[ARCHIVED THREAD] - Looking for a subcompact 9 (Page 1 of 2)
Posted: 3/26/2012 5:48:17 PM EDT
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I am in the market for a subcompact 9mm for those instances where my G19 or Sig P239 is too large to carry.
I am looking at the Kahr PM9, Ruger LC9, Beretta Nano, and Walther PPS. No one around me has a Nano in stock to look at. Has anyone compared these handguns? Specifically, in terms of size, trigger pull, capacity, etc. |
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A friend of mine who is very well versed in handguns bought an LC9 and let me try it out.
My first impression was that it was a piece of crap with a flimsy plastic guide rod. My first impression was wrong, it is an accurate and reliable little pistol and if I had need of a very small, slim, 9mm pistol it would be my choice. |
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Are you looking for a subcompact 9mm or pocket 9? Subcompact 9mm would be a G26, XD subcompact, PX4 subcompact and the like. If your looking for a pocket or slim 9mm, the LC9, Nano, Solo and even the new Sig P938 coming out would be good choices. When I think of pocket pistols, I think of the LCP, bodyguard 380, etc., although I suppose the LC9 might be acceptable as well. I am not looking to pocket carry. I just want something that is small enough and thin enough to carry comfortably while biking, jogging, etc. |
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The Ruger then the Walther in that order. From the 14 of us that shot those and more of the compacts for testing the Ruger was the best; hands down. 12 men and 2 women and all of us were surprised by the control ability and the smoothness of the Ruger. What did you think of the Nano? |
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Since you said subcompacts, I'm going to recommend the G26. I don't know if you meant pocket pistols though as thats what you listed as your current options... I shoot my 26 better than my 17, its a great little gun. this...the 26 is freakishly accurate and reliable.. i ankle carry my 26 during the winter then switch to hip carry with shorts in the summer.. |
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Since you said subcompacts, I'm going to recommend the G26. I don't know if you meant pocket pistols though as thats what you listed as your current options... I shoot my 26 better than my 17, its a great little gun. The 26 is too thick. I want a single stack. I have a 19 and can conceal it as well as a 26. |
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PPS for the win. Very accurate for the size. I am thinking it is going to be between the PPS and Nano. The slide mounted safety is a dealbreaker on the LC9. I like the size and feel of the Kahr PM9, but they seem to be hit or miss in terms of reliability. If anyone has fired a Nano, how is the trigger? |
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PPS for the win. Very accurate for the size. I am thinking it is going to be between the PPS and Nano. The slide mounted safety is a dealbreaker on the LC9. I like the size and feel of the Kahr PM9, but they seem to be hit or miss in terms of reliability. This. I don't know what your budget is, but if you can afford it, the Rohrbaugh R9 trumps them all, IMHO. You can find one used for around $850. I've carried one for quite some time now. I've REALLY wanted to sell it and purchase two pistols with the proceeds, but there's nothing out there I'd be willing to sell it for. The only thing that comes close is the PPS. The only downside to the Rohrbaugh (other than price) is that long DA trigger pull. |
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PPS for the win. Very accurate for the size. I am thinking it is going to be between the PPS and Nano. The slide mounted safety is a dealbreaker on the LC9. I like the size and feel of the Kahr PM9, but they seem to be hit or miss in terms of reliability. If anyone has fired a Nano, how is the trigger? What slide mounted saftey would that be? |
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PPS for the win. Very accurate for the size. I am thinking it is going to be between the PPS and Nano. The slide mounted safety is a dealbreaker on the LC9. I like the size and feel of the Kahr PM9, but they seem to be hit or miss in terms of reliability. If anyone has fired a Nano, how is the trigger? What slide mounted saftey would that be? SAFETY FEATURES include internal lock, manual safety, magazine safety and loaded chamber indicator which provides visual and tactile indication that chamber is loaded. From Ruger's website. The safety is actually under the slide, but I don't feel the need for a manual safety on a carry gun, especially not one with a trigger with as much travel as the LC9. |
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Since you said subcompacts, I'm going to recommend the G26. I don't know if you meant pocket pistols though as thats what you listed as your current options... I shoot my 26 better than my 17, its a great little gun. The 26 is too thick. I want a single stack. I have a 19 and can conceal it as well as a 26. I would have recommended the 26 also, but with this response, I'm on the PPS bandwagon as well. |
