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Posted: 7/26/2011 10:52:41 AM EDT
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looking at building another upper possibly in 300blk. because of the fact the 300blk is meant to be suppressed it got me thinking of what type of upper to use. I have noticed some people are using side charging uppers saying that by moving the CH to the side it helps stop the blow back that comes out of the CH and into your face.
anyone have any experience on using them? are they just as reliable? do they stop or cut down on the blow back a little, a lot or not really at all? are any better than others? some pics of what I am talking about: 
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I know that some folks have had experience with the ASA upper.
ASA To my knowledge, this is the only design with a non-reciprocating charging handle (FAL style). I would love one, but they sure are expensive. |
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Check out LAR Mfg.
http://www.largrizzly.com/web/guest/ops-4-uppers |
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I want this:
http://www.dlsports.com/ar15_side_charging_handle/ar15_side_charging_handle_2_large.jpg as a civilian lefty, I love it. Price sucks. |
| The ASA doesn't have a standard charging handle. However, there is a removable piece there (so the gas key can slide out) and there can be a lot of blow back through that piece. My 9mm AR built on an ASA sidecharger has quite a bit of blowback, so factor that in. |
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I think you'd be better served by replacing the forward assist with a gas vent.
http://www.weaponoutfitters.com/products/ar-gas-vent |
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Well I have looked over the side charging upper a ton. I have called and talked to most (not all) of the people offering side charging uppers.
As far as I have seen you have basically three types of uppers 1. right or left side milled out upper. Basically a regular upper that someone has removed material to allow them to tap and put in the charging handle into the bolt carrier (various places offer this and usually are on competition guns look at WOA, or the guy offering 6mmAR turbo just as an example) 2. Right or left side milled upper produced from a re-enforced/beefed up upper (look at LAR, Mega, Alexander Arms) 3. Left side non-reciprocating upper (look at JP rifles SCR and PCR and American Spirit Arms) 4. http://www.hpirifles.com/ (Odd looking but I haven't talked to them or heard reviews) Now having said that I talked to LAR grizzly about their left hand side charging OPS upper and making it into a 300 blackout/whisper and the guy I talked to said that if I was going to do suppressed shooting (shooting it right handed) to expect to get gas blowback from the left hand-side. He said he didn't know how much but that on the .223 they were getting some blow-back when running suppressed but with the right hand side charging upper and shooting right handed it was the best he had shot as far as gas blowback on a DI gun. If you want a suppressed left hand side charging upper and not get any gas blowback I would recommend getting either the ASA or the JP rifles. If it was up to me I would get the JP (although insanely priced) because it still retains the top charging handle and forward assist (I use it when hunting and chambering a round quietly and making sure it is seated correctly). I have handled the ASA upper and it was nice but the lack of the FA killed it for me. I really like the LAR upper and still am considering it but only with the right-hand charging handle YMMV hope this helps |
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Quoted:
Now having said that I talked to LAR grizzly about their left hand side charging OPS upper and making it into a 300 blackout/whisper and the guy I talked to said that if I was going to do suppressed shooting (shooting it right handed) to expect to get gas blowback from the left hand-side. He said he didn't know how much but that on the .223 they were getting some blow-back when running suppressed but with the right hand side charging upper and shooting right handed it was the best he had shot as far as gas blowback on a DI gun. That is curious. I wonder why that happens? Perhaps because of the gas vents on the right side of the carrier, blowing the chamber blow back out to the side? If so, a solution would be to add a gas vent on the left side or the carrier. |
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Bret -
Maybe I can explain this a little better. With their (left side) side charging upper you have a thin channel that allows the charging handle (which is attached to the BCG) to reciprocated with the BCG. This thin channel is open you you get part of the gas that is normally expelled only out the right side ejection port. The only way that I have seen it fixed was by have a cover for the slide and a non-reciprocating handle a la JP rifles or ASA. As to who has the best price on the OPS 4 upper they all seem to be about the same price but I would be looking at the forged upper instead of the milled upper because you could save ~100.00 bucks by buying the forged upper which has the same dimensions as the milled upper. |
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Quoted:
Bret - Maybe I can explain this a little better. With their (left side) side charging upper you have a thin channel that allows the charging handle (which is attached to the BCG) to reciprocated with the BCG. This thin channel is open you you get part of the gas that is normally expelled only out the right side ejection port. The only way that I have seen it fixed was by have a cover for the slide and a non-reciprocating handle a la JP rifles or ASA. "Their", meaning Mega style? I guess what I didn't get is why more gas from the left side slot than the right? Or is it more from left slot AND right ejection port than just the right port/slot combo? So you are getting the blow back from both sides vs just one. So the LWRC REPR style would be ideal, with a non-recip hande AND a cover, vs ASA which has no cover. |
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My 7.62x40WT is built on a LAR side charger. It's not quite complete yet, so I haven't fired it. http://www.hunt101.com/data/500/IMG_01987.JPG Are you using the forged or not forged LAR upper receiver? |
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Quoted:
Looking at LAR's site, why wouldn't a right handed person want the left hand model? It seems like having the CH on the left would make it easier to operate, Or am I missing something? I think your missing the ejection port on the opposite side. If you don't mind hot brass slapping your shoulder and neck every shot then yes it may be easier. |
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Quoted:
Quoted:
My 7.62x40WT is built on a LAR side charger. It's not quite complete yet, so I haven't fired it. http://www.hunt101.com/data/500/IMG_01987.JPG Are you using the forged or not forged LAR upper receiver? It's the forged upper. |
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Delta Company Arms has them and they also make great, super accurate 300 Blk. They are quality uppers from them. Ask for Aaron and tell them Bob from Dallas sent you.
