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Posted: 5/2/2015 11:38:30 PM EDT
| Am looking for a red dot to mount on a pistol for NVG use. No RMR mounts are available for my pistol (CZ Kadet), but a mount is available for the Burris Fastfire. Does anybody know if the fastfire and NVGs play well together? |
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Quoted: Am looking for a red dot to mount on a pistol for NVG use. No RMR mounts are available for my pistol (CZ Kadet), but a mount is available for the Burris Fastfire. Does anybody know if the fastfire and NVGs play well together? First off, the Burris folks don't advertise them as "NV compatible" http://www.burrisoptics.com/sights/fastfire-series So that's a big NOPE. Secondly, a simple test you can do yourself. Turn the Fastfire on to the setting you propose to use with a NV device and then turn out all the lights so you are in a blacked out room. If you can see the reticle with your naked eye - it will burn itself onto the IIT permanently. ETA: Note the sequence of getting the Fastfire turned on and adjusted DOWN in a lighted room, this saves you from the mistake of thinking the FastFire which is not turned on equates to "NV compatible". Don't ask me how I know this, my official testimony is, "I can't recall."  |
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Quoted: First off, the Burris folks don't advertise them as "NV compatible" http://www.burrisoptics.com/sights/fastfire-series So that's a big NOPE. Secondly, a simple test you can do yourself. Turn the Fastfire on to the setting you propose to use with a NV device and then turn out all the lights so you are in a blacked out room. If you can see the reticle with your naked eye - it will burn itself onto the IIT permanently. ETA: Note the sequence of getting the Fastfire turned on and adjusted DOWN in a lighted room, this saves you from the mistake of thinking the FastFire which is not turned on equates to "NV compatible". Don't ask me how I know this, my official testimony is, "I can't recall." Quoted: Quoted: Am looking for a red dot to mount on a pistol for NVG use. No RMR mounts are available for my pistol (CZ Kadet), but a mount is available for the Burris Fastfire. Does anybody know if the fastfire and NVGs play well together? First off, the Burris folks don't advertise them as "NV compatible" http://www.burrisoptics.com/sights/fastfire-series So that's a big NOPE. Secondly, a simple test you can do yourself. Turn the Fastfire on to the setting you propose to use with a NV device and then turn out all the lights so you are in a blacked out room. If you can see the reticle with your naked eye - it will burn itself onto the IIT permanently. ETA: Note the sequence of getting the Fastfire turned on and adjusted DOWN in a lighted room, this saves you from the mistake of thinking the FastFire which is not turned on equates to "NV compatible". Don't ask me how I know this, my official testimony is, "I can't recall." learn something new everyday, thanks! |
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First off, the Burris folks don't advertise them as "NV compatible" http://www.burrisoptics.com/sights/fastfire-series So that's a big NOPE. Secondly, a simple test you can do yourself. Turn the Fastfire on to the setting you propose to use with a NV device and then turn out all the lights so you are in a blacked out room. If you can see the reticle with your naked eye - it will burn itself onto the IIT permanently. ETA: Note the sequence of getting the Fastfire turned on and adjusted DOWN in a lighted room, this saves you from the mistake of thinking the FastFire which is not turned on equates to "NV compatible". Don't ask me how I know this, my official testimony is, "I can't recall."
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Am looking for a red dot to mount on a pistol for NVG use. No RMR mounts are available for my pistol (CZ Kadet), but a mount is available for the Burris Fastfire. Does anybody know if the fastfire and NVGs play well together? First off, the Burris folks don't advertise them as "NV compatible" http://www.burrisoptics.com/sights/fastfire-series So that's a big NOPE. Secondly, a simple test you can do yourself. Turn the Fastfire on to the setting you propose to use with a NV device and then turn out all the lights so you are in a blacked out room. If you can see the reticle with your naked eye - it will burn itself onto the IIT permanently. ETA: Note the sequence of getting the Fastfire turned on and adjusted DOWN in a lighted room, this saves you from the mistake of thinking the FastFire which is not turned on equates to "NV compatible". Don't ask me how I know this, my official testimony is, "I can't recall."