| Okay now that the madness has passed, I can only offer a few passing comments on your choices, as I elected to not carry them. My microcompact 9x19 is a Keltech PF9. 100% reliable with 115gr, 124, 125, and 147 grn HPs, and 115 grain ball, and an absolute sonofabitch to shoot :/. It's skinny, which is required of my pocket gun and why the Glocks is obviously ruled out. Because it's skinny, the recoil impulse is distributed over a small area and it hurts. It's a 9mm. How bad can it hurt? one arfcommer asked. Then he shot it. And instructed me never to bring that firearm into his presence again. Also, the trigger is awful. One good thing, it's a better trigger than an LC9, which is what rules the Ruger out. If you're looking for a 9mm parabellum in the PPK size, like the LC9, PF9, or Taurus whateveritscalled, for a pocket gun, the Keltec is a great choice. If you're looking for another holster gun, there is no sane reason to use a small weapon. The Kahr might be a better shooter with a gentler trigger, and it's smaller. It's also more expensive than my primary carry gun, and I can't justify that for a backup gun that only gets used "when I can't carry a gun". YMMV. |
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Okay now that the madness has passed, I can only offer a few passing comments on your choices, as I elected to not carry them. My microcompact 9x19 is a Keltech PF9. 100% reliable with 115gr, 124, 125, and 147 grn HPs, and 115 grain ball, and an absolute sonofabitch to shoot :/. It's skinny, which is required of my pocket gun and why the Glocks is obviously ruled out. Because it's skinny, the recoil impulse is distributed over a small area and it hurts. It's a 9mm. How bad can it hurt? one arfcommer asked. Then he shot it. And instructed me never to bring that firearm into his presence again. Also, the trigger is awful. One good thing, it's a better trigger than an LC9, which is what rules the Ruger out. If you're looking for a 9mm parabellum in the PPK size, like the LC9, PF9, or Taurus whateveritscalled, for a pocket gun, the Keltec is a great choice. If you're looking for another holster gun, there is no sane reason to use a small weapon. The Kahr might be a better shooter with a gentler trigger, and it's smaller. It's also more expensive than my primary carry gun, and I can't justify that for a backup gun that only gets used "when I can't carry a gun". YMMV. Looks like you got a good Kel-Tec, but from past experiences they are hit or miss as well. I know what you mean about severe recoil. You should try a Kel-Tec in 40. To say that it was unpleasant to shoot was an understatement. It would also FTE every 3-4 rounds. I'm leaning more and more towards the PPS |
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Okay now that the madness has passed, I can only offer a few passing comments on your choices, as I elected to not carry them. My microcompact 9x19 is a Keltech PF9. 100% reliable with 115gr, 124, 125, and 147 grn HPs, and 115 grain ball, and an absolute sonofabitch to shoot :/. It's skinny, which is required of my pocket gun and why the Glocks is obviously ruled out. Because it's skinny, the recoil impulse is distributed over a small area and it hurts. It's a 9mm. How bad can it hurt? one arfcommer asked. Then he shot it. And instructed me never to bring that firearm into his presence again. Also, the trigger is awful. One good thing, it's a better trigger than an LC9, which is what rules the Ruger out. If you're looking for a 9mm parabellum in the PPK size, like the LC9, PF9, or Taurus whateveritscalled, for a pocket gun, the Keltec is a great choice. If you're looking for another holster gun, there is no sane reason to use a small weapon. The Kahr might be a better shooter with a gentler trigger, and it's smaller. It's also more expensive than my primary carry gun, and I can't justify that for a backup gun that only gets used "when I can't carry a gun". YMMV. Looks like you got a good Kel-Tec, but from past experiences they are hit or miss as well. I know what you mean about severe recoil. You should try a Kel-Tec in 40. To say that it was unpleasant to shoot was an understatement. It would also FTE every 3-4 rounds. I'm leaning more and more towards the PPS given the severe perceived recoil of the PF40, I'd suggest those failures may have been "limp gripping". not that there was anything wrong with your grip, just that a crazy grip is requred. I'll also concede that pistol was dicontinued for some reason. |
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PPS Kahrs are gilded junk, the Nano is too new to be proven, and the only gun that has a worse trigger than the LC9, is the LCR. are u sure its worse? I meant the LCP. These three letter names are getting confusing. The LCR is bad, but not that bad. |
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PPS Kahrs are gilded junk, the Nano is too new to be proven, and the only gun that has a worse trigger than the LC9, is the LCR. are u sure its worse? I meant the LCP. These three letter names are getting confusing. The LCR is bad, but not that bad. ruger is starting to adopt the para ordnance product branding phiosophy. I meant are you sure the LCP is worse than the LC9? I assumed you meant the pistol instead of the LCR, more of a citrus to citrus comparison. |
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Brother, almost everything is hit or miss on reliability. I had a 9mm PPS that would jam up on hollow points. I've owned three Kahrs that all ran/run great. I'm not saying Kahr is better than the Walther, just making a point. The PPS is a bit bigger than the PM/CM9.