He can fill you in on the side charging handle and any and all questions about suppressing the 300 blk and everything else 300 blk. |
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Bret -
What I was referring to was an upper like the first one pictured in the OP. I was going to build an upper just like that and run a suppressor on it but LAR Grizzly told me I would be getting gas out of the left side as well as the right side so I would be eating some. They had been running a suppressed 5.56 like the first one pictured (but with a 16" barrel) and the guy at LAR said there was enough blowback out the left side that you could taste the powder almost as if you had the ejection port on the same side as your face. Having said that he did recommend one like the third picture down in the OP and said because they put a plug where the standard charging handle goes in the upper the gasses can only escape out the right side and when shooting it suppressed as a right handed shooter you had zero blow back in the face. Still optimum would be the JP rifles or the LWRC reper style if you wanted the charging handle on the left side ETA: If your looking for an upper from them about the only place I know of besides local stores where I live that carry them and the manufacturers website would probably be JoeBob outfitters (sp?) They sale some LAR Grizzly complete uppers so I bet they could get you a price |
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Quoted:
Bret - What I was referring to was an upper like the first one pictured in the OP. I was going to build an upper just like that and run a suppressor on it but LAR Grizzly told me I would be getting gas out of the left side as well as the right side so I would be eating some. They had been running a suppressed 5.56 like the first one pictured (but with a 16" barrel) and the guy at LAR said there was enough blowback out the left side that you could taste the powder almost as if you had the ejection port on the same side as your face. Having said that he did recommend one like the third picture down in the OP and said because they put a plug where the standard charging handle goes in the upper the gasses can only escape out the right side and when shooting it suppressed as a right handed shooter you had zero blow back in the face. Still optimum would be the JP rifles or the LWRC reper style if you wanted the charging handle on the left side ETA: If your looking for an upper from them about the only place I know of besides local stores where I live that carry them and the manufacturers website would probably be JoeBob outfitters (sp?) They sale some LAR Grizzly complete uppers so I bet they could get you a price Thanks, Now i understand what you were saying. I looked at the JP side charger... $1700 for the barreled upper with BCG. I bet they sell a lot of those.... NOT! |
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I do believe that Rytle was referring to a right hand, right eye dominant person,
the charging handle on the left side of the receiver would provide the proper ergonomics for said shooter and the hot brass coming from the ejection port on the right side of the receiver would not even come close to slapping the shoulder or neck he did not miss anything ...... you may have perceived him being left handed and/or been confused by the charging handle on the left side of the receiver Quoted:
Quoted:
Looking at LAR's site, why wouldn't a right handed person want the left hand model? It seems like having the CH on the left would make it easier to operate, Or am I missing something? I think your missing the ejection port on the opposite side. If you don't mind hot brass slapping your shoulder and neck every shot then yes it may be easier. |
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Quoted:
I do believe that Rytle was referring to a right hand, right eye dominant person, the charging handle on the left side of the receiver would provide the proper ergonomics for said shooter and the hot brass coming from the ejection port on the right side of the receiver would not even come close to slapping the shoulder or neck he did not miss anything ...... you may have perceived him being left handed and/or been confused by the charging handle on the left side of the receiver Quoted:
Quoted:
Looking at LAR's site, why wouldn't a right handed person want the left hand model? It seems like having the CH on the left would make it easier to operate, Or am I missing something? I think your missing the ejection port on the opposite side. If you don't mind hot brass slapping your shoulder and neck every shot then yes it may be easier. this, Rytle is correct |
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