Posted: 3/22/2009 8:16:39 PM EDT
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I live in Pa and have a concealed weapons permit and im curious if you are allowed to carry it with self defense rounds?
tHANKS |
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18 Pa. C.S. §6121. Certain Bullets Prohibited.
(a) Offense defined. - It is unlawful for any person to possess, use or attempt to use a KTW teflon-coated bullet or other armor-piercing ammunition while committing or attempting to commit a crime of violence as defined in section 6102 (relating to definitions). (b) Grading. - An offense under this section constitutes a felony of the third degree. (c) Sentencing. - Any person who is convicted in any court of this Commonwealth of a crime of violence and who uses or carries, in the commission of that crime, a firearm loaded with KTW ammunition or any person who violates this section shall, in addition to the punishment provided for the commission of the crime, be sentenced to a term of imprisonment for not less than five years. Notwithstanding any other provision of law, the court shall not suspend the sentence of any person convicted of a crime subject to this subsection nor place him on probation nor shall the term of imprisonment run concurrently with any other term of imprisonment including that imposed for the crime in which the KTW ammunition was being used or carried. No person sentenced under this subsection shall be eligible for parole. (d) Definition. - As used in this section the term “armor-piercing ammunition” means ammunition which, when or if fired from any firearm as defined in section 6102 that is used or attempted to be used in violation of subsection (a) under the test procedure of the National Institute of Law Enforcement and Criminal Justice Standard for the Ballistics Resistance of Police Body Armor promulgated December 1978, is determined to be capable of penetrating bullet-resistant apparel or body armor meeting the requirements of Type hA of Standard NILECJ-STD-0101.01 as formulated by the United States Department of Justice and published in December of 1978. Looks like as long as you are not carrying the dreaded "cop killer" teflon coated bullets - you're good to go. |
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Quoted:
18 Pa. C.S. §6121. Certain Bullets Prohibited. (a) Offense defined. - It is unlawful for any person to possess, use or attempt to use a KTW teflon-coated bullet or other armor-piercing ammunition while committing or attempting to commit a crime of violence as defined in section 6102 (relating to definitions). (b) Grading. - An offense under this section constitutes a felony of the third degree. (c) Sentencing. - Any person who is convicted in any court of this Commonwealth of a crime of violence and who uses or carries, in the commission of that crime, a firearm loaded with KTW ammunition or any person who violates this section shall, in addition to the punishment provided for the commission of the crime, be sentenced to a term of imprisonment for not less than five years. Notwithstanding any other provision of law, the court shall not suspend the sentence of any person convicted of a crime subject to this subsection nor place him on probation nor shall the term of imprisonment run concurrently with any other term of imprisonment including that imposed for the crime in which the KTW ammunition was being used or carried. No person sentenced under this subsection shall be eligible for parole. (d) Definition. - As used in this section the term “armor-piercing ammunition” means ammunition which, when or if fired from any firearm as defined in section 6102 that is used or attempted to be used in violation of subsection (a) under the test procedure of the National Institute of Law Enforcement and Criminal Justice Standard for the Ballistics Resistance of Police Body Armor promulgated December 1978, is determined to be capable of penetrating bullet-resistant apparel or body armor meeting the requirements of Type hA of Standard NILECJ-STD-0101.01 as formulated by the United States Department of Justice and published in December of 1978. Looks like as long as you are not carrying the dreaded "cop killer" teflon coated bullets - you're good to go. Reads to me that you are OK with even those unless you are doing a crime. IMO - HST/hollow points are the thing to use. ETA: Looked with no luck- what does HST stand for? |
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Hydra Shok Two, I think? Not sure.
Phillyfan, the thing to do here is check YOUR state laws. Maybe post this in your Hometown Forum for PA, those in your state should be able to chime in on the subject. Probably links there as well so you can read the law yourself. I'm almost positive that PA is NOT one of those states with ridiculous, draconian restrictions like that. My guess is you're fine with JHPs, but check with your own state people to be sure. |
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Remm Gold Saber, one of the most accurate +p rounds i have fired.
I really like them. remm |
My ccw is a Glock 36 (.45 caliber ) and I used to carry federal hydra-shoks. Once my local PD switched from .40 Sigs to .45 Kimbers they staretd to carry Federal HST +Ps. Thats what I carry now. If it's good enough for them, it's good enough for me  .
Pus it's only $20 for a box of 50 HSTs instead of $25 for 15 Hydra Shoks |
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Quoted:
My ccw is a Glock 36 (.45 caliber ) and I used to carry federal hydra-shoks. Once my local PD switched from .40 Sigs to .45 Kimbers they staretd to carry Federal HST +Ps. Thats what I carry now. If it's good enough for them, it's good enough for me .
Pus it's only $20 for a box of 50 HSTs instead of $25 for 15 Hydra Shoks Dam - they carry Kimbers! Where do I sign up? |
| Check out the Ammunition forum on here. There used to be a bunch of hype about Hydrashocks and now the common viewpoint is that they suck and lack penetration. The 3 brands you should check out are Speer Gold Dots, Winchester Ranger T's, and Federal HST. I run 147 grain Gold Dots in my Glock 19. Buy some of each and shoot it through your gun and see which you like best. |
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Quoted:
Check out the Ammunition forum on here. There used to be a bunch of hype about Hydrashocks and now the common viewpoint is that they suck and lack penetration. The 3 brands you should check out are Speer Gold Dots, Winchester Ranger T's, and Federal HST. I run 147 grain Gold Dots in my Glock 19. Buy some of each and shoot it through your gun and see which you like best. There's nothing wrong with Hydrashocks. They've just become a somewhat dated design compared to the other loads you mentioned. In the real world they are most likely very close in performance to the newer designs and still will be far superior to FMJ ammo. |
| I'm not a ballistics expert but that's the consensus I walked away with after reading quite a bit in the ammo forum here. I do recall penetration through thick clothing and windshields being subpar, thus performing less than the others I mentioned in the real world world. |
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Quoted:
18 Pa. C.S. §6121. Certain Bullets Prohibited. (a) Offense defined. - It is unlawful for any person to possess, use or attempt to use a KTW teflon-coated bullet or other armor-piercing ammunition while committing or attempting to commit a crime of violence as defined in section 6102 (relating to definitions). (b) Grading. - An offense under this section constitutes a felony of the third degree. (c) Sentencing. - Any person who is convicted in any court of this Commonwealth of a crime of violence and who uses or carries, in the commission of that crime, a firearm loaded with KTW ammunition or any person who violates this section shall, in addition to the punishment provided for the commission of the crime, be sentenced to a term of imprisonment for not less than five years. Notwithstanding any other provision of law, the court shall not suspend the sentence of any person convicted of a crime subject to this subsection nor place him on probation nor shall the term of imprisonment run concurrently with any other term of imprisonment including that imposed for the crime in which the KTW ammunition was being used or carried. No person sentenced under this subsection shall be eligible for parole. (d) Definition. - As used in this section the term “armor-piercing ammunition” means ammunition which, when or if fired from any firearm as defined in section 6102 that is used or attempted to be used in violation of subsection (a) under the test procedure of the National Institute of Law Enforcement and Criminal Justice Standard for the Ballistics Resistance of Police Body Armor promulgated December 1978, is determined to be capable of penetrating bullet-resistant apparel or body armor meeting the requirements of Type hA of Standard NILECJ-STD-0101.01 as formulated by the United States Department of Justice and published in December of 1978. Looks like as long as you are not carrying the dreaded "cop killer" teflon coated bullets - you're good to go. It's all in the details. As I read it, you can have the ammo as long as you're not robbing someone with it. <––––Not an attorney |