Posted: 12/8/2010 10:18:06 AM EDT
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If you were going to choose one based on long term reliability and use, what one would you get and why? The pcr . only 3-4oz lighter than the compact, most other dimensions are comparable.Though the 75 compact can be cocked and locked, and has a finer trigger. Pcr is lighter and, more CCW friendly, decocker.
I'm trying to choose one, some say steel is the way to go and is stronger, but i can find no evidence proving the PCR or P-01 is weaker(worn rails, cracks,nothing). but i just trust steel more, I think the extra weight can be an advantage, but everyone else acts like the pcr weighs a pound less? is 4oz really that much worse. I voted 75 compact as im leaning more towards classic style and know steel reliable. cheaper to upgrade, better trigger. But the PCR is really nice looking also( i think nicer) is lighter, has front slide serrations, i can't decide. I like both, but plan to carry occasionally, but want something that will last without metal fatigue. Maybe a pcr slide on a compact Steele. Weight isn't really a huge deal especially 4oz. The compact is also cheaper to be had. |
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I vote for the Compact only because that is the one I have. ;) I own a bunch of handguns and it has got to be one of the nicest "feeling" handguns I have as far as a high-cap carry gun. Much nicer in my hand than my G-19. Actually I can't for the life of me understand why I even got the Glock. Probably the worst feeling handgun TO ME that I own.
WW |
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CZ 75 Compact, purely because I want a safety, not a decocker. I used to carry my 75 Compact on a regular basis.
Look at it this way. There is no reason to decock a 75 Compact, but if you really want to, you can always do so manually. Get a decocker, and you lose the option. As said, the Compact will have a nicer trigger than the PCR. Also, I shoot all of my 75s with my strong hand thumb resting on top of the safety, like a 1911. It's the most comfortable place to put it, it works as an index point to keep my grip more consistent, and it kills the argument that many make that you could "forget" to disengage the safety. The decocking lever actually gets in my way. |
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The only CZ I would ever consider that isn't all-steel is the 2075 RAMI - and that's only because CZ doesn't make an all-steel subcompact.
I will also not buy any CZ with a silly decocker. My CZs get fired in DA for only two situations - dry-fire (because it's easier to just keep pulling) and when used in USPSA production. I will never, ever carry a CZ in DA, nor do I shoot CZs in DA for any sport where I am allowed per rules to start SA. (This is why I won't shoot IDPA SSP at all.) I do not see any need for DA, really. I was originally planning on converting my EDC (CZ 75C) to SAO, but didn't simply because I didn't feel any action work was really necessary on it at all. If I ever have any internal work done on it, then I will definitely have it converted. And the only capacity in which DA-first-shot carry is "more CCW friendly" is that you reduce the profile of the hammer, possibly reducing likelihood of a snag. But in literally hundreds of draws from concealment (drills and IDPA), I've never had a C&L handgun snag on the hammer. Ever. And the CZ has a relatively small, well-rounded hammer that makes such a possibility even more remote. Stock triggers will be fairly similar between the safety and decocker models (both DA/SA), though there will be a slight edge (on average) to the safety models. They can both be tuned more or less equally. It's the SAOs that have much better triggers, in that they eliminate the vast amounts of take-up in SA that are a side-effect of a 75's DA ability. |
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I concur with everything Walkure said, but I would like to add that the vast amount of take-up with the SA trigger on the DA/SA gun is meaningless if you shoot or dry fire the gun much at all.
The take-up he is referring to is basically just travel you need to pull the trigger though before you reach the "stack", where you feel increased resistance and where further pressure will "break", cause the pistol to fire. So basically when you take aim, you pull the trigger back to the stack, finish your aim, add additional pressure, break, fire. If you do much practice at all, it becomes second nature to pull through that take-up without even thinking about it. When I take aim, I don't think about that take-up, I pull through that take-up automatically. |
| Seems the people who like the steel compact post, and the ones that like alloy don't, I plan to carry the gun frequently but not all the time but also don't really want to buy more than one gun to cover multiple things, like home defense, hiking, target, carry, and etc. A super light gun isn't fun to shoot, a super heavy one not fun to carry. I'm looking for compromises, i don't have the money nor the time to practice on multiple pistol platforms, I want a jack of all trades. Seems the 75 compact fits the bill, but the PCR seems good to, i just don't trust aluminum to steel wear opposed to steel on steel. Some also say a manual safety is not desired on a defense gun? I plan on practicing quite a bit, i can't imagine that after drawing it thousands of times I'd forget the safety is on? Steel I'd imagine would handle +p's without much worry as with the aluminum i'd be weary, though i don't know if i'm justified in thinking this since i have no factual data other than my feelings towards the kinds of metals used and what aluminum handles like in other kinds of machinery, and vs. other heavier metals. |
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Quoted:
Only thing I'd like to say that I didn't already address is that the weight savings you'll have with the aluminum frame is pretty minimal. I really doubt that you'd even notice it when carrying. I personally used to carry my 75 Compact on a regular basis. I read actual figures of around 4oz, that to me seems very minimal, but on the other forums the way they talk about the steel compact vs. p-01 they act like its a Sherman tank vz a miata. I always scratch my head when they bring up the weight thing. I see the extra weight as a plus for control-ability, and longevity(steel), and i can't see why i would trade those two factors in for slight weight loss, maybe if it was like 10oz, but only 4? If i was really worried about weight, i wouldn't be looking at metal at all. |
| Thanks for the help, i was bouncing back and forth between the two, but actually hearing from someone else helps. Thanks for the info, i'm decided on the compact steel. I never really cared for polymer guns, not discounting them just don't like them. but being in a free carry state i figured i need to direct my funds into something other than rifles, and i rather have the extra weight and a fine looking reliable unique pistol with class rather than have the oh i got one of those too polymer guns, or oh you airsoft? so many people have polymer pistols no body cares anymore when they see them, i like being different. Wood grips on a CZ, now theres something to be proud of. |
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No PCR owners here? Well I guess I'll chime in even though I don't carry mine very often. I used to have both, the Compact and the PCR, I sold the Compact to my son.
While I like to carry C&L with my 1911s I never felt the safety on the CZ Compact was as positive as any of my 1911s so I never carried it that way. Both the PCR and the Compact shot really well. There is a weight difference that isn't really apparent in the numbers but I'm sure a good holster would make all the difference in that and you'd have no problem carrying either. I'm not a fan of the DA SA thing but live with it on the PCR. Both of these guns feel great in the hand, so you really can't lose, if you like the C&L idea then I'd buy the Compact if you're going to shoot DA SA anyway I'd buy the PCR. |
| Anybody from the PCR side to make my decision harder? Lots like the decocker over the manual safety. I still have time to decide, but i still don't hear many great things about alloys, but in other guns. Any body have over 30,000 rounds through an alloy PCR? I still like both but no-ones even said anything on the p-01/PCR side. I will admit, I don't like safety's, |
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Kind of sounds like you already have your mind made up. If you plan on carrying it, I can personally recommend the Comptac C-TAC. I carried mine in one and I have a friend who carried with the same setup for a while. Here's mine: http://img291.imageshack.us/img291/2826/postqy3.jpg Couldn't agree more about the ctac from Comp-Tac. |
| Goggle PCR and their NATO testing. You will be impressed. I was and a PCR is now my main CCW. It was everything I was looking for in a CCW. I've always been a Glock guy and still am but the CZ feels so good in the hand and is much easier to shoot accurately. CZs are phenomenal weapons. |