Posted: 8/4/2016 8:45:08 PM EDT
Rock Island 2011 Tac Ultra MS 10mm. Roughly 200 rounds through it now. Every other magazine (same mag) this happens. I've tried ppu 10mm, sig elite, even hand loads and they all do this. Sometimes first half of the mag, sometimes the second. No rhyme or reason. Even tried a chip mccormick power plus 10 rounder, as well as a wilson combat 47T 10 rounder, and same thing.
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Looks to be a magazine Issue and/or a extractor Issue or even a recoil spring Issue...I would first:
>Try a different magazine of known good reliability/quality...(which you have tried a few). >Check the extractor to see what the tension is like, also check for any burrs or sharp edges, etc. (some extractors on 1911's need to be tuned and polished to feed correctly). >Check you have the correct recoil spring weight/tension for your caliber/loads... It looks to be more of a extractor Issue from what I see in the pics and from your describing so far...If in fact it turns out to be a extractor Issue the easiest road may be to swap out the original extractor with a very high quality one like a: Wilson Combat Bulletproof Extractor, EGW, Ed Brown, Fusion, etc. which typically need little to no tuning from the box... If all else fails or you can't seem to figure out why it continues to jam/mis-feed then give the factory c/s a call and explain the problems you are having... Good luck. |
| Oh and my rear sight magically drifted itself hard left, (lpa sight) so I zeroed it back,and so far so good, but Im curious how that happened being it sees the inside of its foam padded box 95% off is days, the other 5% being when I shot the thing. I really might just try to sell it. My match 45s weren't this finicky. |
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You're using 45ACP magazines in a 10mm.... that would be the first place I'd look.  Quoted:
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Rock Island 2011 Tac Ultra MS 10mm..... .... tried a chip mccormick power plus 10 rounder, as well as a wilson combat 47T 10 rounder... You're using 45ACP magazines in a 10mm.... that would be the first place I'd look. Oh wow I completely overlooked that...for the 10mm its the Wilson 47 NX (9 rds) and the CMC is also a (9 rd) mag for the 10mm (Night Hawk Custom), you are correct that he listed the 45 cal versions... But the factory mag is giving him the same Issues...? So what gives, if he is using the correct 10mm factory mag (normally a good quality ACT mag that is shipped with the pistol when brand new). Also, the factory new guns are normally test fired for function and accuracy before it leaves the shop (although it certainly does not guarantee it won't have Issues). |
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The three point jams illustrated in the bottom 2 pictures aren't magazine issues. Time to call customer service and send the gun in for repairs if the ammunition is within spec. Agreed. More than mag issues here. Look at the pictures of the gun behind the ejection port. The brass dings are on top of the slide almost. Extractor and/or ejector issues. |
| Just to confirm, the original mag is the one Ive javing issues with as well as the aftermarkets. I did trade my cmc 10 rounder for a wilson combat 10rnd and it seems better, at least itll run the ball shaped sig elite ammo. And in case anyone was wondering, im running 10rnd 45 mags because nobody makes a 10 round 10mm mag. If they did I would have bought those instead. |
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Just to confirm, the original mag is the one Ive javing issues with as well as the aftermarkets. I did trade my cmc 10 rounder for a wilson combat 10rnd and it seems better, at least itll run the ball shaped sig elite ammo. And in case anyone was wondering, im running 10rnd 45 mags because nobody makes a 10 round 10mm mag. If they did I would have bought those instead. I am not quite sure why you are expecting .45 ACP caliber specific magazines to work/work better with a pistol designed for the 10mm Auto caliber/cambering...? The magazine width and dimensions are caliber/round specific...which brings us back to the fact that: >You say your having the same Issue with the factory Issued 10mm magazine that came with your new pistol... >The .45 ACP caliber magazines you have tried are not much better than your stock 10mm magazine... >You have tried several other brands of ammo with the same results, so it would seem it is not a ammo Issue... So, this would likely rule out a magazine Issue and/or a ammunition related Issue so far for now...although, personally I would of tried at least one or two different 10mm magazines even though most are 9 rounders... It sure looks like (as originally stated) at this point It is a extractor Issue, the 3 point jams and vertical stove piping are the Indications pointing to the extractor as the main culprit... Often (as a side note) when you go to non standard (factory) capacity mags (usually higher capacity versions) you may get feeding and/or extraction/ejection Issues as a result, just something to consider when selecting mags... In any event good luck. |
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Just to confirm, the original mag is the one Ive javing issues with as well as the aftermarkets. I did trade my cmc 10 rounder for a wilson combat 10rnd and it seems better, at least itll run the ball shaped sig elite ammo. And in case anyone was wondering, im running 10rnd 45 mags because nobody makes a 10 round 10mm mag. If they did I would have bought those instead. I beg to differ. I have some for my STI 1911 in 10mm. They're not cheap, but they're there.
