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Posted: 9/21/2014 4:40:37 PM EDT
| Hopefully next year Ill get some night vision but a cheap PEQ15 was listed on a local forum today. How can I tell if its stolen military property? What should it cost if it wasn't stolen? |
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Hopefully next year Ill get some night vision but a cheap PEQ15 was listed on a local forum today. How can I tell if its stolen military property? What should it cost if it wasn't stolen? Just walk away. It really is not worth it. Good civvy stuff is available with no issues. I had the IR laser fever too, then I met agent Wu. Wu and I like each other, somewhat... ETA: What I am trying to convey is there is no legal way for a civvy to own one stolen or not. It really is that simple. Everything else is rolling the dice and Wu is good at what he does. He never got any IR lasers from me though. I never owned any. 
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Just walk away. It really is not worth it. Good civvy stuff is available with no issues. I had the IR laser fever too, then I met agent Wu. Wu and I like each other, somewhat... ETA: What I am trying to convey is there is no legal way for a civvy to own one stolen or not. It really is that simple. Everything else is rolling the dice and Wu is good at what he does. He never got any IR lasers from me though. I never owned any.
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Hopefully next year Ill get some night vision but a cheap PEQ15 was listed on a local forum today. How can I tell if its stolen military property? What should it cost if it wasn't stolen? Just walk away. It really is not worth it. Good civvy stuff is available with no issues. I had the IR laser fever too, then I met agent Wu. Wu and I like each other, somewhat... ETA: What I am trying to convey is there is no legal way for a civvy to own one stolen or not. It really is that simple. Everything else is rolling the dice and Wu is good at what he does. He never got any IR lasers from me though. I never owned any.
Thanks! |
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Most folks here that have used the military powered stuff will tell you it is WAY to bright and blooms most images. However, they make a great IR iluminator and I am a huge fan of that. The GCP is a great unit for both. The military units are great for long range but most of us find it overkill for hunting purposes.
I have a hard time reading the newspaper without a magnifier so long range is not even a question for me. If I can't hit it at 100 meters it goes free !
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It's worthless no matter what it costs. Here's why, if it breaks no one in this entire world is going to sell you parts or fix it... It's trash. All it takes is a trip and fall at night or accidentally bump if against a tree and now what you have is what they call a expensive paper weight. It's not worth any price in my opinion.
With the atpial-c coming out in a month and a half that has full manufacturer support, I say pass. |
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Hopefully next year Ill get some night vision but a cheap PEQ15 was listed on a local forum today. How can I tell if its stolen military property? What should it cost if it wasn't stolen? If you can afford a used PEQ-15 you can likely afford to get into NV now via a quality used PVS-15 or PVS-7. Why wait until next year? Also, as has been universally stated, there are no ATPIAL's in the wild (that YOU can buy) that will not be stolen .GOV property. I'm all for owning them, and I like the full-power laser / illuminator, and I don't even mind the thought that I'm SOL if it breaks or malfunctions (not likely, as you can run them over with a truck and they will still work). The real issue is that you're buying genuine stolen property and probably overpaying for it. Unless it's in excellent condition and is under $1,000 you're not getting a deal. Get your NOD first. There will always be plenty of gray market .MIL IR devices around. |
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If you can afford a used PEQ-15 you can likely afford to get into NV now via a quality used PVS-15 or PVS-7. Why wait until next year? Also, as has been universally stated, there are no ATPIAL's in the wild (that YOU can buy) that will not be stolen .GOV property. I'm all for owning them, and I like the full-power laser / illuminator, and I don't even mind the thought that I'm SOL if it breaks or malfunctions (not likely, as you can run them over with a truck and they will still work). The real issue is that you're buying genuine stolen property and probably overpaying for it. Unless it's in excellent condition and is under $1,000 you're not getting a deal. Get your NOD first. There will always be plenty of gray market .MIL IR devices around. Quoted:
