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Posted: 11/1/2010 4:24:45 AM EDT
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I've seen lots of lowers here marked for the third position, burst or FA. Assuming that you do not have a FA or burst capable weapon, does the safety go to that position? Is there a specific safety for that style lower? Will that work in a standard lower? Will the weapon fire in that position or will it be like a redundant safety position.
Stupid question I know, but like one of my professors said in college, "you aren't born knowing this." Thanks! |
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Quoted:
I've seen lots of lowers here marked for the third position, burst or FA. Assuming that you do not have a FA or burst capable weapon, does the safety go to that position? Is there a specific safety for that style lower? Will that work in a standard lower? Will the weapon fire in that position or will it be like a redundant safety position. Stupid question I know, but like one of my professors said in college, "you aren't born knowing this." Thanks! This question will get A LOT of emotional responses... 1. The safety will not go into the third position if it is from a semi-auto parts kit. 2. There is no specific safety besides using a semi parts kit (including the semi safety) for a semi-auto AR. Use FA or burst parts kits if you have a registered lower/etc. 3. If you put an auto safety in your semi-auto gun, well... probably the best advice is DO NOT DO THIS. 4. People will say you can put a safety that rotates to the third position with no problems. Will these people giving advice be at your trial or help pay lawyers fees or visit you in prison? 5. Do as you please. You have been duly warned. |
| From my short experience having a 3 position safety qualifies your lower as a NFA piece thus requiring BATF paperwork. I dunno the exact laws on this as my friend was asking me about this just the other day since he got a Spikes lower with the third position on the lower. He is wondering if he can modify a semi safety to go into the 3rd selection without being an actual M16 safety. |
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I used to think parts like a 3pos Safety, M16 BCG were NFA parts and illegal to use with a semi-only AR15, but I'm not so sure anymore.
You can by a 3 position ambi-safety on BravoCompany and it's not labelled as NFA only: http://www.bravocompanyusa.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=Selector+Safety+Ambi+-+Auto&CartID=1 Most other items on Bravo that are NFA are marked NFA: http://www.bravocompanyusa.com/Geissele-AR15-Super-Automatic-Trigger-SSF-p/geissele%20ssf%20trigger%20spin.htm EDIT: nevermind. Looked over at model1sales and looks like the M16 type safety selector is NFA only. |
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There's generally two schools of thought:
1. A FA safety selector means you have a MG, which means 10 years and $250k fine if convictied of unregistered MG. 2. Unless the FA selector allows your rifle to fire more than one time on a single function of the trigger (the legal definition of a MG), you're GTG. Is the selector, by itself, a part or collection of parts that allows a firearm to fire automatically? I say no (you need the sear, disconnect, third hole in the lower, etc.), but I'm not going to temp fate by putting one in mine. If you have a selector that rotates to the third position, but won't accept the FA disconnect, won't allow tripping of an auto sear, only allows semi firing, etc. I think you on good legal ground. But, is it worth the cost of proving that to a jury? |
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Quoted:
There's generally two schools of thought: 1. A FA safety selector means you have a MG, which means 10 years and $250k fine if convictied of unregistered MG. 2. Unless the FA selector allows your rifle to fire more than one time on a single function of the trigger (the legal definition of a MG), you're GTG. Is the selector, by itself, a part or collection of parts that allows a firearm to fire automatically? I say no (you need the sear, disconnect, third hole in the lower, etc.), but I'm not going to temp fate by putting one in mine. If you have a selector that rotates to the third position, but won't accept the FA disconnect, won't allow tripping of an auto sear, only allows semi firing, etc. I think you on good legal ground. But, is it worth the cost of proving that to a jury? I did a quick google search and this above is basically what I found. Apparently a company called Sarco made a 3 position safety that was demilled so it wouldn't work for FA, but the 3 position selector is considered an M16 part according to the BATFE. I'm not one to test fate. |
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1) You have to have all the auto parts before it is a machinegun or
2) You have to a semi-gun with a part that is only designed for converting to full auto (i.e. drop in auto sear, lightning link) or 3) You have modified the semi-auto gun to readily convert to full auto (i.e. receiver drilled for sear pin). If you don't meet one of those criteria, it is not a machinegun. Here's a letter that talks about M16 bolts which are no more a machinegun than a three position safety. http://www.gandrtactical.com/images/archive/ATF%20M16%20Letter.pdf |
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Quoted:
1) You have to have all the auto parts before it is a machinegun or 2) You have to a semi-gun with a part that is only designed for converting to full auto (i.e. drop in auto sear, lightning link) or 3) You have modified the semi-auto gun to readily convert to full auto (i.e. receiver drilled for sear pin). If you don't meet one of those criteria, it is not a machinegun. Here's a letter that talks about M16 bolts which are no more a machinegun than a three position safety. http://www.gandrtactical.com/images/archive/ATF%20M16%20Letter.pdf The above is inaccurate and false. The line of thought as shown above will make you cellmates with the arfcommer from WI who now sits in Federal Prison. |
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Quoted:
Quoted:
1) You have to have all the auto parts before it is a machinegun or 2) You have to a semi-gun with a part that is only designed for converting to full auto (i.e. drop in auto sear, lightning link) or 3) You have modified the semi-auto gun to readily convert to full auto (i.e. receiver drilled for sear pin). If you don't meet one of those criteria, it is not a machinegun. Here's a letter that talks about M16 bolts which are no more a machinegun than a three position safety. http://www.gandrtactical.com/images/archive/ATF%20M16%20Letter.pdf The above is inaccurate and false. The line of thought as shown above will make you cellmates with the arfcommer from WI who now sits in Federal Prison. Olofson got exactly what he deserved. His gun slammed fired and he knew it, never corrected it and loaned it to an idiot while telling him it fired full auto. Had nothing to do with the safety, had everything to do with his gun firing more than one shot when the trigger was pulled. If you're gonna mess with the fire control group and/or safety, you better make damn sure it doesn't fire more than once when the trigger is pulled. Otherwise, it's a machine gun. Duh. http://cid-be5a30444a40df09.office.live.com/self.aspx/.Public/Olofson/Olofson%20Conviction%20Upheld.pdf |
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Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
1) You have to have all the auto parts before it is a machinegun or 2) You have to a semi-gun with a part that is only designed for converting to full auto (i.e. drop in auto sear, lightning link) or 3) You have modified the semi-auto gun to readily convert to full auto (i.e. receiver drilled for sear pin). If you don't meet one of those criteria, it is not a machinegun. Here's a letter that talks about M16 bolts which are no more a machinegun than a three position safety. http://www.gandrtactical.com/images/archive/ATF%20M16%20Letter.pdf The above is inaccurate and false. The line of thought as shown above will make you cellmates with the arfcommer from WI who now sits in Federal Prison. Olofson got exactly what he deserved. His gun slammed fired and he knew it, never corrected it and loaned it to an idiot while telling him it fired full auto. Had nothing to do with the safety, had everything to do with his gun firing more than one shot when the trigger was pulled. http://cid-be5a30444a40df09.office.live.com/self.aspx/.Public/Olofson/Olofson%20Conviction%20Upheld.pdf 3 important facts to note: 1. He used a 3 position safety. 2. His gun malfunctioned. 3. He now sits in prison. |
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