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Posted: 12/1/2011 3:46:19 PM EDT
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Just saw AIM has this on sale. What's the difference over the TWS one? Looks like the same thing to me.
http://parabellumarmament.com/pashop/zcshop/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=18 |
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Some info in this thread: http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_4_64/139846_TWS_dog_leg_rail_or__.html |
Similar but not the same as TWS' Dogleg. The major difference other than the cool sight on Parabellums' offering, is how the Dogleg does a more elaborate job of securing the rear of the top cover. Parabellum's mount looks like some flex might be present at the rear (irrelevant if the cover is in exactly the same position every-time the trigger is pulled). The front attachment (and that built in backup sight) looks like it may be superior, if possible, to the Dogleg. I know the TWS works –– solid (got two –– on a 308 VEPR (RPK rec.) and a 556 Saiga conversion).
Parabellum's system definitely has the looks. Looks so good I may have to get one even if it doesn't hold zero well. 
So send range reports now!!! Us minds gots to know. 
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Quoted: I went ahead and ordered one because I like the rear sight better than the TWS (otherwise I'd already have the TWS). Said they have a shipping delay of 3-5 weeks when I ordered online so I may have it late December. Z Who did you order from? Aim shows them in stock: Link |
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Directly from the Parabellum website, didn't think to google who else might have had them |
| I took mine to the range the other day. Sometimes I would look at the rail and there would be about a 1cm gap from the piece on the top cover with the 2 prong that hold it in place. Usually it sat flush against it, but I dont think it would be an issue. I zeroed at 25y and blasted away about 5 mags and checked zero again and it was spot on, but this was by no means a controlled test. I was just messing around. I will do a more through job when I can make it back out to the range and the wind isnt 40mph. So far I love it thought. |
| another key difference in these two is the TWS rail, at the front sits between the 2 raised edges (the edges on each side of factory rear site) although it sits between them, it does not touch, (which if it did would help it stay positioned even better) the other rail comes down on the outside of the two raised edges, not sure how close it is to them, it would be beneficial if it were tight to stop any side-to-side movement. |
| With a full page add in shotgun news, web site ( but you can't preorder from the website because it kicks back your creditcard,) and their telephone number voicemail box is full, , Aim surplus is out of them. Do these people have a clue how to run a business.? I would try their product if there was the common courtesy to make an effort to communicate their intentions. I really don't want one anymore. Spent my money on a .45 pistol. |
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I bought one from AIM for my bulgy 74 about two months ago. Overall impression was that it was made well and looked good.
Once you get the rear leaf sight off installation was easy , though the back Allen wrench adjustment was not the best. I mounted an old Aimpoint M2 on mine and took her for a run. After sighting in I fired 200 rds and scope held zero with out any play. However , if I put heavy side to side pressure it did move , but barely. After cleaning and then another trip to range it seemed to not hold zero, but I noticed I loaded different ammo so that could have been some of it. The rear iron us nicer than the stock sight and my older eyes appreciated it very much. I think I will try I a PA micro tp see how that works ad the Aimpoint just felt too big on the rifle. Overall I would give 3 out of 5 stars , but time and use will tell. |
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I'm thinking of getting this as well.
What do you mean by when putting heavy side pressure? Quoted:
I bought one from AIM for my bulgy 74 about two months ago. Overall impression was that it was made well and looked good. Once you get the rear leaf sight off installation was easy , though the back Allen wrench adjustment was not the best. I mounted an old Aimpoint M2 on mine and took her for a run. After sighting in I fired 200 rds and scope held zero with out any play. However , if I put heavy side to side pressure it did move , but barely. After cleaning and then another trip to range it seemed to not hold zero, but I noticed I loaded different ammo so that could have been some of it. The rear iron us nicer than the stock sight and my older eyes appreciated it very much. I think I will try I a PA micro tp see how that works ad the Aimpoint just felt too big on the rifle. Overall I would give 3 out of 5 stars , but time and use will tell. |
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Quoted:
Between the TWS and the parabellum, which one is better? Or which on is preferred? I only own the TWS, but it seems like it would provide a more stable mounting surface than the parabellum. The specially designed recoil spring button that TWS has come up with really locks the top cover in place with no side to side movement. The Parabellum mount relies on a standard AK topcover, which means movement will be possible. Also, the TWS adds little or no weight, and appears to sit lower. It is also a one-piece design. Thoughts? Counterarguments? |
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Sir,
Edge here, Pres/CEO of Parabellum. I left you an independent, non biased study done that does a compare and contrast of the Dog Leg and AKARS. Regardless of what you deside to mount up with, happy to see people still hunting for the facts and truth. Link to study done by Rifle Shooter: http://rifleshooter.com/2012/07/parabellum-armament-ak-adaptive-rail-system-akars-review/ |
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Quoted:
Sir, Edge here, Pres/CEO of Parabellum. I left you an independent, non biased study done that does a compare and contrast of the Dog Leg and AKARS. Regardless of what you deside to mount up with, happy to see people still hunting for the facts and truth. Link to study done by Rifle Shooter: http://rifleshooter.com/2012/07/parabellum-armament-ak-adaptive-rail-system-akars-review/ Edge, your "non biased study" is bullshit. The TWS rail will accept every LaRue mount I own. The AKARS appears to be a useful addition to the AK, but should be presented on it's own merits without making false statements about it's competition. |