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Hopefully next year Ill get some night vision but a cheap PEQ15 was listed on a local forum today. How can I tell if its stolen military property? What should it cost if it wasn't stolen? If you can afford a used PEQ-15 you can likely afford to get into NV now via a quality used PVS-15 or PVS-7. Why wait until next year? Also, as has been universally stated, there are no ATPIAL's in the wild (that YOU can buy) that will not be stolen .GOV property. I'm all for owning them, and I like the full-power laser / illuminator, and I don't even mind the thought that I'm SOL if it breaks or malfunctions (not likely, as you can run them over with a truck and they will still work). The real issue is that you're buying genuine stolen property and probably overpaying for it. Unless it's in excellent condition and is under $1,000 you're not getting a deal. Get your NOD first. There will always be plenty of gray market .MIL IR devices around. Whoa, you recently just posted a picture of one of your rifles sporting a PEQ-15 didn't you? If your statement you posted above is true, then you're admitting to possessing stolen government property, aren't you? Or could you be mistaken? I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt and state that you are mistaken as THERE ARE legally & legitimately owned PEQ-15's out there and that you aren't possessing stolen property. Agent Wu, or Patrick, or whomever was operating under the dhs_hsi username, all but stated as such when he was called out on his "100% of lasers are stolen" claim on page 5 of this thread, and after being owned on it, backtracked on page 6 and made the claim that "99.9% are stolen." So yes people, contrary to what the bootlickers may have you believe, there are legally possessed PEQ-15's out there. http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_3_20/501856_IR_Laser_Law___Response_from_the_FDA.html&page=6 |
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Whoa, you recently just posted a picture of one of your rifles sporting a PEQ-15 didn't you? If your statement you posted above is true, then you're admitting to possessing stolen government property, aren't you? Or could you be mistaken? I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt and state that you are mistaken as THERE ARE legally & legitimately owned PEQ-15's out there and that you aren't possessing stolen property. Agent Wu, or Patrick, or whomever was operating under the dhs_hsi username, all but stated as such when he was called out on his "100% of lasers are stolen" claim on page 5 of this thread, and after being owned on it, backtracked on page 6 and made the claim that "99.9% are stolen." So yes people, contrary to what the bootlickers may have you believe, there are legally possessed PEQ-15's out there. http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_3_20/501856_IR_Laser_Law___Response_from_the_FDA.html&page=6 Quoted:
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Hopefully next year Ill get some night vision but a cheap PEQ15 was listed on a local forum today. How can I tell if its stolen military property? What should it cost if it wasn't stolen? If you can afford a used PEQ-15 you can likely afford to get into NV now via a quality used PVS-15 or PVS-7. Why wait until next year? Also, as has been universally stated, there are no ATPIAL's in the wild (that YOU can buy) that will not be stolen .GOV property. I'm all for owning them, and I like the full-power laser / illuminator, and I don't even mind the thought that I'm SOL if it breaks or malfunctions (not likely, as you can run them over with a truck and they will still work). The real issue is that you're buying genuine stolen property and probably overpaying for it. Unless it's in excellent condition and is under $1,000 you're not getting a deal. Get your NOD first. There will always be plenty of gray market .MIL IR devices around. Whoa, you recently just posted a picture of one of your rifles sporting a PEQ-15 didn't you? If your statement you posted above is true, then you're admitting to possessing stolen government property, aren't you? Or could you be mistaken? I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt and state that you are mistaken as THERE ARE legally & legitimately owned PEQ-15's out there and that you aren't possessing stolen property. Agent Wu, or Patrick, or whomever was operating under the dhs_hsi username, all but stated as such when he was called out on his "100% of lasers are stolen" claim on page 5 of this thread, and after being owned on it, backtracked on page 6 and made the claim that "99.9% are stolen." So yes people, contrary to what the bootlickers may have you believe, there are legally possessed PEQ-15's out there. http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_3_20/501856_IR_Laser_Law___Response_from_the_FDA.html&page=6 how do you know it belonged to Horta, and not one of his friends that let him take a pic with it? how do you know Horta is not LEO/Mil, or a contractor? I suggest you pick on someone other than him, we all know about the thread you linked to as well its been posted here before. This thread is related to the OP and his situation, so in this case that PEQ15 has a 99.9% chance of being stolen gov property. pass on it. buy your nods now, and by the time you get them paid off the civilian version will be sitting on the shelf waiting to lighten your wallet. |
