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Posted: 12/6/2013 1:46:23 PM EDT
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Ok , I know this had been beat to death through out the years , but what are the thoughts on an acceptable ejection path ?
I have a 16 mid-length gas barrel A2 that goes about 5 feet at 2 o'clock . My target barrel 20 inch krieger goes same distance but at consistently at 5 o'clock . So is there something wrong with the mid length or are they just bouncing off of the deflector? Thanks |
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Each rifle will have its own personality. There are many factors that effect ejection angles, such as ejector spring tension, extractor tension, action spring (buffer spring) tension, buffer, bolt carrier weight, gas port location and size, ammunition, etc. As long is it is ejecting, and that the ejection pattern is at least several feet from the operator, then I wouldn't worry too much about it. If it is ejecting only a couple of inches out of the ejection port, then I try to diagnose why.
CY6 Greg Sullivan "Sully" SLR15 Rifles TheDefensiveEdge.com (763) 712-0123 |
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Look at your spent brass and the deflector. If the brass has dents in the middle as if slashed by a knife, it deflects off the corner of the deflector instead
of the flat part and will fly forward instead of rearward. This is indication of overgassing. To change the path of ejection of that 2 o'clocker, you must slow down the speed of carrier by installing stiffer recoil spring, heavier buffer, stiffer ejector spring, weaker extractor spring, dump the o-ring, adjustable gas block or adjustable gas tube. |
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Quoted:
Look at your spent brass and the deflector. If the brass has dents in the middle as if slashed by a knife, it deflects off the corner of the deflector instead of the flat part and will fly forward instead of rearward. This is indication of overgassing. To change the path of ejection of that 2 o'clocker, you must slow down the speed of carrier by installing stiffer recoil spring, heavier buffer, stiffer ejector spring, weaker extractor spring, dump the o-ring, adjustable gas block or adjustable gas tube. The rifle works perfect all the time , so this is just tuning and not a fix . I will try the upper with my target rifle lower and see if that makes any diff. The brass does show a slight ding or cut as you said so I believe also that they are bouncing off of a corner of the ejection port or the deflector corner . Thanks for the info. |
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Ding or cut where on the brass?
If near the rim with more of a cut type dent, then the bolt is extracting too far back, and you may need to shim or rework the receiver extension so you can thread it in another thread of two. Pull back on the charging handle, and look where the front face of the bolt stops. The face of the bolt should stop between 1/8" to 1/4" in front of the back of ejection port window. If you find that the face of the bolt stops even with, or behind the ejection port widow a hair, then pull the buffer and spring, drop a quarter down the tube, put the buffer and spring back in, and retest. The quarter or two down the tube can be left long term, but if you want to pull the band-aid down the line and correct the problem, then the receiver extension needs to be threaded into the receiver another wind or two instead. Note here, the end of the tube holds the buffer retainer in, and with the tube installed and butt stock indexed correctly, the end of the tube should just kiss the center pin of the buffer retainer. So on that note, if you do need to thread the tube in deeper to the receiver, you will need to face the end of the tube to correctly index of both the butt stock and buffer retainer retention. As for a dent mid way up the case, that is caused by the defector doing it job correctly (military does not reload). If this type of denting is bothering you, then just install some cloth side sticky back velcro to the deflector to soften the blow of the spent case off the deflector. I state this since you can screw around with the rifle to try to make the rifle not eject the spent cases off the defector, but when you switch ammo's, may find that now the rifle just ends shoving the spent cases back into the front of the ejection port window instead. |
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Thanks Dano ,
In generalities - are the rifle vs mid length vs carbine somewhat softer or maybe more of a slower bolt and carrier speed from long to short ? Since my rifle length gas (20" ) all have seemed to eject to the 5 oclock area , where as carbines and midlengths have bounced off of the deflector as I recall. |
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Quoted: Ok , I know this had been beat to death through out the years , but what are the thoughts on an acceptable ejection path ? I have a 16 mid-length gas barrel A2 that goes about 5 feet at 2 o'clock . My target barrel 20 inch krieger goes same distance but at consistently at 5 o'clock . So is there something wrong with the mid length or are they just bouncing off of the deflector? Thanks INTRODUCTION (3 MIN) 1. GAIN ATTENTION. In combat, most targets will be moving; the enemy will not present themselves for a deliberate shot. They will move quickly from cover to cover, exposing themselves for the shortest possible time. A moving target must be engaged quickly before it disappears. For effectiveness in combat, your shooter must engage a moving target with the same accuracy and precision as they would a stationary target under a variety of combat conditions. By the end of this period of instruction you will be able to train your shooters in the skills required to engage moving targets. UNITED STATES MARINE CORPS WEAPONS TRAINING BATTALION COMBAT MARKSMANSHIP CENTER OF EXCELLENCE MARINE CORPS COMBAT DEVELOPMENT COMMAND QUANTICO, VIRGINIA 22134-5040 Hmmmmmm .......... nothing in there about watching your brass |
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The method the Marines use: INTRODUCTION (3MIN) 1. GAIN ATTENTION. In combat, most targets will be moving; theenemy will not present themselves for a deliberate shot. They will move quickly from cover to cover,exposing themselves for the shortest possible time. A moving target must be engaged quicklybefore it disappears. For effectivenessin combat, your shooter must engage a moving target with the same accuracy andprecision as they would a stationary target under a variety of combatconditions. Bythe end of this period of instruction you will be able to train your shooters inthe skills required to engage moving targets. [div style='text-align: center;']UNITED STATES MARINECORPS [div style='text-align: center;']WEAPONS TRAINING BATTALION [div style='text-align: center;']COMBAT MARKSMANSHIP CENTER OF EXCELLENCE [div style='text-align: center;'] MARINECORPS COMBAT DEVELOPMENT COMMAND [div style='text-align: center;'] QUANTICO, VIRGINIA22134-5040 Hmmmmmm .......... nothing in there about watching your brass Quoted:
Quoted:
Ok , I know this had been beat to death through out the years , but what are the thoughts on an acceptable ejection path ? I have a 16 mid-length gas barrel A2 that goes about 5 feet at 2 o'clock . My target barrel 20 inch krieger goes same distance but at consistently at 5 o'clock . So is there something wrong with the mid length or are they just bouncing off of the deflector? Thanks INTRODUCTION (3MIN) 1. GAIN ATTENTION. In combat, most targets will be moving; theenemy will not present themselves for a deliberate shot. They will move quickly from cover to cover,exposing themselves for the shortest possible time. A moving target must be engaged quicklybefore it disappears. For effectivenessin combat, your shooter must engage a moving target with the same accuracy andprecision as they would a stationary target under a variety of combatconditions. Bythe end of this period of instruction you will be able to train your shooters inthe skills required to engage moving targets. [div style='text-align: center;']UNITED STATES MARINECORPS [div style='text-align: center;']WEAPONS TRAINING BATTALION [div style='text-align: center;']COMBAT MARKSMANSHIP CENTER OF EXCELLENCE [div style='text-align: center;'] MARINECORPS COMBAT DEVELOPMENT COMMAND [div style='text-align: center;'] QUANTICO, VIRGINIA22134-5040 Hmmmmmm .......... nothing in there about watching your brass I missed the part about timing the deflector dents in your empties as well. |
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