[ARCHIVED THREAD] - M&P Unlocking Issues (Page 1 of 3)
Posted: 3/3/2012 8:37:09 PM EDT
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For those of you who have had locking/unlocking issues with your M&Ps, this should hopefully help you. One of the main reasons for this to happen is that there is a burr on the bottom of the barrel locking lug. Most of the time this is remedied by just shooting the pistol and it should go away. If it doesn't, you can stone the bottom edge of the barrel along the locking lug until it is smooth and can't feel any burr.
What you are looking for is a burr inside of this area. What that burr will do is just put the barrel out of place just a little and that is enough for the slide not to seat fully into position. So what to look for is just to see if your barrel is fully locked up. The slide should be all the way forward and the barrel hood should almost be flush with the top of the slide. 
The other solution was brought up by Dog1. He had vertical stringing problems with his M&P9 after changing out the recoil assembly that had about 6k rounds through it with another factory recoil assembly. So on a lark he switched it out with a guide rod that has a lot heavier spring weight (22 Pounds.) This resolved his problems and he is reporting much better groups. So if you don't feel/see anything wrong with the barrel locking lug, try switching out the recoil assembly with another factory one or an aftermarket one with a higher pound weight. It could be that the new factory recoil assembly spring weight is just too weak. I am still working on this with S&W. In any case, make sure the pistol is properly lubricated. For proper lock up, place one drop on the top front corners of the barrel hood. Now this does not affect a lot of M&Ps on the market, but if you are having some issues, just check out what I described on your gun and post any questions concerns here. |
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Mind telling us exactly how you figured out or came across the information that a "Burr on the bottom of the locking lug" is causing everyones "accuracy" problems. Also, would you mind detailing the mechanics of how and why this "burr" causes the "early unlocking" and subsequent "accuracy" problems? Im not even going to touch on the rest of your post. Ill just leave that info with an Mmmmmmm Hmmmmm, okey dokey. It is also very telling that this "burr" gets better and accuracy magically improves the more you shoot the pistol. Im sure that actual familiarization with the weapon and mastery of the trigger because your actually shooting the gun has absolutely nothing at all to do with the accuracy improvements people with "Burred barrels" see when they shoot the gun for a while. Quoted: For those of you who have had locking/unlocking issues with your M&Ps, this should hopefully help you. One of the main reasons for this to happen is that there is a burr on the bottom of the barrel locking lug. Most of the time this is remedied by just shooting the pistol and it should go away. If it doesn't, you can stone the bottom edge of the barrel along the locking lug until it is smooth and can't feel any burr. The other solution was brought up by Dog1. He had vertical stringing problems with his M&P9 after changing out the recoil assembly that had about 6k rounds through it with another factory recoil assembly. So on a lark he switched it out with a guide rod that has a lot heavier spring weight (22 Pounds.) This resolved his problems and he is reporting much better groups. So if you don't feel/see anything wrong with the barrel locking lug, try switching out the recoil assembly with another factory one or an aftermarket one with a higher pound weight. It could be that the new factory recoil assembly spring weight is just too weak. I am still working on this with S&W. In any case, make sure the pistol is properly lubricated. For proper lock up, place one drop on the top front corners of the barrel hood. If anyone has any questions or further tips, please feel free to post. |
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Thanks for the constructive criticism, go away troll.  Agree. But I would like to hear more about this burr, maybe a more complete description of where to look for it and an explanation of the mechanics of how it effects lockup. And is there a way I can visually check my weapon for the lockup issue? I don't think I have the issue as my pistol is quite accurate and when slowly retracting the slide everything looks normal (to me). But for future reference it'd be nice to know what exactly I'm looking for to know if a pistol has the lockup issue. |
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Thanks for the constructive criticism, go away troll.  Yeah, just what I figured. A post full of conjecture with no hard data to back it up.