On my Fast fire 2 you cannot manually adjust the brightness setting. It has a sensor on the front that adjusts it to the lighting conditions. The new FF3 might be different, I dont know. ETA: The FF3 does have a manual adjustment. From the burris web site "The FastFire™ 3 provides 3 manual brightness settings, plus an automatic brightness adjustment setting. " |
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FF3 has one auto and 3 manual modes,but even lowest setting is too bright for NV.  Well, that sucks I was really hoping the burris was going to work out. There are mounts for burris and doctors that fit the CZ kadet, but nothing I've been able to find for the RMR. |
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may be there is a chance to lower brightness by reducing power voltage,
although probably sight will simply shut down if the voltage is too low. anyway it is worth to try run it with nearly dead battery or 1.5 volt cell of similar form factor. if it works,it should be possible to put a thin film of resistant material between coin cell and contact. if i can find dead coin cell or 1.5V one,i will try this tonight and report. 
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First off, the Burris folks don't advertise them as "NV compatible" http://www.burrisoptics.com/sights/fastfire-series So that's a big NOPE. Secondly, a simple test you can do yourself. Turn the Fastfire on to the setting you propose to use with a NV device and then turn out all the lights so you are in a blacked out room. If you can see the reticle with your naked eye - it will burn itself onto the IIT permanently. ETA: Note the sequence of getting the Fastfire turned on and adjusted DOWN in a lighted room, this saves you from the mistake of thinking the FastFire which is not turned on equates to "NV compatible". Don't ask me how I know this, my official testimony is, "I can't recall."
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Am looking for a red dot to mount on a pistol for NVG use. No RMR mounts are available for my pistol (CZ Kadet), but a mount is available for the Burris Fastfire. Does anybody know if the fastfire and NVGs play well together? First off, the Burris folks don't advertise them as "NV compatible" http://www.burrisoptics.com/sights/fastfire-series So that's a big NOPE. Secondly, a simple test you can do yourself. Turn the Fastfire on to the setting you propose to use with a NV device and then turn out all the lights so you are in a blacked out room. If you can see the reticle with your naked eye - it will burn itself onto the IIT permanently. ETA: Note the sequence of getting the Fastfire turned on and adjusted DOWN in a lighted room, this saves you from the mistake of thinking the FastFire which is not turned on equates to "NV compatible". Don't ask me how I know this, my official testimony is, "I can't recall."
It will only burn a dot into the tube under prolonged use, as in if you turn it on and let it set there for a long time looking directly at the dot. turning the dot on and aiming with the pistol and shooting it wont hurt it, the autogating will take care of things. The actual time spent looking at the dot through nods will be relatively low. |
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Quoted: It will only burn a dot into the tube under prolonged use, as in if you turn it on and let it set there for a long time looking directly at the dot. turning the dot on and aiming with the pistol and shooting it wont hurt it, the autogating will take care of things. The actual time spent looking at the dot through nods will be relatively low. Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Am looking for a red dot to mount on a pistol for NVG use. No RMR mounts are available for my pistol (CZ Kadet), but a mount is available for the Burris Fastfire. Does anybody know if the fastfire and NVGs play well together? First off, the Burris folks don't advertise them as "NV compatible" http://www.burrisoptics.com/sights/fastfire-series So that's a big NOPE. Secondly, a simple test you can do yourself. Turn the Fastfire on to the setting you propose to use with a NV device and then turn out all the lights so you are in a blacked out room. If you can see the reticle with your naked eye - it will burn itself onto the IIT permanently. ETA: Note the sequence of getting the Fastfire turned on and adjusted DOWN in a lighted room, this saves you from the mistake of thinking the FastFire which is not turned on equates to "NV compatible". Don't ask me how I know this, my official testimony is, "I can't recall." It will only burn a dot into the tube under prolonged use, as in if you turn it on and let it set there for a long time looking directly at the dot. turning the dot on and aiming with the pistol and shooting it wont hurt it, the autogating will take care of things. The actual time spent looking at the dot through nods will be relatively low. Always interesting to hear from someone who knows better than the manufacturer and common sense ... |
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If you put a 30 (or 30.5) mm 720nm IR bypass filter into the odjective of your PVS14, you will be able to use the FF. On my PVS14s, I have the filter installed and can use 5mW red visible lasers and their dot has much less bloom than .7mW IR lasers. True dat!
