[ARCHIVED THREAD] - SHOWING YOUR CCW (Page 1 of 2)
Posted: 5/20/2007 4:38:42 AM EDT
I notice in allot of posts that people who get pulled over for something automatically show there CCw's. I ask you why? Unless of course the cop asked you if you are armed ,then the proper response would be YES I HAVE A PERMIT! State law maybe?
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Here in Michigan you MUST tell the LEO that you have a CCW whether or not you have a weapon in the car. It comes up when they do a DL check and if you fail to tell them it can result in revocation of your permit. Each state has different laws concerning this. It would be advised to check your state and local laws so that you are within the guidelines set forth where you live and you do not jeapordize your rights because of ignorance of the laws. |
OK I'm in the wrong forum how do you change that?
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I lived in TX before moving to GA. In TX your CCW is tied into DPS's record bank so if you get pulled over for a traffic violation they will know you have a CCW. You are NOT required to tell them but LEO's will feel more comfortable if you are up front with them (that is what a few LEO's have told me) rather then guessing if you are armed or having to ask if you are currently armed. I have carried that habit to my present state of GA. I have been stopped for speeding and just hand the officer my license, insurance card, registration, & CCW. One officer ignored the CCW and one asked what I was carrying. Didn't ask to see it but just wanted to know what I had on me. It can't hurt. MadDog 
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I suppose one day soon everything will be on your DL.| When dealing with a LEO, common sense tells me that I should let them know I am armed. This prevents me from being shot to death because I resemble a wanted crook that happens to drive a car like mine, when I reach for my driver's license. I have no idea why you would NOT want to let a LEO know you have a gun in easy reach of you. Remember a police officer can pat you down during any interaction with you to protect themselves. |
laws have changed now. you must show it to any peace officer that asks for id and your packing. falure to do so is a class B misdemeanor. So in Texas that is why we have to show a cop when they ask for ID. |
If you're carrying, you ARE required to show your CCW, even if the cop doesn't ask. |
Go back and check the statutes....Michigan does not require you to say you have a CPL UNLESS you are using it...in which case you have to provide the CPL with the DL or other photo ID when stopped by PD. Not carrying a gun, no need to carry the CPL or even discuss it or mention it.
No Expert |
In TEXAS YOU MUST PRESENT YOUR CCW and DRIVERS LICENSE.... IF you do not then you can loose your license to carry for 30 days for a first offense.
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I just spoke with MSP Officer Rose and she stated that you MUST inform any LEO that asks for your ID that you have a CPL and whether you are carrying or not. Here is the number to MSP Headquarters to verify: Michigan State Police Headquarters 714 S. Harrison Road East Lansing, Michigan 48823 Information: (517) 332-2521 Also you would need to argue this with the officer that pulled me over for for an ambiguous traffic violation (no turn on school days, was during X-Mas break) and I forgot to tell him I have a CPL. After he returned from running my license he threatened to have my CPL revoked for failing to mention that I had one. I told him that I had just forgot and did not have my pistol with me and he said that it did not matter, you must tell any LEO that asks for ID that you have a CPL whether you are carrying or not. We were also instructed of this when I renewed my CPL last in 2003. I will agree that the MSP website is rather unclear and reads that you would only need to disclose your CPL if carrying but this has changed since 2001 / 2002 according to the MSP and LEO that I have spoken with. Believe me when I tell you that if you fail to disclose that you have a CPL whether you are carrying or not when stopped by a LEO you are taking your right to carry in your own hands. I am sure one would be able to argue this out in a court of law but why take the chance? I am still trying to find the statute that states this...........  |
It does two things: 1) Informs the cop that you are a good guy (not an ex-felon robber) 2) Tells the cop you have a gun so things can start off on the right foot I can't think of when I wrote somebody with a CCW. One guy convinced me to buy the same model of gun he was carrying. It was a trade off of the 30 over for fondling his new HK. |
That's great, I get pulled over for a measly 15 mph over and you let the guy go for 30 over, because he let you fondle his tool. That's not a wonderful thing to brag about, your a LEO. And I thought you were supposed to set an example.