You have no ideal what his credentials are, I do. You can stow the attitude or I will have you removed from this forum. This a tech forum, not General Disscusion. If you want to troll or throw your attitude around, try GD. Next time you are gone from this forum. If you want to discuss this, IM me. |
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Quoted:
For those of you who have had locking/unlocking issues with your M&Ps, this should hopefully help you. One of the main reasons for this to happen is that there is a burr on the bottom of the barrel locking lug. Most of the time this is remedied by just shooting the pistol and it should go away. If it doesn't, you can stone the bottom edge of the barrel along the locking lug until it is smooth and can't feel any burr. The other solution was brought up by Dog1. He had vertical stringing problems with his M&P9 after changing out the recoil assembly that had about 6k rounds through it with another factory recoil assembly. So on a lark he switched it out with a guide rod that has a lot heavier spring weight (22 Pounds.) This resolved his problems and he is reporting much better groups. So if you don't feel/see anything wrong with the barrel locking lug, try switching out the recoil assembly with another factory one or an aftermarket one with a higher pound weight. It could be that the new factory recoil assembly spring weight is just too weak. I am still working on this with S&W. In any case, make sure the pistol is properly lubricated. For proper lock up, place one drop on the top front corners of the barrel hood. If anyone has any questions or further tips, please feel free to post. I looked at all of my barrels, 2 threaded, 2 regular ones and did not see any burrs. I do think that the factory 16lb spring is too weak. I have a BT Guide Rods tool coming, that will allow me the ability to install the 22# springs on the stock guide rods. I'll post a thread about the tool when I get it. Right now I'm using one his guide rods with a 22# spring installed in it. So far, I do believe that this could possibly be a solution. I'm going to try to get to the range this week and shoot it at 20-25 yards and see how it is, compaired to my other M&P9 with the stock guide rod. My only concern is that with the 22# spring, will it reliably cycle with a suppressor attached. I'm waiting on approval for a AAC Eco9 can, so as soon as it shows up, I can test it. If it needs be, I can swap out the 22# for either a 17# or 20# and try it. |
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Hmmm.... What would be involved in swapping springs in both my full sized and compact 9mm? Cost? Tools? Can you buy the rod with the heavy spring already installed? Thx ! I got my first rod with spring installed here- http://btguiderods.com/category/smith/ The rod with spring is $40. He also sells the kit to do the changes your self- 
The tool is $38. I got the springs at http://www.rockyourglock.com/parts/GlockRecoilSprings.htm |
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For those of you who have had locking/unlocking issues with your M&Ps, this should hopefully help you. One of the main reasons for this to happen is that there is a burr on the bottom of the barrel locking lug. Most of the time this is remedied by just shooting the pistol and it should go away. If it doesn't, you can stone the bottom edge of the barrel along the locking lug until it is smooth and can't feel any burr. Pictures would be a great help. Quoted:
It could be that the new factory recoil assembly spring weight is just too weak. I am still working on this with S&W. Are you suggesting that S&W may actually be listening to someone on improving the M&P? That would be great. For further information & background, other discussion on M&P lock-up issues are here: M&P Accuracy Discussion M&P Bar-Sto Barrel |
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Any thoughts on the Wolff replacement recoil spring kits? The ISMI springs that Rock your Glock sells,a re considered to be the best out there. Pretty sure Speed Shooters sells them too. I went to a non-captive tungsten guide rod with a slightly heavier (can't remember what poundage off the top of my head) than stock ISMI recoil spring and made a big improvement in grouping and felt recoil. I do remember the first time installing the non-captive ISMI spring in the gun and thinking, "Holy crap this thing is stiff." But yes, the ISMI springs are very good quality, and not too expensive, so you can buy a couple of differing spring weights and try them to see what works best. |
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I got the BT guide rods tool today, here is a review-
http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_5_16/122660_.html&page=1 |
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My M&P does not have that burr and it still wont shoot worth shit, S&W told me to go pound sand when I told them about the problem. I find that hard to believe that they would not look at it. you want me to scan the target and the letter that I got? |
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My M&P does not have that burr and it still wont shoot worth shit, S&W told me to go pound sand when I told them about the problem. I find that hard to believe that they would not look at it. you want me to scan the target and the letter that I got? Sure why not. |
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Group looks fine to me. And did you tell them to look at the striker issue? It's not mentioned in the letter. That group was fired at 15 yards, it looks nothing like that at 25. Yes I was very clear and concise, in my letter when I sent it in. I also mentioned it to the costumer service rep. |
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Group looks fine to me. And did you tell them to look at the striker issue? It's not mentioned in the letter. That group was fired at 15 yards, it looks nothing like that at 25. Yes I was very clear and concise, in my letter when I sent it in. I also mentioned it to the costumer service rep. Ok so your problem is it is shooting high or getting big groups or both? |
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Group looks fine to me. And did you tell them to look at the striker issue? It's not mentioned in the letter. Take a look at this target, the one on the right is CZ 75 with one flyer (my fault) the other one is M&P Shot at 25 yards. 
That is the gun that is supposedly in spec. |
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TA, have you had some one elce shoot the gun? Honestly looking at your group and the group from the S&W rep who shot your firearm, I would say the issue is you (yes I saw 15 yd vs 25 yd) Compare the discrepancy between the CZ and M&P group, same distance same rest. I will shoot it again today and get the range master to shoot it. But I am pretty sure that it is the arrow and not the indian. I think both targets side by side speak for themselves. |
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Do you honestly think that calling them again would help? Any suggestions on what to say /ask? I would tell them again that the accuracy at longer ranges is unacceptable and that you will be sending a 25 yard target. Ask for a superviser, if you think it will help. |
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Ask for Kate Fredette, I believe she is at the top of their customer service department; [email protected]
if she can't help you write directly to: James Debney, President, Firearms Smith&Wesson 2100 Roosevelt Avenue Springfield MA 01104 send your letter registered mail, receipt requested. Good luck. |
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Went back to the range tried magtech and remington ammo too.