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Always interesting to hear from someone who knows better than the manufacturer and common sense ... Quoted:
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Am looking for a red dot to mount on a pistol for NVG use. No RMR mounts are available for my pistol (CZ Kadet), but a mount is available for the Burris Fastfire. Does anybody know if the fastfire and NVGs play well together? First off, the Burris folks don't advertise them as "NV compatible" http://www.burrisoptics.com/sights/fastfire-series So that's a big NOPE. Secondly, a simple test you can do yourself. Turn the Fastfire on to the setting you propose to use with a NV device and then turn out all the lights so you are in a blacked out room. If you can see the reticle with your naked eye - it will burn itself onto the IIT permanently. ETA: Note the sequence of getting the Fastfire turned on and adjusted DOWN in a lighted room, this saves you from the mistake of thinking the FastFire which is not turned on equates to "NV compatible". Don't ask me how I know this, my official testimony is, "I can't recall."
It will only burn a dot into the tube under prolonged use, as in if you turn it on and let it set there for a long time looking directly at the dot. turning the dot on and aiming with the pistol and shooting it wont hurt it, the autogating will take care of things. The actual time spent looking at the dot through nods will be relatively low. Always interesting to hear from someone who knows better than the manufacturer and common sense ... You have absolutely no comprehension of what he's talking about, do you? "Common sense" says that you should understand what's being said before you comment on it and question their common sense. |
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Always interesting to hear from someone who knows better than the manufacturer and common sense ... Quoted:
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Am looking for a red dot to mount on a pistol for NVG use. No RMR mounts are available for my pistol (CZ Kadet), but a mount is available for the Burris Fastfire. Does anybody know if the fastfire and NVGs play well together? First off, the Burris folks don't advertise them as "NV compatible" http://www.burrisoptics.com/sights/fastfire-series So that's a big NOPE. Secondly, a simple test you can do yourself. Turn the Fastfire on to the setting you propose to use with a NV device and then turn out all the lights so you are in a blacked out room. If you can see the reticle with your naked eye - it will burn itself onto the IIT permanently. ETA: Note the sequence of getting the Fastfire turned on and adjusted DOWN in a lighted room, this saves you from the mistake of thinking the FastFire which is not turned on equates to "NV compatible". Don't ask me how I know this, my official testimony is, "I can't recall."
It will only burn a dot into the tube under prolonged use, as in if you turn it on and let it set there for a long time looking directly at the dot. turning the dot on and aiming with the pistol and shooting it wont hurt it, the autogating will take care of things. The actual time spent looking at the dot through nods will be relatively low. Always interesting to hear from someone who knows better than the manufacturer and common sense ... its been said around here many, many times. the military for years used aimpoints (or eotechs, I dont remember off hand) with weapon mounted 14's behind them that eventually burnt dots into the tube due to the prolonged use of non nvg compatible optics, im not arguing that. but we are talking about leaving them on and mounted for 8 hours every night. looking through nods at a laser, or non nvg compatible red dot long enough to aim a pistol wont hurt the tube as long as it dosent sit there for an hour. even with non autogated tubes you can get away with it as long as its not mounted directly behind it for a long time. If a weapon sight burns a tube in seconds, then so would momentary exposure to street lights, headlights, aircraft lights, or dash lights in a car where we all know autogating takes care of things. This has been covered here before, read some older threads. I even contacted Vic at TNVC about this, here is the direct quote from him via PM Light damage at night from flashlights, porch lights, and street lights etc. will not damage the unit unless the unit is trained on the light source for long periods of times. But scanning a target will not hurt the unit. The autogated power supplies work that well for adjusting bright light. The unit also has auto shut off feature if the units electronics sense too bright a light. the IR filter is a great idea as well. |
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It will only burn a dot into the tube under prolonged use, as in if you turn it on and let it set there for a long time looking directly at the dot. turning the dot on and aiming with the pistol and shooting it wont hurt it, the autogating will take care of things. The actual time spent looking at the dot through nods will be relatively low. Quoted:
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Am looking for a red dot to mount on a pistol for NVG use. No RMR mounts are available for my pistol (CZ Kadet), but a mount is available for the Burris Fastfire. Does anybody know if the fastfire and NVGs play well together? First off, the Burris folks don't advertise them as "NV compatible" http://www.burrisoptics.com/sights/fastfire-series So that's a big NOPE. Secondly, a simple test you can do yourself. Turn the Fastfire on to the setting you propose to use with a NV device and then turn out all the lights so you are in a blacked out room. If you can see the reticle with your naked eye - it will burn itself onto the IIT permanently. ETA: Note the sequence of getting the Fastfire turned on and adjusted DOWN in a lighted room, this saves you from the mistake of thinking the FastFire which is not turned on equates to "NV compatible". Don't ask me how I know this, my official testimony is, "I can't recall."