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Whoa, you recently just posted a picture of one of your rifles sporting a PEQ-15 didn't you? If your statement you posted above is true, then you're admitting to possessing stolen government property, aren't you? Or could you be mistaken? I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt and state that you are mistaken as THERE ARE legally & legitimately owned PEQ-15's out there and that you aren't possessing stolen property. Agent Wu, or Patrick, or whomever was operating under the dhs_hsi username, all but stated as such when he was called out on his "100% of lasers are stolen" claim on page 5 of this thread, and after being owned on it, backtracked on page 6 and made the claim that "99.9% are stolen." So yes people, contrary to what the bootlickers may have you believe, there are legally possessed PEQ-15's out there. http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_3_20/501856_IR_Laser_Law___Response_from_the_FDA.html&page=6 Quoted:
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Hopefully next year Ill get some night vision but a cheap PEQ15 was listed on a local forum today. How can I tell if its stolen military property? What should it cost if it wasn't stolen? If you can afford a used PEQ-15 you can likely afford to get into NV now via a quality used PVS-15 or PVS-7. Why wait until next year? Also, as has been universally stated, there are no ATPIAL's in the wild (that YOU can buy) that will not be stolen .GOV property. I'm all for owning them, and I like the full-power laser / illuminator, and I don't even mind the thought that I'm SOL if it breaks or malfunctions (not likely, as you can run them over with a truck and they will still work). The real issue is that you're buying genuine stolen property and probably overpaying for it. Unless it's in excellent condition and is under $1,000 you're not getting a deal. Get your NOD first. There will always be plenty of gray market .MIL IR devices around. Whoa, you recently just posted a picture of one of your rifles sporting a PEQ-15 didn't you? If your statement you posted above is true, then you're admitting to possessing stolen government property, aren't you? Or could you be mistaken? I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt and state that you are mistaken as THERE ARE legally & legitimately owned PEQ-15's out there and that you aren't possessing stolen property. Agent Wu, or Patrick, or whomever was operating under the dhs_hsi username, all but stated as such when he was called out on his "100% of lasers are stolen" claim on page 5 of this thread, and after being owned on it, backtracked on page 6 and made the claim that "99.9% are stolen." So yes people, contrary to what the bootlickers may have you believe, there are legally possessed PEQ-15's out there. http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_3_20/501856_IR_Laser_Law___Response_from_the_FDA.html&page=6 As much as you thought that reading comprehension was your specialty it is not! You missed the key part in what TheHorta wrote. See what I highlighted for you in red! 
Back to the OP's issue |
The first rule of IIIb Club is: You do not talk about IIIb Club. The second rule of IIIb Club is: You do not talk about IIIb Club. Third rule of IIIb Club: Someone yells stop, goes blind, taps out, the fight is over. Fourth rule: only two guys to a fight. Fifth rule: one laser at a time, fellas. Sixth rule: no LIFs, no welding helmets. Seventh rule: Fights will go on as long as they have to. And the eighth and final rule: If this is your first night at IIIb Club, you have to make Luke Skywalker lightsaber sounds when you laser is energized.     
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I know it is a technicality but I see "stolen government property" quite a bit in this thread when it comes to IR lasers. While some may have been stolen most likely not all, some may have been sold out of ignorance of the FDA rules. However in either case they are still government property as it is a violation of the FDA rules to sale them to civilians only to agencies. In other words you can own it's just no one can sale one to you. Edit, and they can't give one to you either.