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| If they work I'll buy them. Ignorant question. I know in a 45 (at least the 1911s I've had) they don't generally feed truncated cone projectiles. Most 40/10mm projectiles seem to be cones. It's it reasonable to expect the 10mm was made to feed cone ammo? Or should I expect the same issue since it's still a 1911? |
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If they work I'll buy them. Ignorant question. I know in a 45 (at least the 1911s I've had) they don't generally feed truncated cone projectiles. Most 40/10mm projectiles seem to be cones. It's it reasonable to expect the 10mm was made to feed cone ammo? Or should I expect the same issue since it's still a 1911? Most 10mm 1911s have ramped barrels so that's a nonissue. |
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That a 10mm may not work in a non-10mm mag.......... Quoted:
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I use Wilson ETM 45 ACP mags in my 10mm. Your point? That a 10mm may not work in a non-10mm mag.......... I've been using 45 ACP mags in 10mm's since the 90s, especially when 10mm 1911 mags were rare and expensive as hell. Most modern style 1911 45 ACP mags the lip is rolled over more than the old GI style so it will hold a 10mm as well as a 45 without issue. Wilson 45 ACP mags should work with all 10mm 1911s. |
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Did most everyone else overlook this part?  Quoted:
im running 10rnd 45 mags because nobody makes a 10 round 10mm mag Did most everyone else overlook this part? Yeah let's start with the obvious just to rule some things out. -10mm in .45 mags -Personal handloads -Probably an action spring that is too light for your loads, look at where the brass is smacking the top of the slide near the port... |
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The pictures show three point feed way jams which aren't magazine issues.
I've had exactly the same issue with a very early production example E Series 1911 TA and after trying to repair the gun twice, the manufacturer replaced my pistol with one with a totally re-profiled feed ramp which was incorporated in all further production pistols. |
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That a 10mm may not work in a non-10mm mag.......... Quoted:
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I use Wilson ETM 45 ACP mags in my 10mm. Your point? That a 10mm may not work in a non-10mm mag.......... Exactly... the top photo (the one with the live round trapped between the breech-face and the barrel extension) in the original post would indicate that rounds that are popping out of the magazine under recoil. This can be symptomatic of a bad/faulty magazine. This doesn't mean there aren't other issues present but until you try feeding the gun out of good quality magazines specific to the caliber it will be hard to diagnose any other potential issues the pistol is having. |
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Exactly... the top photo (the one with the live round trapped between the breech-face and the barrel extension) in the original post would indicate that rounds that are popping out of the magazine under recoil. This can be symptomatic of a bad/faulty magazine. This doesn't mean there aren't other issues present but until you try feeding the gun out of good quality magazines specific to the caliber it will be hard to diagnose any other potential issues the pistol is having. Quoted:
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I use Wilson ETM 45 ACP mags in my 10mm. Your point? That a 10mm may not work in a non-10mm mag.......... Exactly... the top photo (the one with the live round trapped between the breech-face and the barrel extension) in the original post would indicate that rounds that are popping out of the magazine under recoil. This can be symptomatic of a bad/faulty magazine. This doesn't mean there aren't other issues present but until you try feeding the gun out of good quality magazines specific to the caliber it will be hard to diagnose any other potential issues the pistol is having. That still means there's something wrong with the gun because 10mm shooters have been using 45 ACP magazines with no issues since the Delta came out. My guess it's the ramp. |
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Two points I want to point out...
A.) These issues/ were all taken when fed out of the factory supplied 10mm magazine. B.) Additionally, the same issues were had with both Chip Mccormick power plus 10 round 45 magazines as well as 10 round Wilson Combat 10 round 47T 45acp magazines, which, though wrong caliber, have been told by countless old timers should work just fine, as the 10mm was originally designed to work with 45acp magazines and b.) I don't consider either to be "inferior quality". Local 'smith put it like this when I informed him of the situation, he told me basically you have people with little knowledge on actual gunsmithing putting guns together, then you throw 10mm into the mix, you're going to have problems. Should have known better, lesson learned. No more Rock Islands. Should have stuck with my gut instinct. Now off to that Dan Wesson Discretion 45 I saw somewhere... |
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This type of stovepipe is a common occurrence when using a 147gr projectile in a HK P7. The gun was designed for a 124gr bullet (147 not yet aroundat the time of design) so heavier projectiles tend to send the slide back at higher velocities. When the faster moving slide hits the back of the frame it may cause the next bullet in the mag to "turtle-head" out a little (if the mag springs are weak). The slide then returning to battery picks-up the round that's just barely being held by the feed lips and kicks it out nose-up resulting in the kind of failure you illustrate.