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Brother, almost everything is hit or miss on reliability. I had a 9mm PPS that would jam up on hollow points. I've owned three Kahrs that all ran/run great. I'm not saying Kahr is better than the Walther, just making a point. The PPS is a bit bigger than the PM/CM9. I hear ya. I bought a NIB Gen 3 Glock 19 about 6 months ago that suffered from the erratic ejection problem. Gun would occassionally stovepipe. It seems almost every manufacturer has let quality control slip a little. The PPS is a little bigger than I initially thought it would be. I like the size of the PM9 and the Nano. Most folks say the Kahr has a better trigger. The Nano apparantly had some teething problems with the extractor, but I think they have that worked out. I |
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I have an LC9 and shot 200rds of wwb through it this week. It is accurate, reliable(so far) and soft shooting. I tried the kel-tec before I bought this, and couldn't believe how much more recoil it had, compared to the Ruger. I will be ordering some aftermarket trigger parts though, lol. Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile |
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I have an LC9 and shot 200rds of wwb through it this week. It is accurate, reliable(so far) and soft shooting. I tried the kel-tec before I bought this, and couldn't believe how much more recoil it had, compared to the Ruger. I will be ordering some aftermarket trigger parts though, lol. Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile[/quot The things that turned me off the LC9 were the long trigger pull, manual safety, magazine safety, and at 4.5" it is a little taller than what I am looking for. I am thinking about taking my chances with a Kahr. What are the differences between the CM9 and PM9? |
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PM9
- Polygonal barrel - Dovetail front sight - Comes with two magazines. One of which is a seven round with a finger extension. - Supposedly the slide stop is tool steel - Slide has a more rounded profile along with different roll marks CM9 - Conventional rifling barrel - Pinned front sight - Comes with one magazine? - Supposedly the slide stop is MIM - Slide is cut differently along with different roll marks |
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PPS Kahrs are gilded junk, the Nano is too new to be proven, and the only gun that has a worse trigger than the LC9, is the LCR. are u sure its worse? I meant the LCP. These three letter names are getting confusing. The LCR is bad, but not that bad. ruger is starting to adopt the para ordnance product branding phiosophy. I meant are you sure the LCP is worse than the LC9? I assumed you meant the pistol instead of the LCR, more of a citrus to citrus comparison. Yes. The LCP is almost unshootalbe. I have to question how well it would shoot under stress. The LC9 is slightly better, but may only be because there is more to grab onto, and hence, more leverage for that mile-long 2-ton trigger. Both are better than nothing, and are very sneaky guns. But I'd go PPS in this roundup. Not worth the hassle of trying to make the Rugers "work" for you. The LC9 also has some very small controls that can really slow you down if needed. There is NO reason for that gun to have a safety. |
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Can't help you much on Nano. When available, will report.