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The first rule of IIIb Club is: You do not talk about IIIb Club. The second rule of IIIb Club is: You do not talk about IIIb Club. Third rule of IIIb Club: Someone yells stop, goes blind, taps out, the fight is over. Fourth rule: only two guys to a fight. Fifth rule: one laser at a time, fellas. Sixth rule: no LIFs, no welding helmets. Seventh rule: Fights will go on as long as they have to. And the eighth and final rule: If this is your first night at IIIb Club, you have to make Luke Skywalker lightsaber sounds when you laser is energized.
I'm too low tier to know what in the hell you're talking about. |
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I'm too low tier to know what in the hell you're talking about. Quoted:
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The first rule of IIIb Club is: You do not talk about IIIb Club. The second rule of IIIb Club is: You do not talk about IIIb Club. Third rule of IIIb Club: Someone yells stop, goes blind, taps out, the fight is over. Fourth rule: only two guys to a fight. Fifth rule: one laser at a time, fellas. Sixth rule: no LIFs, no welding helmets. Seventh rule: Fights will go on as long as they have to. And the eighth and final rule: If this is your first night at IIIb Club, you have to make Luke Skywalker lightsaber sounds when you laser is energized.
I'm too low tier to know what in the hell you're talking about. I will translate If you have a evil laser keep your mouth shut and don't talk about it and for God sake don't post pictures. Other than that watch Star Wars and dance around your house making cool light saber sounds.
May the force be with you. The IIIb club is very secretive. Nobody knows who is a member. I don't even know if I am a member.
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I know it is a technicality but I see "stolen government property" quite a bit in this thread when it comes to IR lasers. While some may have been stolen most likely not all, some may have been sold out of ignorance of the FDA rules. However in either case they are still government property as it is a violation of the FDA rules to sale them to civilians only to agencies. In other words you can own it's just no one can sale one to you. Edit, and they can't give one to you either.wrong, just because the sale occured in violation of the fda faggotry does not legally invalidate the sale |
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In an effort to steer this thread back on track, the 1000% civi legal Class 1 IR aiming lasers are quite effective at the range in which aiming lasers themselves tend to be most effective.
If you are directing air strikes, than you probably have the appropriate tool anyway, and this discussion is moot. While the LED illuminators are "not quite the same" [think Sharon Stone's quote in Basic Instinct] as laser-based illuminators, they have become quite good over time. Many folks like a PEQ-2A on dual lo/hi with pressure switching for good reason, but there are perfectly suitable alternatives readily available in the 21st century without getting grey. Note that in this switching configuration the aiming laser is set at the same output level as the readily available Class 1 IR lasers. |
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wrong, just because the sale occured in violation of the fda faggotry does not legally invalidate the sale Quoted:
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I know it is a technicality but I see "stolen government property" quite a bit in this thread when it comes to IR lasers. While some may have been stolen most likely not all, some may have been sold out of ignorance of the FDA rules. However in either case they are still government property as it is a violation of the FDA rules to sale them to civilians only to agencies. In other words you can own it's just no one can sale one to you. Edit, and they can't give one to you either.wrong, just because the sale occured in violation of the fda faggotry does not legally invalidate the sale I have found no loophole that allows one to keep a military IR laser if the government wants it back.
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The FDA variances which all agencies have to agree to before buying a military IR lasers clearly states they can not be sold or resold to anyone but and agency, that invalidates any sale to and individual. it doesn't matter what they "agreed" to when they purchased it, contractually the sale is valid if they sell it did any of the individuals who's lasers were seized have proof of sale (from an agency to them, not a third party who may have stolen it) and fight it in court? I don't think so |
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it doesn't matter what they "agreed" to when they purchased it, contractually the sale is valid if they sell it did any of the individuals who's lasers were seized have proof of sale (from an agency to them, not a third party who may have stolen it) and fight it in court? I don't think so Quoted:
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The FDA variances which all agencies have to agree to before buying a military IR lasers clearly states they can not be sold or resold to anyone but and agency, that invalidates any sale to and individual. it doesn't matter what they "agreed" to when they purchased it, contractually the sale is valid if they sell it did any of the individuals who's lasers were seized have proof of sale (from an agency to them, not a third party who may have stolen it) and fight it in court? I don't think so Would you think the White House would be yours if some one offered it to you for $10.00 and a bill of sale? No, one has to have the authority to sale and item or the sale is not valid. In the case of Military IR laser units no one has the authority to sale them to individuals. Hope this helps you.
