Posted: 6/12/2009 1:13:12 PM EDT
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My dad is looking at getting a handgun in .45 auto. He's tried all the polymer pistols, but he just loves how the 1911 feels.
He wants a 70 series, but with a 4'' or 4.25'' barrel. We want it to be under $1000, so no Wilson Combats or Les Baers or Nighthawks. I was thinking a Springfield of some kind. A loaded or GI. Any help from you 1911 gurus would be great. Thanks. |
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4" or 4.25" gives you ONLY 2 platforms if he wants a full frame 1911: the 4.25 Colt Commander, and the 4" Springfield Champion,
If he requires a pre-80 firing system, then all Colt Commanders made after 1983 are disqualified (unless disabling the Series 80 safety counts), so make sure he's adamant about this. Between the two, the choice is simple for me. the 4.25" Commander is much better balanced then the ass-heavy Champion. 4" top ends belong on compacts, not full frames, IMO. In addition, the shorter you go, the narrower the margin for reliability is, which becomes something to consider on production pistols. Finally, the 4" bull barrel is going to require religious recoil spring changes every 1,500 rounds and the 4" springs have to be ordered because usually no stores stock them. Even if it came down to a used Colt Commander or a new SA Champion, I would take the Commander. All my Commanders are pre-80 and bought used. |
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Take a serious look at Colt. They've been making 1911's for a long time. 100 yrs. or so. Colt knows how to make a 1911. Good luck. Let us know what you and your Dad decide to do. Are the 80s series good in your opinion? I think the only commanders they currently make are 80s series. Is the trigger pull really that much worse on 80s series than 70 series? |
| As I said, ALL Commaders after 1983 are Series 80 models. Are they "good"? They are about as good as any other Colt. Is the trigger pull seriously degraded with a S80? I would say that it is subjective, but unless this is some match/competition gun the difference if perceptible with a pre-80 will be negligable, especially on a defensive pistol. |
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Quoted: the difference if perceptible with a pre-80 will be negligable, especially on a defensive pistol.
+1 for pulpsmack. I avoided 80 series pistols for ages. I also wanted a Commander, preferrably Colt. I spent the last 2 years searching on and off, and finally the best one for the money I found was an 80. I bought a very, very lightly used Colt 1991 Series 80 Commander out of the classifieds here, in a local FTF transaction, $600. What a great gun. The trigger is almost as good as my custom caspians, and better than either of the two (original, 1974 and 1980) Series 70s I have. I think new they do about $750. The XSE line of Colt will be more like $1k, but the 1991/80 series is very, very nice. Tall sights, lowered (but not flared) ejection port, long trigger and flat MSH. It is fine for carry or plinking right out of the box. The fit and finish were excellent. |
| Also take a look at the STI line of 1911s. I bought a Ranger II in 45ACP a couple of months ago for $1026.00 at a local shop that charges full retail. You should be able to do better from one of the internet dealers. By the way the Ranger II is as accurate as my Kimber Pro Carry and is a series 70 pistol, no freaking firing pin safety!! Fit and finish is a step up from Kimber, it's a great pistol. |
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4" or 4.25" gives you ONLY 2 platforms if he wants a full frame 1911: the 4.25 Colt Commander, and the 4" Springfield Champion, If he requires a pre-80 firing system, then all Colt Commanders made after 1983 are disqualified (unless disabling the Series 80 safety counts), so make sure he's adamant about this. Between the two, the choice is simple for me. the 4.25" Commander is much better balanced then the ass-heavy Champion. 4" top ends belong on compacts, not full frames, IMO. In addition, the shorter you go, the narrower the margin for reliability is, which becomes something to consider on production pistols. Finally, the 4" bull barrel is going to require religious recoil spring changes every 1,500 rounds and the 4" springs have to be ordered because usually no stores stock them. Even if it came down to a used Colt Commander or a new SA Champion, I would take the Commander. All my Commanders are pre-80 and bought used. Only pictures I have of you (before the crash)are of you on a Harley with two revolvers! Are you a pistol guy also? And how are you recuperating? Bob 
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| Aside from the Springers, I agree w/the gent who suggested you check out the STI series. They are getting some really good press lately. I'd also suggest you take a look at the Dan Wesson series as well. Although, it could be a real trick to keep any of these under $1K unless you either consider used or run into a really good deal somewhere. Markup is phenomenal right now. |
| Colt or Springfield. If you want a 70 series type, then go with Springfield. They use a Titanium firing pin and extra power firing pin spring as a FP safety instead of the series 80 or Swartz type. My loaded Champion runs great. Springfield customer service is top notch also. Colt may take months to get something done. If you want to go less than $500, RIA makes a really decent 1911. It does have a cast frame but mil spec parts are exchangable and they are getting a good reputation. |
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Quoted:
Quoted:
4" or 4.25" gives you ONLY 2 platforms if he wants a full frame 1911: the 4.25 Colt Commander, and the 4" Springfield Champion, If he requires a pre-80 firing system, then all Colt Commanders made after 1983 are disqualified (unless disabling the Series 80 safety counts), so make sure he's adamant about this. Between the two, the choice is simple for me. the 4.25" Commander is much better balanced then the ass-heavy Champion. 4" top ends belong on compacts, not full frames, IMO. In addition, the shorter you go, the narrower the margin for reliability is, which becomes something to consider on production pistols. Finally, the 4" bull barrel is going to require religious recoil spring changes every 1,500 rounds and the 4" springs have to be ordered because usually no stores stock them. Even if it came down to a used Colt Commander or a new SA Champion, I would take the Commander. All my Commanders are pre-80 and bought used. Only pictures I have of you (before the crash)are of you on a Harley with two revolvers! Are you a pistol guy also? And how are you recuperating? Bob
1911 guy first and foremost, and just starting to walk sans crutches. Thanks for asking. |
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I LOVE my 4" Kimber.
the Pro CDP II Kimber Pro CDP II It's my daily carry piece. |
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Quoted:
Is the trigger pull seriously degraded with a S80? I would say that it is subjective, but unless this is some match/competition gun the difference if perceptible with a pre-80 will be negligable, especially on a defensive pistol. S80 allows for prefectly fine triggers, in all but dedicated competition guns (when you start into 2# territory, the extra S80 parts aren't so great). For your typical 4# carry trigger jobs, S80 isn't going to be any perceptibly worse than a pre-80. |
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There's also used Norinco 1911's that people rave about for being rugged as a rhino and they are in the $400-$500 range. Those Norincos (when you can find em) are rugged beasts assuming you follow the proper procedure upon getting one... 1) strip to frame / slide + Pile of norinco parts. 2) dispose of everything but frame and slide. 3) rebuild with good parts on the Norinco frame and slide. That all being said... I'm guessing the OP doesn't want the fuss and muss of making the Norinco a good shooter. Not to mention the fact that stock Norinco's were all 5" weren't they? OP wants 4.25" size. |
| I have a LW XSE Commander. It shoots well. My only other thought was the Dan Wesson Bobtail (all stainless; about $1000; series 70) and the Smith $ Wesson PD (blued; about $860; light weight). For the money I don't think you can do better than those three. If I knew more about the Commander size Sig I might include them too and they are under $1000. |