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Quoted:
Quoted:
Sir, Edge here, Pres/CEO of Parabellum. I left you an independent, non biased study done that does a compare and contrast of the Dog Leg and AKARS. Regardless of what you deside to mount up with, happy to see people still hunting for the facts and truth. Link to study done by Rifle Shooter: http://rifleshooter.com/2012/07/parabellum-armament-ak-adaptive-rail-system-akars-review/ Edge, your "non biased study" is bullshit. The TWS rail will accept every LaRue mount I own. The AKARS appears to be a useful addition to the AK, but should be presented on it's own merits without making false statements about it's competition. Hi, I helped write that piece and found this post via our site traffic software. When we were discussing the AKARS when it arrived, the TWS rail owner asked me if it "works with Larue mounts?". I questioned why, hence the pic. We aren't making fake TWS rails, or fake Larue mounts or making stuff up. The TWS we had (and purchased) did not work with about 6 different Larue mounts- hence the picture. It could be we have a TWS that is out of spec. I'm unsure, its the unit we had and the one we compared. Like we mentioned in the article, we do like the TWS and as a matter of personal preference we preferred the AKARS. To that end, we have updated the article noting that we may have an anomaly (with Larue mounts not working). The primary purpose of the article was to test whether or not the AKARS held zero, and ours did. This is well established on the TWS and still often questioned on the AKARS. We don't have a horse in this race, or any race for that matter. Thank you |
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Quoted:
Probably a dumb question and I also don't have a horse in this race, but you know the LaRue mounts are adjustable, right? Did you try loosening them? He did. Thats not the problem with our mount. The lever impact the rail and cannot turn anymore The pivot point doesn't change if you losen them. Here is the pic http://rifleshooter.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/07/TAL2.jpg |
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I just ordered one of these Parabellum mounts from AIM last night.
I had a TWS that I used on a Saiga 308. It held zero once you got the rear button set good. I had to jump up and down on the charging handle with my foot to get it to set well enough to stop any side to side movement, but once there it was SOLID. I had the exact same problem with the TWS & my Larue SPR-1.5 mount. I could not adjust the Larue mount enough to get the levers to fully close. So, the authors of that review were not spreading manure. SS |
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Ok...... I bought one.
It installed WAY WAY easier then the Dog leg rail. Test to come. But I do have a fitment issue. The safety lever will not clear the top cover all the way up. The safety will engage, but will not cover the piston hole. I can see where I need to modify the top cover. May be just my WASR 10/63. 
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Quoted: I ran into the same interference on my Arsenal SLR-106. I'm going to fit the selector to the top cover instead of the top cover to the selector.Ok...... I bought one. It installed WAY WAY easier then the Dog leg rail. Test to come. But I do have a fitment issue. The safety lever will not clear the top cover all the way up. The safety will engage, but will not cover the piston hole. I can see where I need to modify the top cover. May be just my WASR 10/63. http://i879.photobucket.com/albums/ab352/fuzzytheman/Guns/2ndak1.jpg http://i879.photobucket.com/albums/ab352/fuzzytheman/Guns/safty.jpg I am pleased with this add on. I have both a TWS and an AKARS, I prefer the AKARS.
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Tested the mount. It's ok. I do get some side to side movement if I press the cover that way. It's definitely NOT as secure as the TWS rail. How much it effects function I'm not sure.
I'm more displeased with the Bushnell red dot. Thing was all over the place & I couldn't get a solid zero. Even on the stock side mount rail. Returning that & getting the PA micro when they are back in stock. |
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It holds zero for me. I really like it. It also holds zero for these guys: It's a quality piece and I'll be buying another.
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Quoted:
It holds zero for me. I really like it. It also holds zero for these guys: It's a quality piece and I'll be buying another. For 5 rounds 
Im not knocking it, but I just haven't seen much definitive testing. |
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Is the akars holding zero? Is there any side to side movements?
Quoted:
Quoted:
I ran into the same interference on my Arsenal SLR-106. I'm going to fit the selector to the top cover instead of the top cover to the selector.Ok...... I bought one. It installed WAY WAY easier then the Dog leg rail. Test to come. But I do have a fitment issue. The safety lever will not clear the top cover all the way up. The safety will engage, but will not cover the piston hole. I can see where I need to modify the top cover. May be just my WASR 10/63. http://i879.photobucket.com/albums/ab352/fuzzytheman/Guns/2ndak1.jpg http://i879.photobucket.com/albums/ab352/fuzzytheman/Guns/safty.jpg I am pleased with this add on. I have both a TWS and an AKARS, I prefer the AKARS.
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Has anyone using a romy ak47 kit with either the akars or the texas kit?
I have a romy kit and looking into maybe getting one my self. It seems from what i read that the texas system is more solid and holds zero more gun smithing needed to install it. As for the akars, it doesn't seem as solid and sometime looses its zero but easier to install and looks slightly better. So far how is it holding up when you guys shot it? Is akars working on improved version? |
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Wait! You're telling me that all the guys at warrior talk forum were wrong about this product? |
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