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Posted: 11/8/2010 8:43:12 AM EDT
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I've looked through the different guides and searched the internet, but I can't seem to find - what form do you use to register the firearm? Does it cost anything? and when do you have to register it? I can't see registering it after you finish it, as you would have an illegal firearm, so do you have to register it when its still at 80%?
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You don't have to register anything. You don't have to put a serial number on it either. Nothing illegal about finishing them. If you have the means knock yourself out. So you can order an 80% lower. Machine it out. And then use it, without putting a serial number or anything on it? So adding a serial number, model number, etc isn't needed? |
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You don't need a serial number on it legally, but it's recommended should it get lost or stolen you would be able to identify it.
I have heard you are supposed to have a manufacturer and location manufactured engraving, but that I am not sure on. Other than that, you don't need to register it. |
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Since this has come up a lot recently...
ATF Federal Firearms Regulations Reference Guide http://www.atf.gov/publications/download/p/atf-p-5300-4.pdf Page 176 (177 of the pdf): (A6) Does the GCA prohibit anyone from making a handgun, shotgun or rifle? With certain exceptions a firearm may be made by a nonlicensee provided it is not for sale and the maker is not prohibited from possessing firearms. However, a person is prohibited from assembling a nonsporting semi-automatic rifle or nonsporting shotgun from imported parts. In addition, the making of an NFA firearm requires a tax payment and approval by ATF. An application to make a machinegun will not be approved unless documentation is submitted showing that the firearm is being made for a Federal or State agency. [18 U.S.C. 922(o) and (r), 26 U.S.C. 5822, 27 CFR 478.39, 479.62 and 479.105] |
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I have been lurking for awhile, but this is my first official posting/question. Since we are discussing 80% lowers, and I have an interest in doing one of these builds (I am a machinist with machine tools in my home shop), I have a question regarding pre-ban features. Is it legal to build an 80% lower in a pre-ban configuration, if you live in a state like MA, where those evil features are prohibited? OP, sorry for the threadjack, if I should make my topic, let me know, and I will do so.
thanks! |
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I have been lurking for awhile, but this is my first official posting/question. Since we are discussing 80% lowers, and I have an interest in doing one of these builds (I am a machinist with machine tools in my home shop), I have a question regarding pre-ban features. Is it legal to build an 80% lower in a pre-ban configuration, if you live in a state like MA, where those evil features are prohibited? OP, sorry for the threadjack, if I should make my topic, let me know, and I will do so. thanks! Hey, It's fine! I don't know for Maryland, but if you need a preban lower in order to have the evil features, then it has to be a preban. You can't have the evil features, because you are manufacturing a new firearm, it is not a preban. I know this is true for NY and CT, I don't know any other states that have an AWB. However, if they do have an AWB you will need to find a preban. |
MA is Massachusetts, Maryland would be MD  Otherwise I do believe you are correct. 80% lowers machined yourself are not pre-ban and hence subject to state-level AWB regulations. Quoted: Quoted: I have been lurking for awhile, but this is my first official posting/question. Since we are discussing 80% lowers, and I have an interest in doing one of these builds (I am a machinist with machine tools in my home shop), I have a question regarding pre-ban features. Is it legal to build an 80% lower in a pre-ban configuration, if you live in a state like MA, where those evil features are prohibited? OP, sorry for the threadjack, if I should make my topic, let me know, and I will do so. thanks! Hey, It's fine! I don't know for Maryland, but if you need a preban lower in order to have the evil features, then it has to be a preban. You can't have the evil features, because you are manufacturing a new firearm, it is not a preban. I know this is true for NY and CT, I don't know any other states that have an AWB. However, if they do have an AWB you will need to find a preban. |
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Thanks, that makes sense, I guess, being that it is technically a brand new build. Where I was confused, is in the different set of rules that seem to apply with them, like not requiring serial numbers, registration, etc. I was thinking that since none of that other stuff was applicable, then maybe the evil features could slip through the cracks, like building a new gun based with a pre-ban lower. I mean how would anyone really know when it was actually buit, if it was in essence a home made gun?
