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Anyone running a FRT? Let’s discuss. (Page 3 of 4)
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RPK with SS Just got this running. Metal cam and printed trip. The RPK receiver requires a very thin trip bar. I ended up using a 3D printed trip for now while I thin out a metal one. The suppressor is helping to give it some extra energy as I break it iin. Nice cyclic rate though and very controllable. |
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Originally Posted By TheFaz: RPK with SS Just got this running. Metal cam and printed trip. The RPK receiver requires a very thin trip bar. I ended up using a 3D printed trip for now while I thin out a metal one. The suppressor is helping to give it some extra energy as I break it iin. Nice cyclic rate though and very controllable. Nice! I’m presuming that you’re using the DNT/HGW style. Keep us updated on how long the printed trip holds up. |
| I imagine it will only last a couple hundred rounds or so before it breaks. It takes the impact of the bolt at the front nub pushing it forward to reset the cam, so that plastic is going to break or round over fairly quickly. Maybe I'll be pleasantly surprised though, we'll see. |
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I was unaware of this recent development of a "3 Position" mod for the basic super safety - Its offered by Super Safety Store. I have one of these kits sitting in storage - I ordered a jig just to play with it someday - Maybe on a model the MARS won't be able to fit - I can't get the MARS V2 to work with a Polish Beryl - Safety is way different as an example.  3 POSITION AK FRT JIG GUIDE |
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Originally Posted By cherenkov: I was unaware of this recent development of a "3 Position" mod for the basic super safety - Its offered by Super Safety Store. I have one of these kits sitting in storage - I ordered a jig just to play with it someday - Maybe on a model the MARS won't be able to fit - I can't get the MARS V2 to work with a Polish Beryl - Safety is way different as an example.  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ya74GBJMYFYJust saying using those 2 parts (disconnector with a tail and unmodified safety) will convert any semi AK to FA. The 3rd pin is the rate reducer. My ATI Galil pistol was "malfunctioning..." it's disconnector had the tail. ATI didn't grind enough off the safety. I don't see how their cam is gonna pass ATF muster using those other parts. |
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that's not correct. You put a disconnector with a tail and an FA selector and try and use it and it will just have hammer follow in the FA position. I'm not saying yours did not have issues with this combination, but there had to be something else that was interrupting the hammer from falling forward, only way it would go full auto with that combination. Also 3rd hole is for the sear, the rate reducer is on the actual trigger. |
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Originally Posted By nictra: that's not correct. You put a disconnector with a tail and an FA selector and try and use it and it will just have hammer follow in the FA position. I'm not saying yours did not have issues with this combination, but there had to be something else that was interrupting the hammer from falling forward, only way it would go full auto with that combination. Also 3rd hole is for the sear, the rate reducer is on the actual trigger. My ATI with those intact ran in FA. I ground them off. Could be 223 vs 7.62x39 but mine ran in the 3rd position. |
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Originally Posted By nictra: that's not correct. You put a disconnector with a tail and an FA selector and try and use it and it will just have hammer follow in the FA position. Don’t forget that the smooth brains at the gubmit level in a particular bureau are willing to put in the work to get a desired result. I understand the functionality aspect, but I don’t have the financial backing to argue it to stay out of prison. |
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The ATF has been documented making things do what they want them to do in the past by tampering with firearms until they do the big bad things. The point is, the way the AK trigger group works in FA is that it HAS to have the sear trip to even think about going FA. You can put an FA trigger group with rate reducer all day and it will never go FA unless there is something retarding the hammer. It's just how it works. As to previous poster, I'm not doubting something was wrong and that his firearm did what he claims, I'm stating that it wasn't the sum of the parts alone, it had to be something else. Back to the topic...Does anyone know if they plan to come up with a version that works in the pistol caliber AKs? |
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Originally Posted By nictra: The ATF has been documented making things do what they want them to do in the past by tampering with firearms until they do the big bad things. The point is, the way the AK trigger group works in FA is that it HAS to have the sear trip to even think about going FA. You can put an FA trigger group with rate reducer all day and it will never go FA unless there is something retarding the hammer. It's just how it works. As to previous poster, I'm not doubting something was wrong and that his firearm did what he claims, I'm stating that it wasn't the sum of the parts alone, it had to be something else. Back to the topic...Does anyone know if they plan to come up with a version that works in the pistol caliber AKs? In a former life, I was an SOT and did some conversions. Parts is parts and fedz is fedz. I have seen various places selling conversions for pistol caliber AK’s, but I don’t have any and I can’t vouch for them working or being able to get them working. I have a buddy that wants to do one and got the parts from assfacebook marketplace. I told him that I would help. I don’t know when that will be though. |