It will only burn a dot into the tube under prolonged use, as in if you turn it on and let it set there for a long time looking directly at the dot. turning the dot on and aiming with the pistol and shooting it wont hurt it, the autogating will take care of things. The actual time spent looking at the dot through nods will be relatively low. Exactly this, unless you are looking at a dot that is ridiculously bright. I used gen 3 behind a Fast Fire 2 off and on a number of years ago and never had a single problem. Since the sight body is so small, it just looked like a dot floating out in space. This was significant back then because IR lasers were still only for the cool kids. If you are in a brightly lit area the intensity of the dot will adjust upward which can cause blooming, but if you are in a bright area your NVD should be flipped up anyway. Being that this will be on a pistol, there is obviously no chance of the NV being hard mounted behind it so as to put the dot in the same place on the tube for a lengthy amount of time. Like others have said, if you want to be cautious or prevent blooming just put a 720nm filter on the objective lens (assuming you are using a pvs-14). No, Burris didn't market them as NV compatible but in this application you should have no problems whatsoever. As to the comment about the manufacturer and common sense, does your night vision common sense really tell you that looking through a non-NV compatible red dot on a pistol off and on to hit your target will immediately burn that reticle into the tube? By that logic, my NVDs should've had a collection of reticles on the screen Even without autogated power supplies that isn't going to happen. A $10 IR filter obviates the whole argument, why not pick one up if you don't have one?
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Exactly this, unless you are looking at a dot that is ridiculously bright. I used gen 3 behind a Fast Fire 2 off and on a number of years ago and never had a single problem. Since the sight body is so small, it just looked like a dot floating out in space. This was significant back then because IR lasers were still only for the cool kids. If you are in a brightly lit area the intensity of the dot will adjust upward which can cause blooming, but if you are in a bright area your NVD should be flipped up anyway. Being that this will be on a pistol, there is obviously no chance of the NV being hard mounted behind it so as to put the dot in the same place on the tube for a lengthy amount of time. Like others have said, if you want to be cautious or prevent blooming just put a 720nm filter on the objective lens (assuming you are using a pvs-14). No, Burris didn't market them as NV compatible but in this application you should have no problems whatsoever. As to the comment about the manufacturer and common sense, does your night vision common sense really tell you that looking through a non-NV compatible red dot on a pistol off and on to hit your target will immediately burn that reticle into the tube? By that logic, my NVDs should've had a collection of reticles on the screen Even without autogated power supplies that isn't going to happen. A $10 IR filter obviates the whole argument, why not pick one up if you don't have one?Thanks for the write up. I love the 720nm filter on the NVG, read about it here and suggested it to several other folks locally. I'm going to go ahead and start searching for a fastfire 3 (with 3 settings and the auto mode). I think the burris on the suppressed .22 pistol is going to be interesting. |
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XlucidX = "If a weapon sight burns a tube in seconds," fordkickass = "will immediately burn that reticle into the tube?" You've invented what you want out of thin air - even taking a PM quote from Vic and broadening it to cover this specific instance - because, as you've proved, common sense isn't common. Ever think about stopping to wonder WHY Burris isn't marketing them as NV compatible? Nope, of course not. Common sense and/or life experience ought to be enough to make someone stop and wonder why a SPECIFIC answer to a SPECIFIC question was given. Problem with generalizing time of exposure of an IIT as to be of no consequence TO A LIGHT SOURCE below autogating levels is it isn't what happens in the real world. In the real world, you tell somebody that "it won't be on long or in the same spot so it will be OK" is putting someone's EXPENSIVE piece of equipment at risk for no sensible reason ... other than this is the internet and people LOVE doing it. A few seconds? Maybe - somewhere between 10 - 30 seems more reasonable and "common sense" ought to tell someone that people tend to get complacent and tend to abuse the few seconds to a sum total of several hundred minutes over the course of time. Is that inconsequential to an IIT tube? If it is ... it's the opposite of what's been posted here MANY times over the last six years that I've been reading this forum. Burris has to OWN what they market and saying it's NV compatible poses a LOT of $$$ risk for a niche market. And in a world of people who will take Burris' optic and use it it that manner regardless ... And the 720 nm IR filter was already mentioned before you two "me too!"'d it. ETA: Lots of people read these TECHNICAL forums who are NOT members but pass along what they read. A good percentage of them just read "It's OK to use a standard red dot with a night vision device." |