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| I just finished my 80% lower 2 months. I'm making a SBR out of mine so I sent it out for laser engraving and anodizing. I completed a form 1 and listed my trust as the manufacturer. I made up a S/N, model, and caliber. I sent the $200.00 to the ATF and 58 days later had the approved form 1. ATF told me long as state and local laws make it legal to own, you don't need anything on it. |
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I just finished my 80% lower 2 months. I'm making a SBR out of mine so I sent it out for laser engraving and anodizing. I completed a form 1 and listed my trust as the manufacturer. I made up a S/N, model, and caliber. I sent the $200.00 to the ATF and 58 days later had the approved form 1. ATF told me long as state and local laws make it legal to own, you don't need anything on it. Smart move. Necessary if you want to SBR it probably. While a S/N is not technically required for most home built guns or assault rifles, I believe it is very foolish NOT to stamp some sort of fake, made-up number on guns you build. Most gun enthusiasts are like the OP: they are not previously aware of the laws on home built guns. Most LEOs are not gun enthusiasts - so you have a miniscule chance of encountering an LEO who knows that you don't have to have a serial number on a home build. What will the average LEO think if he ever sees your firearm WITHOUT a serial number? "Confiscate! - the number has been obviously removed." Can't expect every cop to know every law (especially one as obscure as this). That is a situation I do NOT want to find myself in. So I would stamp a number on the receiver if I ever built a gun. Please cut the LEOs a break for once & just stamp a number on it. |
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You don't have to register anything. You don't have to put a serial number on it either. Nothing illegal about finishing them. If you have the means knock yourself out. So you can order an 80% lower. Machine it out. And then use it, without putting a serial number or anything on it? So adding a serial number, model number, etc isn't needed? Yes |
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You don't have to register anything. You don't have to put a serial number on it either. Nothing illegal about finishing them. If you have the means knock yourself out. So you can order an 80% lower. Machine it out. And then use it, without putting a serial number or anything on it? So adding a serial number, model number, etc isn't needed? Yes This comes up often enough that it shoudl be a huge, neon, flashing, attention-grabbing sticky so that people stop asking the same q. over and over. |
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no, you don't HAVE to id /ser. number them, but why wouldn't you? it's the icing on the cake, and might stop roscoe p. from runnin ya in. http://i367.photobucket.com/albums/oo119/hotdogit250/donem4gery00672.jpg Ok, so not having a serial number might induce the po-po to "run ya in" but having your lower marked "safe/semi/burst" won't induce the same reaction, especially when you try to tell him "I don't need no stinkin' papers 'cause it's a semi"? Gotta love your line of reasoning, there. The bottom line is that there is no federal requirement for an individual to place a serial number on a home-made Title I firearm any more than there are federal restrictions on marking your semi-automatic lower with "safe/semi'burst." |
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Ok so..dumb question... How do you STAMP the receiver with info? Does anyone make stencils for engraving that are small enough / good enough to use an engraver? Or do you just send it out ? (but doesn't the company that does the engraving/laser work need to be an ffl???
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no, you don't HAVE to id /ser. number them, but why wouldn't you? it's the icing on the cake, and might stop roscoe p. from runnin ya in. http://i367.photobucket.com/albums/oo119/hotdogit250/donem4gery00672.jpg there is no federal requirement for an individual to place a serial number on a home-made Title I firearm any more than there are federal restrictions on marking your semi-automatic lower with "safe/semi'burst." There is no restriction, but how many cops know that? To them it screams "this guy removed the serial number from the weapon!" I don't see any reason not to engrave a serial number on something you finished yourself. It has far more pro's than con's. |
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Ok so..dumb question... How do you STAMP the receiver with info? Does anyone make stencils for engraving that are small enough / good enough to use an engraver? Or do you just send it out ? (but doesn't the company that does the engraving/laser work need to be an ffl??? Some places you can buy metal punch stamps with letters, or you could use a dremmel. neither of those look really professional. I've had local trophy shops do mine for about 15$. There's no requirement for an FFL if its still at 80% when you do the engraving. Otherwise there are places you can ship it to like Orion Arms and Indent Marking that do great work with firearm engraving. |
| Engraving tools and letter/number stamps are cheap. When finishing a lower build, I recommend putting "STOLEN FROM (your name)" on the grip web. CT passed some idiotic law that makes gun owners liable for what breaking and entering thieves do with property that they had no business touching, so it might help if you are a crime victim returning from a vacation. |
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Ok so..dumb question... How do you STAMP the receiver with info? Does anyone make stencils for engraving that are small enough / good enough to use an engraver? Or do you just send it out ? (but doesn't the company that does the engraving/laser work need to be an ffl??? This isn't stamping, but is an excellent tutorial that shows how to etch a lower. |
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you absolutely can't stamp the lower without supporting it from the inside. when the military overstamped during upgrades they used a expandable device inside the magwell for support, no idea about the rear. have it engraved, its better all around.
if you start with a 0%er stamp away, BEFORE machining. |
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Where I was confused, is in the different set of rules that seem to apply with them, like not requiring serial numbers, registration, etc. You need to be careful. I know MA requires registration of some types of firearms (handguns specifically) but you need to be sure that this applies in MA, and in your town and county. After all, most of us are familiar only with the laws in our own states, MA or your town may require registration of this, even if Fed law doesn't, and you're the one responsible for knowing and following your state AND local laws. |
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