Posted: 1/13/2005 12:25:50 PM EDT
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Strong rumor has it that Glock will unveil an new 45acp at the SHOT show. Anybody know anything about this? ie, will it be a single stack, taller than the G36 |
UGH! the gayness grows. don't get me wrong. I love my 21, 30, 34, 19... I think that is all I have left. FUCKING COME ON GASTON!! how about stretching the 36 in order to make a friggin single stack .45 in a regular caliber that can actually be shot for a reasonable amount of money? .45 GAP, the .41 mag of the new millenium. |
SING IT BROTHER!!!! |
+1 they should also change the grip so it would FEEL a little more like the 1911 |
Well, I think this states a pretty realistic perspective. Unless these MOFO's come up w/ a single stack, 8 rnd .45 ACP or a magnum they are pretty close to the end of the line as far as new models go... However, I think the .45 GAP blows, since it doesn't make any sense... |
In what way does its sense escape you? .45ACP (or better) performance in a smaller package, allowing it to fit into a firearms platform (G17) that fits smaller hands very well and into which a .45ACP simply will not fit - yep, it makes sense. You certainly don't have to like it (most here don't), but at least come up with a better argument than "it doesn't make any sense." 
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F=M*V I think the .45 GAP would be more accurately described as .45 APC velocity in a .40 weight. It is SUPPOSED to have 230grain loads for it. But all the loads that I seem to see are either 180 or 200 gr loads being tested and the 230s don't seem to be ready for prime time. Thus, it has the performance of neither the .45's weight nor the .40's velocity. Yes, it can be in a smaller package, but if you want an anemic round in a small package... the 9mm already exists. I mean, if you need an excuse to buy a new gun, a whiz-bang new cartridge is as good a reason as any! But I don't think it is going to replace anything else any time soon. |
That goes against every article I've read where the rounds have been tested/chrono'd, but those were all (except for GunTests, and I don't remember if they used a chrono or not) admittedly in magazines which accept advertising $$$ from Glock, so  I'm certainly no ballistics expert and I don't even own a .45GAP yet, so I'm not going to argue the point.The point I was trying to make, and which I will stand by, is that the cartridge (IF it will do any of what is claimed that it will) would fill an unfilled niche and serve a purpose. I don't know if it actually performs anything like is advertised and I won't hazard a guess about its potential. |
I was just satisfying your request for a better argument.  I seriously look at it like the .41. It was bigger than a .357 and can be loaded just as hot, or can be loaded softer so you can do almost everything a .357/38 Spl can do and almost what a .44 can do... much more versatile but at the end of the day, nobody cared. the .45 GAP may be able to do all the same thing a .45 ACP can do in a smaller package, but if it doesn't do it better, why bother? Will it be the cartridge of the small hands niche market? I already own almost all of my pistols in .45. where is the incentive to switch? "it is just as good on paper but without the track record." that is s hell of a tag line...  but hey - excuse to get a new pistol so I'm not saying it is bad. My preference would be for a true single stack .45 APC. |
No, I got that - no offense intended (or taken) by me. 
And therein probably lies most of my interest - I have very small hands (especially for a guy my size  ). I have no problem with 1911s, but double-stack pistols (my personal preference) in .45ACP are somewhat problemmatic for me. I "get by" with my G21, but comparable capabilities in a smaller package (especially grip-size) would mean more to me than it would to most folks with "normal hands." My primary carry gun (for more than 10 years now) is a G19 because I shoot (and carry/conceal FWIW) it better than any comparably-sized pistol I've tried - due in no small part, I'm convinced, by the way it fits my freakishly small hands so well. My only complaint with the G19 is its 9mm chambering - not that I've ever felt particularly undergunned with it (if I did, I wouldn't carry it) and I am very capable with it. But give me the same gun with .45ACP power (or near it) and - IF it is controllable enough for me to learn to shoot it as well as I do my G19 - I am very interested. There may not be a groudswell of interest, but I would also venture to guess that I won't be the only one... I guess what I'm saying is that for those of us for whom hand/grip-size IS an issue, it will be an improvement even if it doesn't do anything a full-size ACP round can't (i.e., something available to us that wasn't before). Did that make sense?... |
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While I don't care for it personally (.40S&W works for my competition and carry needs), the negative reaction to the .45GAP does seem to be a bit kneejerk. There continues to be a strong demand for .45 caliber in the law enforcement market, and grip size has always been an issue for smaller-statured LEOs... the .45GAP might well fill such a niche. Even if it was only available with 180-200gr bullets, there are an awful lot of people who swear by such loads in .45ACP, and so if the .45GAP is ballistically similer then it should do well. Remember that a lot of recreational shooters poopoo'd the .357SIG when it first came out, yet it now has a respectable (if minority) percentage of the LE market. I think a lot of the nay saying will evaporate if/when a major LE organization selects the .45GAP. |
I agree. If some police agencies buy into the "the power of a 45 that your women/little men officers can shoot in the same Glock package you already use" it might survive. Police agencies aren't worried about how cheap they can get a couple of thousand rounds of FMJ to blast on the weekends for fun. |
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At first, I, too, regarded the GAP as a "solution to a nonexistent problem", but the more I think about it, the more I tend to believe that ol' Gaston may not be as dumb as some seem to think. I believe the GAP does, in fact, fill a role that the ACP simply is unable to fill, and with pretty much equal ballistics, it will be at least moderately successful. I will be interested to see what the G23 sized GAP looks and feels like. It could be a definite competitor with the G30 for many ocassional shooters who also carry sometimes, I think, as well as those like Hardshell...and...in the very few places outside the US where civilians are allowed to own handguns, but not in a "military" caliber. Yes, I DO prefer the REAL ACP, but that does not mean I "hate" the GAP. |
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Could be the GAP will be attractive to lots of folks with small hands. However, I don't see any evidence of a hugh demand from l.e. agencies for a .45 service pistol. The .45GAP isn't competing against .45ACP. .45ACP (which I shoot the most of) was displaced in the l.e. community years ago. The .45GAP will be competing against the .40's. While it's true the .45GAP's grip is the same size as a small-frame Glock, the slide is the same width as a G21 slide. The original design for the .45GAP called for a G17-sized slide...didn't work out, so they went with the wider, heavier slide. The bottom line for l.e. agencies is would their officers be better off with 16 rounds of .40 or 11 rounds of .45 GAP in the same frame size? I'd have to go with the larger mag capacity. I comfortably carried a G30 for several years; have gone to a G26. I don't feel undergunned. |
 The purpose of the GAP is fitting a 45 into a small frame Glock. Nothing more. It is for those that need a small frame 45 and are forbidden/chicken to use a 1911 due to the SA trigger system. (stoopid if you ask me) It is second best small .45ACP for those that cannot get the best. (a 1911) |
+1! Or how about making the one gun that has actually had interest for years... hello, the carbine? |
It may be hard for you to believe, but some of us - even those of us who own and enjoy shooting 1911s - still choose the Glock 1st for carry. Some of us aren't even "forbidden" or "chicken." To each his own... 
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I'd camp out to be first in line.
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Personally, I'm still hoping for a single stack compact 10mm. |