| well I thought I bought a MARS V1, but what came in the mail was a V2. Tried fitting it in all my AKs, and all version said no because of the rivet for the scope rail. Their retaining plate does not want to play with that rivet. I will have to make shepherd's crook to try it out. As of now, I put it in my PSA spiker and will try ti out tomorrow. I'll take the 103 with me and try and fashion a crook at Zen's place and see if we can get it working. Will update tomorrow |
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Originally Posted By nictra: well I thought I bought a MARS V1, but what came in the mail was a V2. Tried fitting it in all my AKs, and all version said no because of the rivet for the scope rail. Their retaining plate does not want to play with that rivet. I will have to make shepherd's crook to try it out. As of now, I put it in my PSA spiker and will try ti out tomorrow. I'll take the 103 with me and try and fashion a crook at Zen's place and see if we can get it working. Will update tomorrow You might see some binding as you hold the trigger - - Hoping they fixed it after the beta ones went out and they tweaked it. You might have to sand and polish some surfaces to get it working good. |
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I ended up trying to fit it in all my AKs, and only 1 does it actually fit properly and pass the dry fire test, and that's my Maadi. Pretty sure the Mars trigger is only good for a fixed stock trunion without a scope rail. I will order a super safety next and see if I can get to work with my side folder 100 series AKs I will watch for the hanging up issue and report back on how it does. |
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I guess it's possible, or I could use a crook. Either way, the trigger did not work in my Maadi. It did work for 3 mags in Zen's Hungarian mutt. Then it decided not to anymore From my observations with the Mars, it will only properly fit in a fixed stock rifle with the shorter trunnion. I will be buying the super safety next to try. |
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Originally Posted By nictra: I guess it's possible, or I could use a crook. Either way, the trigger did not work in my Maadi. It did work for 3 mags in Zen's Hungarian mutt. Then it decided not to anymore From my observations with the Mars, it will only properly fit in a fixed stock rifle with the shorter trunnion. I will be buying the super safety next to try. Did you use the trip wire that came with the parts or make your own? I had to make mine because the wires weren’t long enough. Coincidentally, one is in a Maadi and the other in my home built RPK. In my experience, the Mars triggers are easier to fit than the super safeties. Then again, the Maadi is the only factory made AK that I have and maybe that has something to do with it. Once you get them going, they’re the best thing to happen for the AK since 20 May 1986. |
| I thought I had ordered a V1. That was the picture on the web. What I received was a V2. I do not know what needs to be done to adjust the trip bar or the cam. It fits and moves properly when doing the bolt function check and when dry firing, but when live firing it will do 1 to 2 rou ds and then hammer follow. |
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Originally Posted By nictra: I thought I had ordered a V1. That was the picture on the web. What I received was a V2. I do not know what needs to be done to adjust the trip bar or the cam. It fits and moves properly when doing the bolt function check and when dry firing, but when live firing it will do 1 to 2 rou ds and then hammer follow. Hammer follow is usually from the trigger releasing prematurely. You may need to modify the cam a little to delay the release. Make sure that the carrier is contacting the rear of the trunnion on the left side behind the serial number. If there’s any gap, your trip lever will eventually become a two-piece unit and won’t work at all. |
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Originally Posted By nictra: received 2 of the super safeties this weekend. Will be installing and trying them out this upcoming weekend. Hoping for better compatibility with these. Which Type of FRT/SS for the AK? Let us know how it goes and what your using in and such. |
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Originally Posted By jreinke: Anyone seen this? Appears to be an AK binary trigger, only 3 components. https://flexindustries.com/product/ak-flex-trigger/ Well it's something and its simple - The thing is once you try FRT - Its hard to go back to Binary even though binary is fun. |
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Originally Posted By cherenkov: Well it's something and its simple - The thing is once you try FRT - Its hard to go back to Binary even though binary is fun. I tried a binary trigger once and went back to boring semiauto. That was before being corrupted by FRTs, of course. 
