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Posted: 7/27/2002 8:36:28 PM EDT
OK, I plan to build a quality 20" AR as my first project. Because I have no experience and hate fooling with piddly little parts, I am going with a ASA completed lower with A2 buttstock and most likely a DPMS complete upper. Is this a pretty good choice? The reason I want teh DPMS is because they use the 5.56mm chamber and that's important to me since I want to use mil spec ammo. Is this indeed correct about the chamber type?

Also, what if anything extra will I need to buy? Should the kit come with take-down pins and such or will I need to buy those seperate?

Second, I want to permanently attach either a Wilson or Kurt's Custom A2 style brake on this gun. Would I be better off to get the pre-ban which is already threaded, then permanently attach the brake and grind off the bayonet lug to make it legal? Or would I be better off to have the post-ban barrel and have a gunsmith thread it and attach the brake for me? Also, what is needed to "permanently attach" these brakes in order to be completely legal with them? I would like to do all of the work myself if at all possible, but if attaching the brake is complicated and tricky, I will just let a smith handle it.

I also posted this topic in the "Build It Yourself Section", but that place wasn't getting many hits. For that reason I moved it here. Not sure if it is considered a no-no to clone one of your own topics, so if it offends anyone I will delete one of the posts. Just let me know. Thanks.

---Charging-Handle

Link Posted: 7/27/2002 9:30:48 PM EDT
Welome to your first build!!!!!

For starters, the kit can be had for $430 and a receiver will run you around $95 for a RRA.

As for adding a brake to the kit, this can be done two ways, either order a post ban kit and send the barrel off to be thread, or buy a Pre ban kit and remove the bayonet lug. The brake will need to be silver soldered on before you can join the upper and lower.

If needed I can list the sources for the manuals, silver solder, and even a lower parts picture that shows what every part in the lower looks like so you install the parts/springs correctly.
The upper will come built and If you start off with a Pre ban kit, the removed bayonet lug can be re-blacked with Casey-Birch aluminum black.
As for the Brake, all you will need to do is spin the FS off, add the silver paste, index the brake, then heat the brake up with a mapp torch until it's a dull red. Then just let it cool and rub some of the Aluminum black on the brake to bring it back to a black color.

P.S. The kit will come with all the parts need to complete the build. Depending on who you order the kit from, they can exchange the FS for A BATF approved brake. You will still need to silver solder it to be legal on a post ban lower.

Feel free to pick my brain on any other questions that you may have in regards to the build.
Link Posted: 7/27/2002 10:20:58 PM EDT
Got documentation stating that DPMS is a 5.56 chamber??

I have a new DPMS upper and it's marked .223 on the barrel. Although I have heard (not sure if true) that DPMS marks their barrels .223, but they are really 5.56. Anybody have any furhter info on this???



I recently built my first AR.. A couple days ago.

All new DPMS parts and a like new Bushmaster stripped receiver. Receiver went together actually fairly easy.. Plus you learn a lot about your gun doing it that way...
Link Posted: 7/27/2002 10:51:45 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/27/2002 11:16:03 PM EDT by Charging_Handle]
Dano,

Man, a big thanks to you for your detailed and very helpful post. It sounds as if you knew what I was wanting to know better than I did!

If you have the time and feel like posting the info about where to acquire those materials, feel free to post it. I would love to know where to get the silver solder stuff, the black aluminum finishing and the manuals. Great stuff.

I take it that this paste is just applied to the threads, then the brake screwed on and then heated? I guess it then hardens as is all set after it cools then. Sounds good.

After reading the replies, I think it would make more sense to just buy the complete kit and then get the stripped lower and build it up. Afterall, if you buy both completed upper and lower, the price would be the same of a completed rifle. At least I can save and learn by putting it together myself. I may go with J&T's kits as they seem to have a good rep for great service and good quality parts. I just hope that they come with the upper fully assembled, including the bolt and carrier. And I also hope they have the 5.56mm chamber. I would hate to have to put that entire assembly together. But the lower I think I may be able to handle.

Again, thanks for all the help and believe me, I am taking notes! Hehe.
Link Posted: 7/28/2002 2:55:36 AM EDT
OK, just to follow up on the DPMS and whether or not it has a 5.56 or .223 chamber, I did some research and it does indeed have the 5.56mm chmaber. Yet it is marked as .223 on the barrels. Why they do this I have no clue. The info I would say is very accurate because I got it from a link located in the ammo FAQ here. Maryland AR-15 Shooters something or other was the source of the information. But these rifles don't have the chrome plated chamber and barrel. How much of a problem (if any) this is I don't know. But everyone says they are more reliable with it. I guess if I choose DPMS I will just have to pay extra special attention to keeping the gun clean.

I honestly don't know what to go with. I want to get the best gun that I can for a decent price. I thought I could take a pre-ban upper and have it fixed the way I want it (with an A2 style brake that looks good) without the problems of having to have a post-ban barrel threaded and what not. If it wasn't for taking a chance on getting a purple receiver and the amount of problems posted here lately, I would just get a $699 Bushmaster 20" A2 from AIM and have the dang thing threaded and the Wilson brake installed.

It is just really discouraging trying to get the AR that I really want. As many different manufacturers as there is these days, none of them make anything that's the way I want it from the factory. Damn this gun addiction! LOL.
Link Posted: 7/28/2002 6:44:45 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/28/2002 6:49:15 AM EDT by Dano523]

Originally Posted By Charging_Handle:
Dano,

Man, a big thanks to you for your detailed and very helpful post. It sounds as if you knew what I was wanting to know better than I did!

If you have the time and feel like posting the info about where to acquire those materials, feel free to post it. I would love to know where to get the silver solder stuff, the black aluminum finishing and the manuals. Great stuff.

I take it that this paste is just applied to the threads, then the brake screwed on and then heated? I guess it then hardens as is all set after it cools then. Sounds good.

After reading the replies, I think it would make more sense to just buy the complete kit and then get the stripped lower and build it up. Afterall, if you buy both completed upper and lower, the price would be the same of a completed rifle. At least I can save and learn by putting it together myself. I may go with J&T's kits as they seem to have a good rep for great service and good quality parts. I just hope that they come with the upper fully assembled, including the bolt and carrier. And I also hope they have the 5.56mm chamber. I would hate to have to put that entire assembly together. But the lower I think I may be able to handle.

Again, thanks for all the help and believe me, I am taking notes! Hehe.



Silver paste
http://www.silversupplies.com/catalog/silver_solder/solder.shtml#paste

Manual's

User manual
http://old.ar15.com/books/TM9-1005-319-10.pdf

Repair manual
http://old.ar15.com/books/TM9-1005-319-23.pdf

P.S. check with J&T when ordering the kit. I believe that there barrels are 5.56 not 223, but make sure before ordering the kit/barrel.

Also, once you have a chance to go over the manuals, and get ready with the parts for the build, I can walk you threw the build, including places to check and prep to make sure that the rifle runs 100% from the start.

Hope this helps.
Link Posted: 7/28/2002 11:29:56 AM EDT
Very helpful, thanks again.
Link Posted: 7/28/2002 11:41:56 AM EDT
Try J&T, I just ordered, received, and assembled a M4 kit that is truly spectacular. Incredable service and the qualith is top notch. I wont ever buy another kit anywhere else!
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