 699fps 12,200 CUP max = 5.3 grains 834fps 16,900 CUP Sounds good to me. Most all of the manufacturers have data on their websites... don't depend on us to verify it for you
I pulled up that data from Hodgdon's website. They show COAL as 1.20. If I load to that length, the top most band is below the neck of the case. At 1.220, it's right at the top of the band. Just want to verify that I'm good with the 1.220 length. My .45's are loaded out to about 1.260 for lead round nose (although I don't use those anymore). |
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Quoted:
Readjusted. This is 1.245 COAL. It drop free into the chamber, spins freely and drops right back out. http://i.imgur.com/GnsAAz6.jpg Shoot it you must. Looks nice, let us know how well it does for you. |
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Ok Vacaduck, looks pretty good on OAL for the 230 LRN, as long as they feed from the mag ok.
What kind of a crimp do you have? You need the the case mouth "edge" intact and snug around the bullet, but not crimped or pressed into the lead too far. That is how it headspaces or seats on the inside end of the chamber. That requires a good taper crimp. |
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Quoted:
Ok Vacaduck, looks pretty good on OAL for the 230 LRN, as long as they feed from the mag ok. What kind of a crimp do you have? You need the the case mouth "edge" intact and snug around the bullet, but not crimped or pressed into the lead too far. That is how it headspaces or seats on the inside end of the chamber. That requires a good taper crimp. I'm using the Lee Carbide Three Die set. The seating die has a crimp adjustment on it. I assume it's a taper crimp. They feed out of my mags just fine. |
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Its hard to see from the pic, but looks a little like there is some lube or shaving at the case mouth, or slight over crimp. I could be wrong.
Assume after you expand and bell the case mouth, there is sufficient bell so that it doesn't shave any lube or lead upon seating the bullet. But not too much bell so that you overwork the brass. That is where it takes a litte fine tuning. The Lee die that comes with the set should be a taper crimp. However, many will argue with me, but its just my experience that there is a superior taper crimp if you taper crimp only on a 4th step after bullet seating (only) on a third step. The taper crimp should leave a distinct edge at the case mouth but snug to the bullet. If you drop it into a disassembled barrel, you should get a distinct abrupt stop and a sound as the case mouth hits the end of the chamber where it headspaces. If you are getting that, you are fine. What you will also notice is that the base of newer brass (or case head) should be flush with the top of the barrel. As you reload .45 ACP brass more times, it will tend to shorten. Then the base of the round will be inside of the end of the barrel. That is still fine. Some say as the brass shortens, then the extractor begins to govern bullet seat or "headspace". Thats an argment that can run long on a forum but doesnt matter. The .45 ACP will still work, that's the beauty part of the design and especially the 1911 design. |
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I agree with danger6: the crimp looks excessive. This can raise pressures to a dangerous level and result in a blown case.
Using your micrometer, measure the case diameter where the bullet base is located. Then measure it EXACTLY at the rim of the case mouth. It should read .002" less. That's only .001" per side. There should be a noticeable step-off from brass rim to bullet in the side view, and a ring of brass case looking from the top. Your case rim looks to be tapered right into the side of the bullet, indicating too much crimp. Numbers don't lie: measure with your micrometer. Compare your final product to a commercially loaded round. |
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Looks good! Let us know the range report. |
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Quoted: Side by side of the too much crimp and readjusted crimp. Too much on left. http://i.imgur.com/2KgmSIN.jpg |
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Yes now that you mention it, you can see where it started to roll inward (version on the left). Good pics worth a thousand words.
Below a little tech info about crimping from Sierra. They also recommend seating and crimping in separate steps. However if you can crimp effectively during seating the pistol won't care. It says you can get unreliable function, poor accuracy or poor ignition if roll crimping .45 ACP. Somewhere else I read you can break an extractor. Either way its not good. http://www.exteriorballistics.com/reloadbasics/crimp.cfm |
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