Posted: 11/14/2005 7:00:58 PM EDT
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I agree! It would never make it back to my holster!
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While I understand your desire to be prepared, I too think this borders on brandishing (illegal here in Michigan). I'd suggest you do one thing differently. Keep a newspaper, a spare jacket or something similar handy (on passanger seat when vacant). If a situation like this one arises, you can draw and rest the pistol just as you did, but keep it covered with the paper or jacket, thus remaining concealed. It will not only keep you legal and prevent scaring the crap outta someone who really isn't up to no good, it will also preserve an element of surprise for for you in dealing with those who are. BTW did you consider the potential miscreant might have been an undercover LE, possibly the two vehicles looked suspicious to him (drug buy, etc). One never knows.... don't let it be seen until it is needed. Having it immediately at hand is I think a good thing though! T Bone (Detroit). |
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i dont know the laws there - but in FL that would have been atleast brandishing and if the cop really had a thing for you and said you "threatened" the guy with your weapon thats aggravated assault - which equals no more guns for you. But thats the law, i seriously doubt that many cops would EVER stick it to you that hard. personally i would not have drawn. im of the pull-it-only-if-youre-gonna-use-it mindset. mainly for legal reasons though. In that situation i might have removed it and put it in a more accepssible spot, but still concealed. I dont want the BG to know i hae a gun until its too late for him to do anything about it. |
Open carry doesn't apply in this situation. Not to flame you, but wouldn't it have been better to just leave? You don't mention that your car was running or not, but it might be time to pratice observation/awareness drills. Don't park in areas that provide concealment/ bad lighting for a bad guy to stroll up to you. Park facing opposite directions if you're talking to someone in another car. If some guy is surprising people in cars, you might want to advise local LEOs of the description, and that he's rousting people, that he startled you-you can even comment that you felt threatened, now that's on tape, but I wouldn't elaborate on your response. You never know, your instincts MAY have been good and he was out to rob/ carjack someone. He could easliy get your tag number and call 911 on a payphone and say " so and so w/ a gun ( he's seen it, so he can describe it) put a gun in my face......." Yes, it's not true, but you're behind the curve if he drops dime. Don't let the bad guy put your liberty and right to carry at risk because he did something stupid by slipping up on you. |
| In Minnesota you are not permited to draw unless retreat / escape is impractical. Was the scary homeless guy blocking your escape with the threat of lethal force? Now that I have laid out what the law stipulates, if I was in your shoes and felt an impending threat I may have readied myself but stayed consealed. Moving your weapon from a holster to a jacket pocket is a good idea since you can shoot through the article of clothing if necessary. |
There have been cases in Minnesota where people have lost their permits due to using the weapon for intimidation reasons. The crazy part is we are an open carry state. Dont want to drag this off topic so I will stop. |
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I'm no expert on the legality of it all. I'm sure someone else is. Now, in your house, any unwanted person in your house is fair game. But as for having a CCP and being out in public, you have to be faced with deadly force in order to legally draw down. We can't use it as a deterrent if we see a bad guy spray painting a wall. Now, if someone is breaking into my car in the parking lot and its dark, you can't know if the person is armed or not. But I was taught in my class that if you have to draw down, someone is dying. It should be an automatic reflex. When you draw, you shoot. No judgement involved. This is because the only reason you drew down in the first place was because YOUR LIFE was faced with a deadly force. |
Never heard of the threat disappearing?? Whoever taught that class needs some additional instruction............. I hope you realize that is not the correct way of thinking. Guns get dropped, knives get dropped, suspects flee, and these are just some of the ways the threat could disappear before you actually have to use deadly force. BTW, your car scenario at dark is a prime example....your gun may be out, but that doesn't mean you are going to use deadly force. |
That was actually brought up. Yes, if the person removes the deadly force in the short amount of time it takes for you to draw, then yes, you should not use deadly force yourself. I'm not gonna draw to scare someone off because they looked suspicious. |
This is why I don't open carry either, I have enemys, AKA "neighbors", who would likely do shit like that to me (actually it was allready done to me once in the military by some fruit loop who wanted out and he did adventually get kicked out of the military)  In Oregon the only thing that could get you in trouble is (I will try to quote the law, but I'm not going to look it up right now, so this is from memory) "...pointing a firearm at another person in a menassing manner.....", there is no "brandishing", it is an open carry state, I go out in the parking lot after a gun show and show off my weapons to my friends and fondle my new toys, I am not doing anything wrong. BUT, BUT, some asshat could allways lie about it and say that you or I had pointed it at them. And every women in America could lie and say we raped her as well, hey, it happens. I had a female bum sorta force her way into my car once before I carryed, I've thought about what I'd do now that I carry, I think I would do what you did. Pull out my weapon and say "what are ya going to do?" They'll leave.............or die? I'll make an effort to be the first one on 911 saying "oh my God, I was just assaulted/robbed/carjacked" I'll mention pulling the weapon later. |