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You seem to be having a hard time understanding they are the governments and they can't sale them. And individual may say here is the IR device and a bill of sale but if he is not authorized to sale it the sale is not good. Would you think the White House would be yours if some one offered it to you for $10.00 and a bill of sale? No, one has to have the authority to sale and item or the sale is not valid. In the case of Military IR laser units no one has the authority to sale them to individuals. Hope this helps you.
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The FDA variances which all agencies have to agree to before buying a military IR lasers clearly states they can not be sold or resold to anyone but and agency, that invalidates any sale to and individual. it doesn't matter what they "agreed" to when they purchased it, contractually the sale is valid if they sell it did any of the individuals who's lasers were seized have proof of sale (from an agency to them, not a third party who may have stolen it) and fight it in court? I don't think so Would you think the White House would be yours if some one offered it to you for $10.00 and a bill of sale? No, one has to have the authority to sale and item or the sale is not valid. In the case of Military IR laser units no one has the authority to sale them to individuals. Hope this helps you.
ahh I see where your line of reasoning is coming from now, but there are instances where a representative of an agency may indeed have the statutory authority to dispose of the agency's property. that authority is not somehow automatically revoked if their actions run afoul of fda regulations you do realize that not all of the lasers in question belong(ed) to the federal government, and further the federal government is not monolithic in its property holdings |
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You seem to be having a hard time understanding they are the governments and they can't sale them. And individual may say here is the IR device and a bill of sale but if he is not authorized to sale it the sale is not good. Would you think the White House would be yours if some one offered it to you for $10.00 and a bill of sale? No, one has to have the authority to sale and item or the sale is not valid. In the case of Military IR laser units no one has the authority to sale them to individuals. Hope this helps you.
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The FDA variances which all agencies have to agree to before buying a military IR lasers clearly states they can not be sold or resold to anyone but and agency, that invalidates any sale to and individual. it doesn't matter what they "agreed" to when they purchased it, contractually the sale is valid if they sell it did any of the individuals who's lasers were seized have proof of sale (from an agency to them, not a third party who may have stolen it) and fight it in court? I don't think so Would you think the White House would be yours if some one offered it to you for $10.00 and a bill of sale? No, one has to have the authority to sale and item or the sale is not valid. In the case of Military IR laser units no one has the authority to sale them to individuals. Hope this helps you.
DHS and the FDA can (and will) take your toys away should you not be able to provide irrefutable, verifiable evidence that you obtained your "restricted" playthings in accord with .GOV regulations governing such trinkets. While it's not illegal to possess a Class III IR laser, it is illegal to possess stolen property. There are two ways one can "obtain" such devices legitimately, but most people will never be able to because you do not know the secret handshake. |
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DHS and the FDA can (and will) take your toys away should you not be able to provide irrefutable, verifiable evidence that you obtained your "restricted" playthings in accord with .GOV regulations governing such trinkets. While it's not illegal to possess a Class III IR laser, it is illegal to possess stolen property. I'm not suggesting that they wouldn't, what I am saying is there are legal flaws in their justifications for this policy. I don't particularly want to fight them on it, but I sure wish someone would. it seems that the only legal policy anyone on this board ever recommends with respect to the government is BOHICA. fuck that, the only way to put a stop to executive overreach is in the courts. |
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I'm not suggesting that they wouldn't, what I am saying is there are legal flaws in their justifications for this policy. I don't particularly want to fight them on it, but I sure wish someone would. it seems that the only legal policy anyone on this board ever recommends with respect to the government is BOHICA. fuck that, the only way to put a stop to executive overreach is in the courts. So, why don't you procure one of these sold on the grey market, then post pictures online, then fight the man in court? Why do you espouse a path that you are not willing to take for yourself if you are so confident in your answer?  It is easy to pick fights for other people to wage for you.
