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Posted: 2/1/2010 11:58:52 AM EDT
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I need to buy a stripped barrel for my first build and I'm torn between the standard at $170.00 or the cold hammered at $270.00 so how much difference is there really? Is this the same lesson as the BCG's?
Thank you in advance for your comments!!! MfS 
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Cold hammer forged has the expectation of better accuracy for a few reasons…
First: the way the bore is formed… from the outside in. A cold hammer forged barrel starts out as a blank with a hole bored down the center that is a bit larger than the desired bore diameter… Then a mandrill that has the negative of the desired rifling is inserted into the bore and the hammers beat the barrel onto the mandrill as the barrel is drawn along thus forming the lands and groves from the outside in… When the barrel is profiled the bore tends to tighten up just a bit providing for better accuracy. (As opposed to cut rifling which tends to open up just a bit when material is removed from the outside diameter, thus having a negative effect on accuracy) Second: the hammer forging process does not leave tooling marks in the bore like cut rifling does, so the need to lap the bore is eliminated and what you get is a bore with a much more consistent finish than you would on cut rifling. There are plenty of resources that go into detail on the benefits of hammer forged barrels on the web if you want to learn more. THIS IS A GOOD LINK But, at the end of the day, I think both offerings from Daniel Defense are great barrels. It’s up to you if you want to spend the extra coin on the better of the two. |
| IMHO hammer forged barrels are the flavor of the month............Krieger, Douglas, Lilja have supurb reputations.......and are not hammer forged........Savage bolt action rifles are extremely accurate and are buttoned rifled........A shit load of CMP shooters swear by Krieger........single cut rifling............But, like I said thats just my opinion......................If one was truly better than the rest, everyone would be using the same barrel.................. |
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IMHO hammer forged barrels are the flavor of the month............Krieger, Douglas, Lilja have supurb reputations.......and are not hammer forged........Savage bolt action rifles are extremely accurate and are buttoned rifled........A shit load of CMP shooters swear by Krieger........single cut rifling............But, like I said thats just my opinion......................If one was truly better than the rest, everyone would be using the same barrel.................. +1 You speak the truth. |
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A match shooter I am not (yet) and would probably not tell the difference but I was swayed by the longivity of the barrel comment and was willing to spend my other Franklin for it.
Gentlemen... again I thank you for your experience and opions. You have not steered me wrong so far and for that I toast you all. 
MfS
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Quoted:
I need to buy a stripped barrel for my first build and I'm torn between the standard at $170.00 or the cold hammered at $270.00 so how much difference is there really? Is this the same lesson as the BCG's? Thank you in advance for your comments!!! MfS pk has the CHF barrels for $250 IIRC. |
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If I understand it correctly the process has been around for a while but its just now entering the AR arena? The flavor of the month like piston systems I think someone mentioned earlier?
I'm starting to get the "if it works why fix it" mentality on the AR platform. The light bulb just came back on!!! |
| The button rifled barrel will be more than accurate enough for just about any shooter out there. There are some pluses to the CHF barrel but most shooters won't be able to tell the difference. Go with the standard non-hammer forged barrel. You will be more than satisfied. |
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The article was written by a Sturm Ruger engineer so he would be biased. That being said the only advantage to a hammer forged barrel is the forging process that produces a barrel that is more wear resistant than a button rifled and cut rifled barrel. They would relatively last longer. However being a match shooter myself and researching barrels for the last twenty years it is a fact that match shooters accept cut rifling as the most accurate, albeit they will burn out a barrel in <10K rounds before replacing. Remember they are looking for accuracy by the tenth of an inch.
The start up cost for a hammer forge machine as mentioned is expensive, and the cost is passed to the consumer. I actually bought the DD barrel at 169.00 recently and built a rifle that is acceptable for my use which has showed good accuracy (for the 15 degree temps that day at the range.) 2" from a rest with my SHTF loads (62 gr IMI FMJSCBT 25.8 gr 748, CCI450, REM Ni Case,) w/ACOG . I think I might be able to do better with a little tweaking of the load. Like everything in the AR World if you have the money you can increase your edge slightly and in different ways. It is the balance between effect and the relative cost of effect which is subjective. Or perhaps an illustrative scenario: Hammer Forged Barrel: You are being over run by Isane-istans and you are on your 30th clip. Cut Rifled Barrel: Hadji is exposing his forehead at 300 meters in a window. Just my $0.02 |
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Why then does nobody at the top level of any competition that I know of use them? I am the farthest thing from a expert on barrels but I cant remember ever seeing one even mentioned on a bench/highpower rig. As far as I know it’s because they (the “top” match shooters) can get any twist rate that they want from a barrel maker that cuts the rifling… if they want a 1:8.657 rate of twist for their special hand load, they can have it… You can’t do that with a hammer forging machine unless you have $1,000,000.00 in extra mandrils lying around. Would you use a 16” M-4 barrel for a match gun where 1/10’s of an inch matter?????? No… The guy isn’t building a match gun, he is building a battle rifle and as far as I understand, the hammer forged barrel will offer him a barrel that will take more abuse. As far as accuracy goes, I only know what I have read regarding the effects on accuracy. (Daniel Defense reports better accuracy out of the Cold Hammer Forged Barrel, but maybe that’s just an evil marketing ploy designed to deceive their customers and milk another $100 out of them) I guess the only way to know is to test the two Daniel Defense barrels in a scientific manner and see which one produced the tightest groups with everything else being equal. I passed along what I understood, and encouraged the OP to do further research on his own. If the rest of you have references that state otherwise please offer them up so the rest of us can read them and be further enlightened… And as far as Cold Hammer Forged barrels being the “flavor of the day”… Colt and FN have been using them for decades… I wouldn’t exactly say they were the “latest thing”. |
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Thank you so much Conkle73 for that excellent article on the CHF barrels. Very different from how I picutured it.
Your also correct that it is going to come down to the OP on what he thinks he needs and knows then asking the right questions here. Every preconcieved idea of what I thought I needed for my first build has been changed by asking the right questions and reading your responses and everything I can get my hands on from the members experiences. ie. Buy/Build, triggers, BCG's, DI vs pistons, metal/plastic sights, gas blocks and now barrels. When we have everyones collective knowledge and experience offered to us, the OP then can make HIS best educated decision. So members, please take a deep breath and count to 3 when that next newbie (like me) begins a thread with "can I use an FA BCG legally?" Because its your love of the platform and patience that hooked me and I will try to share your enthusiasm with all my non AR platform challenged friends. NICE BIG mention in the Rifle Shoter / January-February 2010 article "THE AR BUILD" by David M. Fortier. "if you're looking for information on parts, accessories, tools or have a question during assembly, the web board AR15.COM offers a wealth of knowledge. Once completed, don't forget to introduce a friend to the fun of shooting your new plack rifle."
Thanks for the data on the barrels. I am going with a 16" chome lined standard mid and we will look again on our second build for my sons sniper based rig. Cheers MfS
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| I'm doing my first build and I went for the DD 169 dollar barrel. Doing the 5.56 thing for now and will probably build a 6.8 SPC later. I ordered the Spikes tactical billet upper and lower and a Magpul stock. Should be fun, looking forward to doing it and want to thank everyone on here for all the advice and comments. |
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