Bought my dad a Khar PM9 last year. Yes its pricey and you get what you pay for. Khar new, fresh out of box, no inspection other than function check is dead nuts on out of the box. Walther PPS by all accounts, OK. Ruger wouldn't be a close second. Any caliber less than 9mm shouldn't be a consideration. Your buck, your choice. I'm in same shoes you're in. Have OD green, G19 as bug. Would set it down in a heartbeat for PM9. Dad's PM9 has never, ever, not once failed and that's saying something. He's got two G17s that are more liability in his hands than good. Gettin up and years, bad bout with cancer leaving him weak on left side for muscle removed and diminished motor skills. He accentuates Glocks inherit push-pull weakness for stove pipes. Have yet to see PM9 fail. Quoted:
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PPS for the win. Very accurate for the size. I am thinking it is going to be between the PPS and Nano. The slide mounted safety is a dealbreaker on the LC9. I like the size and feel of the Kahr PM9, but they seem to be hit or miss in terms of reliability. If anyone has fired a Nano, how is the trigger? |
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Can't help you much on Nano. When available, will report. Bought my dad a Khar PM9 last year. Yes its pricey and you get what you pay for. Khar new, fresh out of box, no inspection other than function check is dead nuts on out of the box. Walther PPS by all accounts, OK. Ruger wouldn't be a close second. Any caliber less than 9mm shouldn't be a consideration. Your buck, your choice. I'm in same shoes you're in. Have OD green, G19 as bug. Would set it down in a heartbeat for PM9. Dad's PM9 has never, ever, not once failed and that's saying something. He's got two G17s that are more liability in his hands than good. Gettin up and years, bad bout with cancer leaving him weak on left side for muscle removed and diminished motor skills. He accentuates Glocks inherit push-pull weakness for stove pipes. Have yet to see PM9 fail. Quoted:
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PPS for the win. Very accurate for the size. I am thinking it is going to be between the PPS and Nano. The slide mounted safety is a dealbreaker on the LC9. I like the size and feel of the Kahr PM9, but they seem to be hit or miss in terms of reliability. If anyone has fired a Nano, how is the trigger? I'll probably end up getting a PM9 or CM9. I'm going to wait a bit and see how the Nano pans out first. |
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For warm weather when I need to hide a gun under a t-shirt I go with the Walther PPS 9mm.
I'm a Glock guy and I've always carried a SW J-frame for backup. I've owned 3 different Kahrs but once I bought the PPS there is simply no going back. 100% reliable, accurate, Glock-like trigger and manual of arms...... IMHO it is the answer to the question that Gaston has ignored for years. |
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For warm weather when I need to hide a gun under a t-shirt I go with the Walther PPS 9mm. I'm a Glock guy and I've always carried a SW J-frame for backup. I've owned 3 different Kahrs but once I bought the PPS there is simply no going back. 100% reliable, accurate, Glock-like trigger and manual of arms...... IMHO it is the answer to the question that Gaston has ignored for years. I like the PPS, but want something a little smaller. I think the PM9 would be pretty easy to pocket carry or ankle carry in situations where I need absolute concealment. |
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For warm weather when I need to hide a gun under a t-shirt I go with the Walther PPS 9mm. I'm a Glock guy and I've always carried a SW J-frame for backup. I've owned 3 different Kahrs but once I bought the PPS there is simply no going back. 100% reliable, accurate, Glock-like trigger and manual of arms...... IMHO it is the answer to the question that Gaston has ignored for years. I like the PPS, but want something a little smaller. I think the PM9 would be pretty easy to pocket carry or ankle carry in situations where I need absolute concealment. I had a PM9 that I had done by Bowie Tactical. Front night sight, trigger job, polish chamber, stipple, etc.... It is a great little gun. The gun runs 99% but will occassionally not go into battery. I also think that small autos with traditional mag release buttons run the risk of ejecting the mag under stress The PPS is a touch larger but it's 100% with every round and the mag release addresses the issue from above. I liked it so much I bought a second one with night sights. For any application I need a smaller gun I use a SW airlite or airweight |
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For warm weather when I need to hide a gun under a t-shirt I go with the Walther PPS 9mm. I'm a Glock guy and I've always carried a SW J-frame for backup. I've owned 3 different Kahrs but once I bought the PPS there is simply no going back. 100% reliable, accurate, Glock-like trigger and manual of arms...... IMHO it is the answer to the question that Gaston has ignored for years. I like the PPS, but want something a little smaller. I think the PM9 would be pretty easy to pocket carry or ankle carry in situations where I need absolute concealment. I had a PM9 that I had done by Bowie Tactical. Front night sight, trigger job, polish chamber, stipple, etc.... It is a great little gun. The gun runs 99% but will occassionally not go into battery. I also think that small autos with traditional mag release buttons run the risk of ejecting the mag under stress The PPS is a touch larger but it's 100% with every round and the mag release addresses the issue from above. I liked it so much I bought a second one with night sights. For any application I need a smaller gun I use a SW airlite or airweight Did you send it back to Kahr? Have you ever tried to ankle carry your PPS? If not, do you think it would be feasible? |