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So, why don't you procure one of these sold on the grey market, then post pictures online, then fight the man in court? Why do you espouse a path that you are not willing to take for yourself if you are so confident in your answer? It is easy to pick fights for other people to wage for you.Quoted:
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I'm not suggesting that they wouldn't, what I am saying is there are legal flaws in their justifications for this policy. I don't particularly want to fight them on it, but I sure wish someone would. it seems that the only legal policy anyone on this board ever recommends with respect to the government is BOHICA. fuck that, the only way to put a stop to executive overreach is in the courts. So, why don't you procure one of these sold on the grey market, then post pictures online, then fight the man in court? Why do you espouse a path that you are not willing to take for yourself if you are so confident in your answer? It is easy to pick fights for other people to wage for you.because I know the cost of the battle would outweigh the spoils for the individual, and I'm not a hero |
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Just wondering... why does FDA have any say on these at all? It is neither food, nor drug, nor "medical device." http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/USCODE-2010-title21/html/USCODE-2010-title21-chap9-subchapV-partC-sec360ii.htm |
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ahh I see where your line of reasoning is coming from now, but there are instances where a representative of an agency may indeed have the statutory authority to dispose of the agency's property. that authority is not somehow automatically revoked if their actions run afoul of fda regulations you do realize that not all of the lasers in question belong(ed) to the federal government, and further the federal government is not monolithic in its property holdings Quoted:
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The FDA variances which all agencies have to agree to before buying a military IR lasers clearly states they can not be sold or resold to anyone but and agency, that invalidates any sale to and individual. it doesn't matter what they "agreed" to when they purchased it, contractually the sale is valid if they sell it did any of the individuals who's lasers were seized have proof of sale (from an agency to them, not a third party who may have stolen it) and fight it in court? I don't think so Would you think the White House would be yours if some one offered it to you for $10.00 and a bill of sale? No, one has to have the authority to sale and item or the sale is not valid. In the case of Military IR laser units no one has the authority to sale them to individuals. Hope this helps you.
ahh I see where your line of reasoning is coming from now, but there are instances where a representative of an agency may indeed have the statutory authority to dispose of the agency's property. that authority is not somehow automatically revoked if their actions run afoul of fda regulations you do realize that not all of the lasers in question belong(ed) to the federal government, and further the federal government is not monolithic in its property holdings 
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Just wondering... why does FDA have any say on these at all? It is neither food, nor drug, nor "medical device." http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/USCODE-2010-title21/html/USCODE-2010-title21-chap9-subchapV-partC-sec360ii.htm A laser beam is electromagnetic radiation. |
| The bottom line is that while you may successfully obtain a variance from the FDA, the manufacturer is still under no obligation to actually sell it to you. I snuck an IZLID variance in with a stack of 5 or 6 other lasers I needed variances for, but none of them have come back yet. Regardless, under no circumstances will BE Meyers sell me one, even with an approved variance. I asked. |
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I was told by Agent Wu that there is only ONE way you can legally own one as a civvy. That would be for DRMO to fuck up and sell you one and you have the receipt. Any other way such as LE sales and such is no go. I can't buy one outside the country because the minute I import it I break the law.