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When I was younger I used to tell the cop that I had a permit and a gun, in that order, whenever I was pulled over for anything. More often than not it went fine, most cops just didn't care, but I had two bad experiences where I was removed from my vehicle, searched, cuffed and held until back up arrived and full background and serial number checks were done. The last time was for a stop for failing to signal a lane change, I was held in the back of a police car for almost an hour. In the mean time just about every person I worked with drove by and saw my motorcycle surrounded by police cars and me in the back seat of a cop car, including the boss. Needless to say I had some uncomfortable splaining to do when I finally got to work. Fortunately I had the ticket for failing to signal a lane change to show for it. One of the cops that showed up as back up told me "next time just keep your mouth shut about the gun unless you're asked or likely to be searched and you'll get a ticket and be done in 15 minutes". Since that day I've followed his advice and in the dozen years since that day I've never had a bit of problems during traffic stops. |
here in Tn I've had several simular exp. I got to the point where I quit telling them (not required ) or would tell them based on the officers attitude. when the run my DL is ahows up anyway. some that I didn't tell would get pissed (hense me not telling in the first place) but they knew I had a valid permit by that time. when asked why I didn't tell I said" I don't feel like getting thrown on the pavement and cuffed/frisked" . they get real pissed lookes on thier faces then and say something about "I could arrest you for not telling me ,etc..." , yes ony if he asked first. other times I let the officer know and they say "thats fine keep it where it is" . or I don't tell them they run my DL and neither of us say anything. |
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When the cop walks to the window: "Before I do anything, I have to tell you, I have a concealed weapons permit and am armed, how would you like me to proceed?" My gun is right above my wallet. Going for my wallet could get me shot. I think it's worth letting him know instead of trying to die on some sword about not telling him. Last time I got pulled over, he asked me to get out since I couldn't reach my wallet while inside my wife's small car. Then he admired my 1911 and let me go. |
Not a get out of Jail free card, but an act of showing respect to the officer, Simply, you hand the officer your DL/insurance and CCW permit and he knows that you are armed and not a threat (no criminal record, have taken the time/training to obtain the permit and are safe with a firearm). The other way around is you do not hand him your CCW, he asks you if you have any firearms, and when you say yes, his mind goes into overdrive even before you blurt out that you have a permit. Trust me, when you get stopped, you want the officer to be calm/ to calm down since just approaching your car has him in a heightened state from the start. Be respectful to the officer by including your permit with other items that he asks you for*, and it will go a long way on how he treats you/ the stop. *If you have to dig for the paper work, let the officer know before hand that you will including your CCW permit with the other paper work that he has asked for, and what for his reaction/direction before going after it. Again, it’s all a respect action to the officer. And for Christ sake, be proud of your CCW permit, it took a lot to achieve it. Granted that you can’t show off your weapon, your permit on the other hand should be one of your badges of achievement. |
Correct. And if you're not carrying, you're not required to show your CCW. They'll know as soon as they run your DL#, and probably ask you about it. Me? My DL and CHL are in a foldable ID pouch inside my wallet. I just hand that to the officer, inform him of my carrying status, and that's that. So I always inform them of my CHL, whether I'm carrying or not. It's just courteous. |
Interesting.... I may have to make a call this week for clarification. Maybe statute is the wrong word. From the document: Public Acts of 2002 Approved by the Governor December 30, 2002 Filed with the Secretary of State December 30, 2002 EFFECTIVE DATE: July 1, 2003 STATE OF MICHIGAN 91ST LEGISLATURE REGULAR SESSION OF 2002
Of course the cynic in me says that if they have it tied to the DL, and they can "run you" on the computer and verify the CPL via LEIN...why do we need to carry the card in the first place? Let's make it an endorsement on your DL or State ID. That's not an argument against disclosure, if I am stopped/questioned by PD the first thing out of my mouth will be "good day officer, I have a legally concealed weapon, how do you want to proceed?" But if I am pulled over, and do not have my gun on me for whatever reason, what is the relevance to having a CPL if the gun is at home? Also, the vagueness in intensified from the MSP info given here Where is says first : Proper Conduct During Encounters with Police Note that it specifically states "either on their person or in their motor vehicle" and following that says:
while next down the same page it says:
Note that para 3 does not explicitly state "while in possession of" a weapon.... so taken out of context, someone could quote para 3 to mean that " an individual licensed to carry a concealed pistol shall show both of the following" [ID] "to a police officer" at anytime regardless of carrying or not. It seems to me that in context as written, para 3 is dependent upon para 1 & 2. I am not a lawyer, so maybe it's clear as mud. Maybe I should send that to the MSP Chief and suggest the actual section be clarified in writing. let me also point out that as I carry whenever i can, the likelihood of being stopped while carrying is greater than not..... but still minor as long as i don't do anything needing to be stopped or questioned for in the first place. No Expert |
I figure that they have a dangerous enough job and it is just being nice to let them know that you are armed and have a permit for said weapon. Usually they just ask where it is and what kind of weapon it is. Most of the time it gets me out of what I did.(usually speeding)
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No_Expert, I agree with what you are saying 100% however I am just going by first hand experience and what was told to me directly by MSP yesterday when I called. I was not pulled over by the MSP but by my local LEO in my city. Obviously these guys are all under the same impression. I did not tell the officer that I had a CPL when I was stopped as I had read and understood the MSP page the same way that you have. Also, this was the first time in forever that I have been stopped by a LEO so it is not a common occurence where it would even be the first thing on my mind as to tell them anything about my CPL, I was more in disbelief that I was being stopped in the first place. I really think that this needs to be clarified on their page one way or another. If they are under a different impression than what is actual law then even if we are correct and they are not, failure to disclose when not carrying a firearm could result in nothing but problems for us. Let me see if there is a local LEO that posts here and see what his understanding is in regards to this issue. If nothing else maybe it will give us some insight as to what LEO's are being instructed and what we need to talk to the MSP about to get this cleared up so we are all under the same understanding and know what we must do if stopped here in Michigan. |
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In Oklahoma, you are required to notify, during the course of any arrest, detainment, or routine traffic stop. However, unless they have probable cause of a crime being committed, they are not allowed to inspect your weapon provided it is properly concealed. I own page 2. 
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I agree with this. Politeness may even get you out of the ticket. |
Yes, this is true. I was going a wee bit quick on the interstate in PA, and the state trooper was very polite, and I'm pretty sure he simply said "just slow it down a bit and be careful" because I notified him politely that I had a weapon on my person. A little politeness (usually) goes a long way with law enforcement. I'm sure we've all had our experiences with that one fellow who was just bound and determined to make someone's life miserable. |
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So I am driving along a dark, two lane highway in central MN with my family the night before Thanksgiving. My two kids are in the backseat and there is a case of Michelob Amberbock between them. Cop pulls us over cause I was going a little fast. He mostly wanted to do a seatbelt check. I have a CCW permit for ND and for Utah. At the time MN was not giving CCW permits but the Utah permit has reciprocity with 27 other states including MN. I am not sure of the MN law regarding informing the officer so I inform him that I am carrying a handgun. He seems distracted between my hot, blonde wife and the case of Amberbock in the backseat. I give him my ND driver's license and my Utah CCW permit. He asks, "What is this?" I tell him that its a Utah CCW permit and it allows me to carry in MN. He asks "Does it?" I say yes. He then asks, "What kind of handgun do you have?" I inform him that it is nestled beside me but it is an HK USP .45 stainless. He says sweet, hands me back my licenses and says to have a happy Thanksgiving and to slow down a tad. |
Utah's a MUST inform state, so I have to (if I ever get my license 80+ days and counting). Cop doing the class said the same thing though. He's never given a speeding ticket to a CWP holder, and neither had the Highway patrol guy that was helping out. |
THANKS !