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Originally Posted By nictra: performance triggers That style is a complete pain in the ass to get working, unless you’re lucky and it drops in. I still stand behind the MARS V1 as being the easiest. I product improved mine by using 2mm music wire ordered off amazon dirt cheap. It holds up better than the coat hangers. Once you get it, post up. I have two of that style and I managed to get them functional. |
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Well according to their website, I ordered a V1, but they sent the V2, and like I stated above, the V2 with that dogleg on the trip bar only seems to fit a short fixed stock trunnion with no side rail. Which btw, only 1 of my AKs is setup like that. At a minimum, the performance triggers one seems to clear the rear trunnion on all my side folder AKs so far. I will be slowly filing down my trigger Saturday and testing it and hoping I get it to work. I will post my success or failure. |
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Originally Posted By nictra: Well according to their website, I ordered a V1, but they sent the V2, and like I stated above, the V2 with that dogleg on the trip bar only seems to fit a short fixed stock trunnion with no side rail. Which btw, only 1 of my AKs is setup like that. At a minimum, the performance triggers one seems to clear the rear trunnion on all my side folder AKs so far. I will be slowly filing down my trigger Saturday and testing it and hoping I get it to work. I will post my success or failure. Cool, post pics of the mods either way. If you’re interested in getting a V1. I have one that I would trade for your V2. I’ll throw in some longer wires for getting it tuned properly. 
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I still need to sort out the issues with mine. My AR SS has been 100% since day 1. My 9mm AR needed a little milling on the bolt weight and a heavy 10 oz buffer to get it fully functional, but it is solid now. Compared to that my AK SS has been intermittent at best, had pretty heavy recoil, and serious slap on the trigger reset as compared to an AR. Just kind of lost interest as I have many other projects to work on. Binary is no good where I shoot typically, local prohibition probably covers a binary, but they missed the frt function in how the law was written. So a functional AK version would be nice to have, at least until they figure it out and update the law. I am hoping we slip thru the cracks again this upcoming year as they think they covered it by banning some very specific items. Plus I am an SOT and am helping out with an AK conversion anyhow. Shall see how a functional OEM style F/A feels compared to the FRT. I will say on an AR the SS is about 90% as good as real F/A, what a game changer. |
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Originally Posted By tac556: I still need to sort out the issues with mine. My AR SS has been 100% since day 1. My 9mm AR needed a little milling on the bolt weight and a heavy 10 oz buffer to get it fully functional, but it is solid now. Compared to that my AK SS has been intermittent at best, had pretty heavy recoil, and serious slap on the trigger reset as compared to an AR. Just kind of lost interest as I have many other projects to work on. Binary is no good where I shoot typically, local prohibition probably covers a binary, but they missed the frt function in how the law was written. So a functional AK version would be nice to have, at least until they figure it out and update the law. I am hoping we slip thru the cracks again this upcoming year as they think they covered it by banning some very specific items. Plus I am an SOT and am helping out with an AK conversion anyhow. Shall see how a functional OEM style F/A feels compared to the FRT. I will say on an AR the SS is about 90% as good as real F/A, what a game changer. I noticed the same between my M16 and FRT in another AR. Close, not quite the same, but close enough that I've held off buying any other machine guns for now. If I can get something running good enough in an AK I'll save that 30 to 40k and just buy a ton of ammo. |
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Originally Posted By tac556: I still need to sort out the issues with mine. My AR SS has been 100% since day 1. My 9mm AR needed a little milling on the bolt weight and a heavy 10 oz buffer to get it fully functional, but it is solid now. Compared to that my AK SS has been intermittent at best, had pretty heavy recoil, and serious slap on the trigger reset as compared to an AR. Just kind of lost interest as I have many other projects to work on. Binary is no good where I shoot typically, local prohibition probably covers a binary, but they missed the frt function in how the law was written. So a functional AK version would be nice to have, at least until they figure it out and update the law. I am hoping we slip thru the cracks again this upcoming year as they think they covered it by banning some very specific items. Plus I am an SOT and am helping out with an AK conversion anyhow. Shall see how a functional OEM style F/A feels compared to the FRT. I will say on an AR the SS is about 90% as good as real F/A, what a game changer. The real AK doesn’t have any slap. The disconnector does all the work in s/a and the sear in f/a. Nothing acts on the trigger like with a semi. ETA: the Mars trigger FRT doesn’t have the trigger slap like the others. It’s noticeable, but it doesn’t beat the shit out of your booger hook. |