Could this whole thing be fought out in court ? Sure, I could tell Wu to pound sand and make him get a subpena for my laser and I will see him in court. I highly doubt they could convince a jury I stole anything provided I bought it on ebay or some other legal channel. I will still lose the case and my laser. I will be out the cost of my laser and my legal bills. I am also fighting a entity that can print its own money and has unlimited funds to make my life a living hell. I am not going to be the guinea pig. Maybe on some off chance I win and get to keep my laser ? I still spent thousands plus countless hours of my life over a $1500 laser I can covertly buy anytime I want. Moral to the story and what I tell everybody is to say nothing and don't post pictures. I could care less if someone has a evil laser. I think the law is stupid. Maybe kitchen knifes should be under FDA control. If you happen to be lucky enough to own one without Wu smacking your nuts I am happy. Most will fold under the pressure when Wu tells you to turn it in or face prosecution. Stolen or not never had any bearing on this and Wu used that to his advantage. I would love to see someone hash it out with him and the .Gov in court. I think they will lose but I tend to root for the underdog !
All this said almost anyone with a little savvy could have a 3b laser in their hands covertly with little effort. I like the GCP (don't own one ). Just keep your mouth shut and Wu has no power over you. Us night vision guys really irk him. Light sabers for the win !!!
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I was told by Agent Wu that there is only ONE way you can legally own one as a civvy. That would be for DRMO to fuck up and sell you one and you have the receipt. Any other way such as LE sales and such is no go. I can't buy one outside the country because the minute I import it I break the law. Could this whole thing be fought out in court ? Sure, I could tell Wu to pound sand and make him get a subpena for my laser and I will see him in court. I highly doubt they could convince a jury I stole anything provided I bought it on ebay or some other legal channel. I will still lose the case and my laser. I will be out the cost of my laser and my legal bills. I am also fighting a entity that can print its own money and has unlimited funds to make my life a living hell. I am not going to be the guinea pig. Maybe on some off chance I win and get to keep my laser ? I still spent thousands plus countless hours of my life over a $1500 laser I can covertly buy anytime I want. Moral to the story and what I tell everybody is to say nothing and don't post pictures. I could care less if someone has a evil laser. I think the law is stupid. Maybe kitchen knifes should be under FDA control. If you happen to be lucky enough to own one without Wu smacking your nuts I am happy. Most will fold under the pressure when Wu tells you to turn it in or face prosecution. Stolen or not never had any bearing on this and Wu used that to his advantage. I would love to see someone hash it out with him and the .Gov in court. I think they will lose but I tend to root for the underdog !
All this said almost anyone with a little savvy could have a 3b laser in their hands covertly with little effort. I like the GCP (don't own one ). Just keep your mouth shut and Wu has no power over you. Us night vision guys really irk him. Light sabers for the win !!! I guess I'm fortunate in that legally I don't personally "own" anything... which is the "other" way (well, half of it anyway). |
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I guess I'm fortunate in that legally I don't personally "own" anything... which is the "other" way (well, half of it anyway). Quoted:
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I was told by Agent Wu that there is only ONE way you can legally own one as a civvy. That would be for DRMO to fuck up and sell you one and you have the receipt. Any other way such as LE sales and such is no go. I can't buy one outside the country because the minute I import it I break the law. Could this whole thing be fought out in court ? Sure, I could tell Wu to pound sand and make him get a subpena for my laser and I will see him in court. I highly doubt they could convince a jury I stole anything provided I bought it on ebay or some other legal channel. I will still lose the case and my laser. I will be out the cost of my laser and my legal bills. I am also fighting a entity that can print its own money and has unlimited funds to make my life a living hell. I am not going to be the guinea pig. Maybe on some off chance I win and get to keep my laser ? I still spent thousands plus countless hours of my life over a $1500 laser I can covertly buy anytime I want. Moral to the story and what I tell everybody is to say nothing and don't post pictures. I could care less if someone has a evil laser. I think the law is stupid. Maybe kitchen knifes should be under FDA control. If you happen to be lucky enough to own one without Wu smacking your nuts I am happy. Most will fold under the pressure when Wu tells you to turn it in or face prosecution. Stolen or not never had any bearing on this and Wu used that to his advantage. I would love to see someone hash it out with him and the .Gov in court. I think they will lose but I tend to root for the underdog !
