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Posted: 10/16/2006 6:44:47 PM EDT
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Based off some of the feedback from my previous thread "M16A2 is it worth the premium price?" I was thinking it would be awesome if we could have a thread permanently stuck with real world market values of the different M16 models and variations. It's easy to find out the market value or range of a Colt AR-15, however it seems alot more difficult to muster that kind of info for select fire Colts and other brands. That said it would be nice to have a thread to refer to when your looking to purchase or sell your M16(s). Something that would show the high end, mid and low end prices for NIB thru well used guns. For instance, on Bowers and Sturm I see that M16A2's are running in the mid 20's for a mint or NIB specimen. Is that price high? Are they really selling for that? If I found one NIB for say $18,000.00 is that a great deal? I have no clue, so a real world pricelist would make buying and selling a lot easier for everyone, especially CIII newbs like me. Plus it would make tracking the value of your investment fun. Thoughts? O3 out!! 
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| $18,000.00 for a NIB Colt M16 sounds like a good deal to me. I have one and I was recently offered $16,500.00 for it by the folks I bought it from. They told me they were getting $20k for them. Bear in mind that what I have is basically a NIB Colt M4 just like the ones in use by the military today. It is not an older model that has been kept in a safe for many years. I was told there are less than 10 of these available on the NFA market today. I am tempted to sell it and take the money at this point. I bought it a year ago for $13.5k. I should have bought the other one they had. |
Is it an M16-A2?????? |
PIC PIC PIC!!!! Click To See The M60E4 In Action  RIA M60-E4 |
Man, that price doesn't seem too bad considering what you have. If I'd known that is what you paid a year ago, I'd probably have picked one up. Don't sell that puppy, it is too sweet. |
Even if it is an M16A2 with a M4 upper on it....$13K is a hell of a deal. Every NIB Colt M16A2 I have come across has ranged from $24900 and up. If someone can tell me where to find a NIB A2 for less than $20K, I would be much obliged. Semper-Fi...O3 out!!
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I saw one a little bit ago for about $18.5K - non NIB for about $16.5K. These are what they are selling for, not Internet prices or inflated prices that some dealers are asking ...... If you take an NIB M16-A2 (standard 20" is all that is avaliable) and put an M4 upper on it, and sell it this way, it is NOT a NIB M4 ...... if the 20" upper does not come with it, it is NOT a NIB m16-A2 ..... |
Figuratively speaking you are correct if someone is concerned with keeping an original NIB factory correct rifle, however If I were given the opportunity to purchase a new/unfired M16A2 lower with a new M4 upper for 13K, I would consider myself very lucky. Hell even if it's used...13k is a great price. I've also heard the "what they are selling for" not "what they are listed for" argument. I've been looking for about three weeks now and nobody that I've come across wants to drop their prices anywhere near the prices you have come across. The cheapest NIB M16A2 I've seen was on STURM for $24,900 firm. I did see one listed as NIB for $18,500.00 however after seeing the pics, id beg to differ about it's supposed NIB condition. The rifle looked horrible, discoloring in the anodizing, uneven rollmarks etc. I suspect that is why the price was so low. Autoweapons, had a new A2 lower that was marked A1 and it was mated with a new M4 upper. That was still well over 22K. You can find other NIB A2 configurations other than the 20" model as well. The M16A2 Commando with the 11.5" upper comes to mind and carries with it a premium over the fullsize rifle...I even came across one with the fullsize stock and shorty upper...although I couldn't confirm that as factory original. Most of the lowers are correctly marked BURST, some are marked AUTO. I'm still actively searching for a NIB A2 in any configuration for a fair price. If any of you gentlemen happen to come across one in your dealings or while surfing, I'd appreciate it if you could pass along the info. Thanks...O3 out!! |
factory Colt M16-A2 lower taken off of a NIB Colt M16-A2 ---plus---- NIB factory Colt M4 upper ---DOES NOT EQUAL---- NIB Colt M4 It's just an M16-A2 with a non-original upper on it. |
If you're into classic muscle cars, you can buy a '65 Shelby Mustang that is 100% correct down to the last nut and bolt ... except for its VIN number, which proves it never went through Carroll Shelby's shop. And the price tag/market value is at best 10% of a documented original Shelby Mustang. There are a lot of such "post-Shelby" cars assembled on original '65 Mustangs with all correct NOS Shelby factory parts ... they look, drive and really are exactly the same, yet the market values them completely differently based solely on whose hands turned the wrenches. A purist will polish his pampered, trailered $250k Shelby-assembled original as he tells you exactly why it's worth so much more; a clone driver won't bother, because he'll be busy driving the daylights out of his $25k post-Shelby-factory-assembled clone. For better or worse, we perceive a difference between original and non-factory, and we place different values on identical objects based on who originally built them. An M4 assembled by anyone other than Colt, and at any time other than the original date of manufacture, may be identical in appearance and function, but it is not the real item. It's just as good, it's as close as we can legally get, but that does not make it genuine. As always, YMMV. 
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Sorry guys, I was away for 5 weeks. Actually, mine is a NIB COLT M4 but it had a strange combination for the official Model name. It was called an M16A1/A3/M4A1 Model 720. You would have to replace the upper and the stock to make it an M16-A2. The strange name is because it was an old serial number (hence M16-A1) that was remanufactured into a late model M4, complete with heavy barrel, flat top upper. ETA: I saved the original upper. I bought an identical one and added the KAS RAS and foregrip, and also the Trijicon. 
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| Now you went and done it! That is a Colt M4 lower that replaced an old M16A1 lower. Notice the added reinforcement at the rear. It has the sharp bottom edge, not the blended bottom that would identify it as an A2 lower. Same thing that Olympic did before they were told to stop. |
Except that Colt was the original manufacturer of the machinegun receiver. If I understand the situation correctly, Oly was told to stop due to the fact that they converted the receivers but were not the original manufacturer of the receivers. Someone correct me here if I'm wrong. In any case, that is a sweet weapon ARJunaBug! |
Yes, you are correct. Olympic was replacing receivers that were originaly converted by a third party. Colt could replace your Kaboomed factory lower, but good luck getting them to. You better have some good connections. |
Sorry for the late reply, but as I said earlier, I have been away for a while. I don't think it's fair or realistic to apply the logic of the Shelby and the VIN discrepancy to the world of NFA weapons. A lot of strange stuff goes on in this world due to some bizzare and disjointed legislation enacted over the years. My M4 is a perfect example of what can be produced by weaving your way through all the laws. By law you would think that no civilian can own a late model factory M4 from COLT, yet I have one. Sure it says M16A1 on the receiver, but it clearly is not. The law requires remanufactured serial numbers to maintain the exact same outer markings. Yet there is absolutely no difference between it and one that came out with M4 stamped on it. There are less than 10 of these in existence (in civilian hands). Does that make it less valuable? I would think it makes it much more valuable than a post 86 M4. COLT has remanufactured some other models as well. Does it matter if the markings do not match the weapon exactly? Maybe it does, but only in a positive way. I would much rather have a NIB late model COLT NFA weapon with an old marking then an old worn COLT. These items are actually quite rare and IMHO quite valuable. |
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ArJunaBug, I didn't mean yours, which is only a rollmark away from being completely M4, and is certainly as close as is legally possible -- and its value reflects that fact. Instead, I was speaking of some dealers' and private sellers' practice of taking a regular M16A1 or A2 transferable, slapping an M4 upper on it in the back room, and then proudly advertising it as a "assembled (possibly) by Colt" factory M4.  Colt may have shipped a very few built up on pre-'86 receivers, but judging from what I see for sale, they have magically multiplied like rabbits.  |
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