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Originally Posted By Dakota_Don: The real AK doesn’t have any slap. The disconnector does all the work in s/a and the sear in f/a. Nothing acts on the trigger like with a semi. ETA: the Mars trigger FRT doesn’t have the trigger slap like the others. It’s noticeable, but it doesn’t beat the shit out of your booger hook. Well yeah, because real F/A is pretty simple. FRT’s are designed to reset the trigger, very different operation. I have put a lot of rounds F/A thru the AR platform and HK G36, plus an UZI, along with a bit of time on the M240, M249, RPD, PKM, AUG, M11, and a few others. Prefer a 5.55 vs a 9mm open bolt gun all day long for controllability. The only semi auto AK’s with trigger slap are the crummy trigger sets Century threw in the SAR series guns. Never realized they were simply trying to help us shoot faster, so I always chopped off the disconnector tail to get rid of the slap! Century was just ahead of their time it seems! Ha Ha! |
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I will start off by saying that the Performance triggers super safety does not fit in an AK12, which quite honestly was very disappointing this weekend. However, it was fairly successful weekend with the AK super safety. I did get mine installed and after about 50 in and outs with sanding and fitting, I finally got it to run decently in my 105. I think I will swap it into my 104 for next time, or just buy a few more and add one to that. At the end of the day, the 105 is still slow with the cyclic rate (even suppressed) and I think the bolt is still dragging a little on the cam. I will do some more sanding on the cam next time I am out and see if I can get it to smooth out and increase the rate of fire. Zen got his to just start working and he said he will continue to massage his in throughout the week to get it running perfectly. He also put his in his 105. My fingers are tender from all the fitting, but I am content that this one at lease fit in the gun and functions. |
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Originally Posted By nictra: I will start off by saying that the Performance triggers super safety does not fit in an AK12, which quite honestly was very disappointing this weekend. However, it was fairly successful weekend with the AK super safety. I did get mine installed and after about 50 in and outs with sanding and fitting, I finally got it to run decently in my 105. I think I will swap it into my 104 for next time, or just buy a few more and add one to that. At the end of the day, the 105 is still slow with the cyclic rate (even suppressed) and I think the bolt is still dragging a little on the cam. I will do some more sanding on the cam next time I am out and see if I can get it to smooth out and increase the rate of fire. Zen got his to just start working and he said he will continue to massage his in throughout the week to get it running perfectly. He also put his in his 105. My fingers are tender from all the fitting, but I am content that this one at lease fit in the gun and functions. They are going to run a little slower than you expect due to the design. Since it’s working, I wouldn’t do anything else with the parts. You might consider replacing the recoil spring. Instead of getting a Wolff XP, get a standard M14 spring for a quarter of the cost. It does everything a Wolff XP does and it might increase your ROF marginally. |
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| For y'all that have your FRTs running right, are any of y'all in the DFW area? I have the Plinkify/Kono style FRT and my current issue is I can't get my piston/carrier to go forward into battery. I'd really like to get this running right before I destroy the rifle. Any help y'all could provide will be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance. |
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Originally Posted By Deanr: For y'all that have your FRTs running right, are any of y'all in the DFW area? I have the Plinkify/Kono style FRT and my current issue is I can't get my piston/carrier to go forward into battery. I'd really like to get this running right before I destroy the rifle. Any help y'all could provide will be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance. Is this the type with the wire trip rod? Is the carrier about 1/8” away from being closed when forward? If so, you’re going to have to make a new trip wire that’s longer than what you have. I was using coat hanger and moved to music wire that I got from Amazon. |
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| Got to fire it. Didn't work right. Made a longer trip bar. During dry cycling I can feel my trigger finger being moved forward when the bolt comes back, but I can feel my trigger finger being pushed forward more when the bolt just starts to move forward though it still seems like the hammer follows the bolt forward. And I don't feel the trigger let go of the hammer while dry cycling. Is this what it should be like? If so, I can fully understand why people are unhappy with the trigger slap they feel. |
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@Deanr, yes, I’m running original triggers in mine. I like the wide Polish ones the best. I think they were originally shipped with Romanian triggers. I’m not sure what the difference is, but I’ve never really been impressed with the US made versions. You can see the difference in length of the trip wire my two needs to function here (my home brewed piece is on the left):  The supplied trip wires were too short and this is all the further the carrier would go home on one:  Here are some import triggers to use for profile comparison. The rubber tubing in the bottom one is the old Cobray method of trigger slap mitigation: 
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For all that are having trouble getting their Mars V1 trigger running right find this video on YouTube. Fitting the Alpha Tactical Systems MARS Trigger to ZASTAVA ZPAP M70's/Yugo's This is a very detailed video and will help you even if the rifles described are not your rifle. Sorry I couldn't paste in the link but I'm doing this on my phone. Good luck. |
Anyone running a FRT? Let’s discuss. (Page 3 of 4)
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