Because there doesn't seem to be many other circumstances that would result in a nose-up failure, I would have to bet that there is something similar gong on with you. I would certainly consider the incorrect mag with perhaps weak springs and would also possibly consider a stronger recoil spring. Hope you get it straightened out. |
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Two points I want to point out... A.) These issues/ were all taken when fed out of the factory supplied 10mm magazine. B.) Additionally, the same issues were had with both Chip Mccormick power plus 10 round 45 magazines as well as 10 round Wilson Combat 10 round 47T 45acp magazines, which, though wrong caliber, have been told by countless old timers should work just fine, as the 10mm was originally designed to work with 45acp magazines and b.) I don't consider either to be "inferior quality". Local 'smith put it like this when I informed him of the situation, he told me basically you have people with little knowledge on actual gunsmithing putting guns together, then you throw 10mm into the mix, you're going to have problems. Should have known better, lesson learned. No more Rock Islands. Should have stuck with my gut instinct. Now off to that Dan Wesson Discretion 45 I saw somewhere... The Dan Wesson 10mm I bought literally could not get through a full mag. Cursory inspection of the feed ramp showed a ridiculous state of affairs. I had to cut back the ramp considerably before it would run as intended. |
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The Dan Wesson 10mm I bought literally could not get through a full mag. Cursory inspection of the feed ramp showed a ridiculous state of affairs. I had to cut back the ramp considerably before it would run as intended. Quoted:
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Two points I want to point out... A.) These issues/ were all taken when fed out of the factory supplied 10mm magazine. B.) Additionally, the same issues were had with both Chip Mccormick power plus 10 round 45 magazines as well as 10 round Wilson Combat 10 round 47T 45acp magazines, which, though wrong caliber, have been told by countless old timers should work just fine, as the 10mm was originally designed to work with 45acp magazines and b.) I don't consider either to be "inferior quality". Local 'smith put it like this when I informed him of the situation, he told me basically you have people with little knowledge on actual gunsmithing putting guns together, then you throw 10mm into the mix, you're going to have problems. Should have known better, lesson learned. No more Rock Islands. Should have stuck with my gut instinct. Now off to that Dan Wesson Discretion 45 I saw somewhere... The Dan Wesson 10mm I bought literally could not get through a full mag. Cursory inspection of the feed ramp showed a ridiculous state of affairs. I had to cut back the ramp considerably before it would run as intended. That is fucking bullshit and unacceptable for Dan Wesson. Is it a post-factory-fire one? I swear they never got their shit together after that. When people ask me why I have a custom 10mm, it's because that's how much you need to pay someone who knows what they're doing to build it right 
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Two points I want to point out... A.) These issues/ were all taken when fed out of the factory supplied 10mm magazine. B.) Additionally, the same issues were had with both Chip Mccormick power plus 10 round 45 magazines as well as 10 round Wilson Combat 10 round 47T 45acp magazines, which, though wrong caliber, have been told by countless old timers should work just fine, as the 10mm was originally designed to work with 45acp magazines and b.) I don't consider either to be "inferior quality". Local 'smith put it like this when I informed him of the situation, he told me basically you have people with little knowledge on actual gunsmithing putting guns together, then you throw 10mm into the mix, you're going to have problems. Should have known better, lesson learned. No more Rock Islands. Should have stuck with my gut instinct. Now off to that Dan Wesson Discretion 45 I saw somewhere... Thanks for providing the information that the difficulties with your 1911 aren't magazine related. |
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That is fucking bullshit and unacceptable for Dan Wesson. Is it a post-factory-fire one? I swear they never got their shit together after that. When people ask me why I have a custom 10mm, it's because that's how much you need to pay someone who knows what they're doing to build it right Quoted:
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Two points I want to point out... A.) These issues/ were all taken when fed out of the factory supplied 10mm magazine. B.) Additionally, the same issues were had with both Chip Mccormick power plus 10 round 45 magazines as well as 10 round Wilson Combat 10 round 47T 45acp magazines, which, though wrong caliber, have been told by countless old timers should work just fine, as the 10mm was originally designed to work with 45acp magazines and b.) I don't consider either to be "inferior quality". Local 'smith put it like this when I informed him of the situation, he told me basically you have people with little knowledge on actual gunsmithing putting guns together, then you throw 10mm into the mix, you're going to have problems. Should have known better, lesson learned. No more Rock Islands. Should have stuck with my gut instinct. Now off to that Dan Wesson Discretion 45 I saw somewhere... The Dan Wesson 10mm I bought literally could not get through a full mag. Cursory inspection of the feed ramp showed a ridiculous state of affairs. I had to cut back the ramp considerably before it would run as intended. That is fucking bullshit and unacceptable for Dan Wesson. Is it a post-factory-fire one? I swear they never got their shit together after that. When people ask me why I have a custom 10mm, it's because that's how much you need to pay someone who knows what they're doing to build it right It was definitely pre-fire. Just adds fuel to your comment that not everybody has cracked the 10mm code. |
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Just to confirm, the original mag is the one Ive javing issues with as well as the aftermarkets. I did trade my cmc 10 rounder for a wilson combat 10rnd and it seems better, at least itll run the ball shaped sig elite ammo. And in case anyone was wondering, im running 10rnd 45 mags because nobody makes a 10 round 10mm mag. If they did I would have bought those instead. They've been making them for years. http://www.trippresearch.com/store/store_1911.html |
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The release point of mag lips varies between the calibers on 1911s.
It can even need alteration to feed different bullet shapes. An RN covers a lot of sins by rattling into the chamber anyway. The extractor may snap over the rim instead of the rim sliding up under the extractor. FP and SWCs do not leave as much room for error. |
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Quoted: Finally fixed my issue. Traded it for a Glock G43. Problem solved. |