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Posted: 7/8/2004 8:15:54 AM EDT
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I live in PA and took delivery of a brand new stripped receiver from my dealer today. My plan was to register it as a handgun and build it into a bolt action AR pistol. Once and if the ban sets I could then make it run semiauto. I have read of others doing this on the site and it seemed pretty straight forward. The problem arose after all the paperwork was filled out. We filled out the standard form and the additional white form used for handguns in PA. The white form is only used for handguns but it doesn't actually say that anywhere. I wanted to have proof that it was registered as a handgun so I asked the how we could mark the form as a handgun. He didn't know so he called the ATF. The inspector at the ATF told him to register it as a long gun. He said that I could then make it into a pistol whenever I wanted but that I had to make it back into a rifle if I ever wanted to sell it. As far as I know, this is completely inaccurate. I convinced my dealer that the ATF guy was wrong so we simply wrote that it was a stripped receiver that was going to be used for a handgun on the form. The ATF guy also said that we shouldn't send the white form in because it was going to go into the computer as a long gun. We decided to send it in anyways just as if it were a handgun that I was receiving. Is there anything else I should do? Do you think the receiver is actually going to be registered as a handgun? Am I wrong about how we should have handled things? Thanks for any help. |
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Fq1234- I had a detailed post that timed out and erased itself during posting (*&%$@# slow internet connection!) It boiled down to this: registration of handguns is a state law as oppossed to federal law issue, so the PA commonwealths attorneys office would be my next call. I am sure the federal ATF agent is completely familiar with the federal gun laws, he may not be as proficient in state law issues. Cheers, Otto (cont-A, cont-C, then "submit", so if it times out again, cont-V brings it back! *&%$@# slow internet connection!) |
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Yea, you got some bad advise and I think you did the right thing! I did my 4473 and state forms as an AR-15 PISTOL RECEIVER and I made it perfectly clear when I ordered the lower that I wasn't going to buy if they didn't do the paperwork that way... Just the same, as a RECEIVER alone is not a rifle you can still build it as a pistol and you want to document your initial build as a PISTOL. The law is quite strange here in that you can build the receiver as a Pistol and then configure it as a rifle BUT there is no way to convert a rifle to a pistol so if you first build as a RIFLE you would not be able to later convert to a pistol  Otherwise, you did the right thing! Pistols need to be regstered with the State and the white form needed to go in! Congrats! Here is mine....  |
What, the ATF guy said to list as rifle!?  Idiot!If the FFL/Manufactuer that you bought it knew it was for a pistol, I would imagine they took measures to list it that way. So, if you transfer FFL was told it was a pistol, then it should have been marked ont the 4473 as a pistol. Mine, if I recall, was marked pistol, then under, if I recall, where it lists the make model and other stuff, they put down stripped receiver some where. Then, in my state (as in many), pistols have to be registered. So, the state pistol form was filled out, and it was noted it was a stripped lower. The "expert" at the shop I used said, be it a 1911 stripped frame or a AR15 stripped frame, a pistol is a pistol.... and the state form is filled out. I took one extra step. I asked for a photo copy of the state form. (Plus my invoice said it was a pistol lower too.) |
Are talking about the factory doing that, or the end user? The only place I know of that actually lists/listed an AR pistol lower was Hesse/Vulcan in their Carbon Armide lower. But the lower was like $20.00 more, but cataloged listed a pistol lower..... |
what's the details on your pistol? looks cool. |
Thanks for asking... quarterbore.com/ar15m16/postbanar15pistol.htm It is a Non-Ban AR-15 pistol built on a new stripped Bushmaster lower with Bushmaster FCG parts. The pistol buffer is from Model 1 sales. The upper receiver is now a DPMS side cocker which uses a FAL style charging handle on the left side of the receiver and it makes for a handy bolt handle for ths project. The Barrel is from Kurts Kustom here on the forums and it is a 10.5-inch Douglass barrel in 300/221 Fireball (300 Whisper clone) and it was built without any gas port making this a perminant bolt-action upper. The barrel was also threaded and includes a Gem-Tech TPR-S Bi-Lock as this is a silencer I plan on adding to my collection for my AR-10s and an eventual full-blown SSK 300 Whisper. The barrel is mounted to the receiver via one of Knights Medium Long FF RAS tubes and the bipod I use with this pistol is one of the Harris Short BR bipods. This pistol was built specifically for hunting deer here in PA as we can not use semi-autos for hunting but we can use pistols. The 300 Whipser does a very good job of getting better then 30/30 performance (as compared to a comparable T/C Contender in 30/30). I just have not had the time to get a scope and start working with this project due to a new job and baby over tha past few months... I hope to have some loads ready for this fall! Now, I do also have a 11.5-inch barrel sitting next to me as I type this and I need to get a few more parts but this will have a semi-auto upper for it as well on 9/14. I will not be converting this upper to semi as I do have a use for her as she is but I do want to try out a semiauto AR-15 pistol as well. |
Yeah, what is the barrel length on that baby? I havae been debating 7.5/10.5/11.5" barrel lengths if an when I build a pistol (assuming the ban sets). Any preference/opinion on this Quarterbore? Dawg |
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I have hunted with a T/C Contender for a few years now and that is the only comparisions I can make... The longer barrels can be pretty tough to shoot off-hand and with my fathers Super-14 Contender barrel in 30/30 I can only shoot that off a rest, bipod, or leaning against a tree or shooting stocks. most people with an AR-15 pistol may not care as much about accuracy but that does not mean theser are not capable of doing pretty darned good. As I said in the post above which obviously crossed your post, I am doing a 11.5-in semauto upper for mine BUT I also have a rLightning Link so I can share this same pistol upper with my Link on lower with the link in it and have a shorty MG in the process. If Ididn't have this use, I would personally try to talk Kurt of Kutys Kistom into building me another 5.5-inch barreled 22LR uppers. Mine had the 5.5-in barrel burried under a normal Carbine Length FF tube and it really looked slick... I can't find a pic now but perhaps later I can upload one... |
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