All this said almost anyone with a little savvy could have a 3b laser in their hands covertly with little effort. I like the GCP (don't own one ). Just keep your mouth shut and Wu has no power over you. Us night vision guys really irk him. Light sabers for the win !!! I guess I'm fortunate in that legally I don't personally "own" anything... which is the "other" way (well, half of it anyway). Your stuff goes in a trust too? I wondered if anyone else did that. Maybe a business? |
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Quoted: Just wondering... why does FDA have any say on these at all? It is neither food, nor drug, nor "medical device." |
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Quoted:
I guess I'm fortunate in that legally I don't personally "own" anything... which is the "other" way (well, half of it anyway). Quoted:
Quoted:
I was told by Agent Wu that there is only ONE way you can legally own one as a civvy. That would be for DRMO to fuck up and sell you one and you have the receipt. Any other way such as LE sales and such is no go. I can't buy one outside the country because the minute I import it I break the law. Could this whole thing be fought out in court ? Sure, I could tell Wu to pound sand and make him get a subpena for my laser and I will see him in court. I highly doubt they could convince a jury I stole anything provided I bought it on ebay or some other legal channel. I will still lose the case and my laser. I will be out the cost of my laser and my legal bills. I am also fighting a entity that can print its own money and has unlimited funds to make my life a living hell. I am not going to be the guinea pig. Maybe on some off chance I win and get to keep my laser ? I still spent thousands plus countless hours of my life over a $1500 laser I can covertly buy anytime I want. Moral to the story and what I tell everybody is to say nothing and don't post pictures. I could care less if someone has a evil laser. I think the law is stupid. Maybe kitchen knifes should be under FDA control. If you happen to be lucky enough to own one without Wu smacking your nuts I am happy. Most will fold under the pressure when Wu tells you to turn it in or face prosecution. Stolen or not never had any bearing on this and Wu used that to his advantage. I would love to see someone hash it out with him and the .Gov in court. I think they will lose but I tend to root for the underdog !
All this said almost anyone with a little savvy could have a 3b laser in their hands covertly with little effort. I like the GCP (don't own one ). Just keep your mouth shut and Wu has no power over you. Us night vision guys really irk him. Light sabers for the win !!! I guess I'm fortunate in that legally I don't personally "own" anything... which is the "other" way (well, half of it anyway). This is how smart people do it. ;-) |
Every swinging dick hog hunter in Texas has IIB lasers. Must be a ton of sticky fingers in the armories or people in charge turning a blind eye if every single one of them is stolen. Don't own one or need one myself as I use my handsome looks to lure those nasty sows to my lair as you can see from my avatar.
Edit: meant IIIb, not IIB. |
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Quoted:
Every swinging dick hog hunter in Texas has IIB lasers. Must be a ton of sticky fingers in the armories or people in charge turning a blind eye if every single one of them is stolen. Don't own one or need one myself as I use my handsome looks to lure those nasty sows to my lair as you can see from my avatar. I would say the vast majority are not stolen. One of the lasers Wu snapped up was legally purchased from a chap in the UK. They still took it as it violated import laws. The Gov hands them down to all sorts of LE departments or other Gov entities. Folks ignore the law and sell them to civvys. Then it winds up on eBay or wherever. You buy your laser and next thing you know you get a threatening phone call from Agent laser man. They are easy to buy outside the country and some guy in UK, AU or wherever could not care less about selling you one. Customs probably would not know what it was is they fell over it. I agree most are not stolen at all. Problem is that it makes no difference whether it is stolen or not. They will confiscate it if they find out you have one. Sucks, but that is what it is.
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Since its damn near impossible for legal civvy ownerships its a safe bet when a PEQ shows up for sale ( public ) its wondered off from its original owner/s.
Some departments were pretty lax years back and allowed individual officer purchase various things on department letterhead. Hi cap mags when they were banned , optics , etc. I wonder if any PEQ-15's fell into the category ? If so its still a loose / loose proposition to purchase as a civvy. Its a shame that you can buy a class 3 weapon but cant be trusted with a frigging laser. |
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