The M&P refuses to shoot worth shit This is a 5 shor group shot off the sandbag notice there is only 3 holes, it is that bad: 
It shoots offhand just as bad. I went and rented a G19 from the range, I have not shot a glock in years, the grip feels so wrong and I cant get to the mag release button so I only shot a glock once, this is my second time shooting a glock. 25 yards 5 shot group I had one flyer but I called it: This is off hand by the way 
So yeah I am pretty fu$c#ing sure that it is the arrow and not the indian. |
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Ask for Kate Fredette, I believe she is at the top of their customer service department; [email protected] if she can't help you write directly to: James Debney, President, Firearms Smith&Wesson 2100 Roosevelt Avenue Springfield MA 01104 send your letter registered mail, receipt requested. Good luck. Thank you very much. |
| After reading Troll accounts thread today before heading to the range I decided to swap barrels in my M&P's. I had one that was shooting high and left, but after I switched barrels it was perfectly on at 25yds. The other is just a back up, but I shot it anyway after the swap and it is shooting left now. So it seems to be a issue with this particular barrel. So those of you with multiple pistols should try swapping barrels if you are having accuracy problems. |
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Given the test target from the factory rep versus the widespread reports of inaccuracy from shooters who do well with other pistols, I'm starting to wonder if the M&P is inherently accurate, but is susceptible to shooter related issues that other pistols are more immune to.
We've read posts that that imply "make sure that your trigger finger is in the proper position", or "try a larger grip." So let's say that these DO cure the 'problem'. Then that adds extra variables that we don't have to worry about with other pistols. If I pick up a Glock, put the sights on target and squeeze smoothly, I'm confident that I will hit a target, even if my trigger finger is slightly askew. Picture the following: You need to grab a gun an engage a target ASAP. You pick up an M&P, point it at the target and... Does this one have the proper grip? Let's see. OK, yes it does. Start the squeeze... Oh wait. Is my finger in the proper position. Hmm, check. Squeeze, and ZAP. Good, you hit the target. Now compare that to... You pick up a Glock, point it at the target. Squeeze, and ZAP. Good, you hit the target. Thoughts? |
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Given the test target from the factory rep versus the widespread reports of inaccuracy from shooters who do well with other pistols, I'm starting to wonder if the M&P is inherently accurate, but is susceptible to shooter related issues that other pistols are more immune to. We've read posts that that imply "make sure that your trigger finger is in the proper position", or "try a larger grip." So let's say that these DO cure the 'problem'. Then that adds extra variables that we don't have to worry about with other pistols. If I pick up a Glock, put the sights on target and squeeze smoothly, I'm confident that I will hit a target, even if my trigger finger is slightly askew. Picture the following: You need to grab a gun an engage a target ASAP. You pick up an M&P, point it at the target and... Does this one have the proper grip? Let's see. OK, yes it does. Start the squeeze... Oh wait. Is my finger in the proper position. Hmm, check. Squeeze, and ZAP. Good, you hit the target. Now compare that to... You pick up a Glock, point it at the target. Squeeze, and ZAP. Good, you hit the target. Thoughts? Fundamentals are fundamentals. I've never had a Glock that had a trigger that felt like my other Glocks without me putting a lot of effort into making them consistent. No two firearms, even identical models, are going to be exactly the same. |
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Wish I would have come across this thread when I had my M&P Pro 9, accuracy was horrible. Bought the M&P Pro 40 and its more accurate than I am. I had the same problem with mine shooting about 8 inches low at 10 yards. I finally got my adjustable sights installed, and will be sighting in tomorrow. Hopefully this solves my issue of not being sub side-of-barn. |
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Went back to the range tried magtech and remington ammo too. The M&P refuses to shoot worth shit This is a 5 shor group shot off the sandbag notice there is only 3 holes, it is that bad: http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7186/6960382115_b53cf85a0e_b.jpg It shoots offhand just as bad. I went and rented a G19 from the range, I have not shot a glock in years, the grip feels so wrong and I cant get to the mag release button so I only shot a glock once, this is my second time shooting a glock. 25 yards 5 shot group I had one flyer but I called it: This is off hand by the way http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7177/6814269126_93260ce8c9_b.jpg So yeah I am pretty fu$c#ing sure that it is the arrow and not the indian. Just out of curiosity, how does it shoot for other people? Get a few other people to shoot it for you. I find it interesting that the guy at the factory got it to shoot alright (not great) and that you're having difficulties. Definitely not saying it's your fault; only that perhaps it's how you grip the gun or how you see the sights... See how it prints for other people. |