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Scenario...however unlikely...You're pulled over for whatever and the officer(s) approach your vehicle to begin the standard dialogue. You decide to NOT inform the officer(s) that you have a concealed permit and you are carrying. You reach for your wallet and somehow expose the firearm, or possibly the officer on the passenger side sees a bulge. In a millisecond, you could be looking down the barrel(s) of the officer(s) firearms. - OR - When you're pulled over, you keep your hands in plain view at 10 and 2 on the steering wheel and calmly inform the officer, "Officer, I have a permit for concealed carry and I am carrying (whatever)". The firearm is holstered on my hip, etc. As has been mentioned previously, allow the officer to dictate what happens next. When you're pulled over, the tension is already pretty high, so there is no reason to not inform an officer that you are legally carrying. You can argue right to privacy all day long and probably win the argument. However, I believe in being better safe than sorry and providing the officer(s) a piece of mind. If I were a LEO and pulled someone over, I would definitely want to know if someone were carrying (legally or not). An incident will probably not escalate out of control if the cards are all on the table...however, the situation could change dramatically if officer(s) are suddenly surprised. |
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In VA, its not required to show your permit to an LEO and its on their computer when they run your ID. I generally opt to not inform them. I do however keep my hands where they can see them at all times (such as out the side of the window, the steering wheel, etc) and be polite. The way I see it, a shitty piece of paper (that could be forged by a 12 yo kid on his mommies computer) and an announcement that I have a firearm while the officer is standing right next to me is not the best route. I would rather give them common courtesy, be polite and let them find out from their computer. I have yet to have a LEO get upset that I didn't originally inform about my CHL. YMMV. For the record, all my interactions with LEOs since getting my CHL have been in Montgomery and Floyd County in SW VA, which may have something to do with it. Open carry is something that is considered normal around these parts. |
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Quoted: In TEXAS YOU MUST PRESENT YOUR CCW and DRIVERS LICENSE.... IF you do not then you can loose your license to carry for 30 days for a first offense. Just to clarify the suspention is for 90 days for a first offense of failure to display as required. 1 to 3 year suspention for the second offense and you could be charged with a class B Misd. (and lose your license). Third offense your license is revolked. It has always been a requirement to display your CHL license if you are carrying and asked for ID by a magistrate or the Law Enforcement. Always a good idea to notify the Officer you have a CHL and give him the status of your handgun so they can decide how to safely proceed. |
I can tell you that when I crossed the border into Canada last weekend they knew I had a CCW from my license plate as I did not hand them any form of ID and they asked me if I was carrying my weapon. I do not know if the local LEO's in your area can pull this info from your plate when they pull you over but they sure can at the border. |
| I normally just keep both hands on the wheel, when the officer comes up and asks for license and ins. Inform them that you have your CCP and it is in your wallet that is on the same side as your weapon. Let them determine how to get it. they have all just said ok, go ahead and get it. |
and in Ohio I believe it is now a felony unless the officer told you to?!?!?! |
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GA, my home state, doesn't require one to notify a cop of the presence of a firearm in your vehicle, during traffic stops. We also aren't required to have a permit, in order to legally carry "in plain view," or in the glove box or console. I see absolutely no value in telling a cop something that's none of his/her business. I can be plenty polite without having a conversation about my firearm. I would, of course, tell the officer that I was carrying, if he/she asked. Also wouldn't tell the cop that I'm carrying a tiretool, jug of water, etc., etc., or anything else that I'm legally carrying, but which is none of the cop's business. |
If asked to ID yourself to a peace officer, or directly asked if you are armed. |
sounds like the correct way it should be... getting disarmed for "officer safety" gets old. |