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XlucidX = "If a weapon sight burns a tube in seconds," fordkickass = "will immediately burn that reticle into the tube?" You've invented what you want out of thin air - even taking a PM quote from Vic and broadening it to cover this specific instance - because, as you've proved, common sense isn't common. Ever think about stopping to wonder WHY Burris isn't marketing them as NV compatible? Nope, of course not. Common sense and/or life experience ought to be enough to make someone stop and wonder why a SPECIFIC answer to a SPECIFIC question was given. Problem with generalizing time of exposure of an IIT as to be of no consequence TO A LIGHT SOURCE below autogating levels is it isn't what happens in the real world. In the real world, you tell somebody that "it won't be on long or in the same spot so it will be OK" is putting someone's EXPENSIVE piece of equipment at risk for no sensible reason ... other than this is the internet and people LOVE doing it. A few seconds? Maybe - somewhere between 10 - 30 seems more reasonable and "common sense" ought to tell someone that people tend to get complacent and tend to abuse the few seconds to a sum total of several hundred minutes over the course of time. Is that inconsequential to an IIT tube? If it is ... it's the opposite of what's been posted here MANY times over the last six years that I've been reading this forum. Burris has to OWN what they market and saying it's NV compatible poses a LOT of $$$ risk for a niche market. And in a world of people who will take Burris' optic and use it it that manner regardless ... And the 720 nm IR filter was already mentioned before you two "me too!"'d it. ETA: Lots of people read these TECHNICAL forums who are NOT members but pass along what they read. A good percentage of them just read "It's OK to use a standard red dot with a night vision device." If anyone that read my response only got out of it "it's OK to use a standard red dot with a night vision device" then I'm sorry but I can't help them and neither can the rest of the internet. You're right, he asked a specific question regarding using helmet mounted NV behind a fast fire. That is how I tailored my response and I stand by it... because I've used it that way MANY, MANY times. I used it mostly on an AR and 10/22 with the NV on my head, which parallels the application the OP is specifically asking about since the NV is not hard mounted behind the non-compatible optic. A fast fire, as we know, is not a magnified optic. Therefore, it would not be beneficial to scan through it with the NV (ie. adding exposure time of the tube to the dot), rather you would only use it to stick the dot on the target and squeeze the shot with a little time before and after. I agree with the the rule of thumb that if you can see a lit reticle w/ your naked eye then it is generally too bright to mount in front of your NVD. If the bloom from the dot is significant in your tube (bad HALO, etc), either put a 720nm lens on the device, or don't use sight with NV. It is that simple, and the user will be able to tell pretty fast which it is going to be. Hey look, I me too'ed the IR filter idea again. Maybe I should've prefaced it by adding "like others have said" the way I did before. This time it's in bold, harder to miss that way. To the OP, mine worked great with a gen3 (non-autogated to boot back then) and a Fast Fire 2. I have not used current versions of the Fast Fire. I doubt you did, but in case you took my post to mean that non-NV compatible red dots are OK to use with night vision PERIOD, then perhaps I could've worded it better somehow. |
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alright which one of you is this....
http://expressrecyclingandsanitation.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/07/dumpster-diving-620x413.jpg Maybe a night vision site sponsor (hint big enough?) could do a promo for a PVS14 involving a dumpster to see who really, really wants it the most. |
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