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Posted: 1/17/2010 5:06:46 PM EDT
| anyone have one> pros/cons |
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A g2 led surefire is a great light and with a vikings tactics mount is pretty affordable. Skip the chinese play lights. Surefire has an excellent record of good quality control. People who sell chinese stuff get it in a brown box from UPS, they have no idea what, if any, quality control there is back at the factory the Red Army is making them at on the other side of the world. |
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People who sell chinese stuff get it in a brown box from UPS, they have no idea what, if any, quality control there is back at the factory the Red Army is making them at on the other side of the world. We have Surefire G3s and the Vltor mounts in stock and that is a great choice but why the constant attack on the PA branded products. I get that you don't like products made in China. Why not just say that instead of continuing to make statements about my products and my company that are not accurate. We import these and all the PA branded products from the factory and work closely with them to continually improve the quality. No they are not as good as Surefire but the comparable Surefire (Super long throw) is over $400. It true military grade and well worth it but not what everone can or wants to spend. Marshall |
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Aimless is a certified jackass.
Funny that the keyboard he is typing on to the computer he is using to abouyt 90% of the products he uses everyday are from China. I'd much rather have a Japanese or Chinese piece of electronics than some overpriced unit that gets by on name recognition. Michael |
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Aimless is a certified jackass. Funny that the keyboard he is typing on to the computer he is using to abouyt 90% of the products he uses everyday are from China. I'd much rather have a Japanese or Chinese piece of electronics than american made crap made by some overpaid union hack. Michael I don't agree with you on either point. We sell plenty of made in the US gear and are always looking for more. Most of the best AR accessories and some of the best optics are made here. There is a market for the lower priced gear and if we could build it here we would. We source them in China for the same reason most companies do. That is where the factories are. |
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Sure, I agree. I love my Eotech. But for someone to blantantly generalize that all Chinese equipment is crap is what bothers me. For some reason, when it comes to firearms, people automatically think made in the USA is guaranteeing the best. Funny how my buddy in navy EOD loves his European carbine rifle and his Japanese made EOD robot.
But yes, I love my Eotech but my chinese products from PA work just as well. MP |
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Funny that the keyboard he is typing on to the computer he is using to abouyt 90% of the products he uses everyday are from China. I'd much rather have a Japanese or Chinese piece of electronics than american made crap made by some overpaid union hack. Michael[/quote] not all unions are the same for one. the uaw has given the unions as a whole a bad rap. im glad you think im an overpaid hack union worker. you must be an overpaid scab then eh?  lets keep this on topic guys.
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...People who sell chinese stuff get it in a brown box from UPS, they have no idea what, if any, quality control there is back at the factory the Red Army is making them at on the other side of the world. ... Yet most people are jealous of Canadians and their Norinco firearms. |
I think we "get" you don't like it. Even though you've never owned any of it, you sure dis it enough. Why the attack on a site supporter all the time? |
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He does seem to have a serious chubby for you doesnt he. I think it is more for doing business with Communist China. I understand that thinking and we try and balance it by offering plenty of made in the USA product. Maybe some of the South Korean manufacturers will be at SHOT this week. |
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Quoted: Aimless is a certified jackass. Funny that the keyboard he is typing on to the computer he is using to abouyt 90% of the products he uses everyday are from China. I'd much rather have a Japanese or Chinese piece of electronics than some overpriced unit that gets by on name recognition. Michael The difference between an "overpriced unit with name recognition" is that there is large western company with quality control standing behind it. What quality control is there at these chinese factories? Do you think the dealers, which are mostly just small businesses or one man shops, that sell chinese scopes, lights etc have the ability to do quality control testing, destructive testing batch testing etc. Do you think they are spending thousands of dollars to take a 14 hour flight to China to check on how their products are made? Of course not, a bunch of scopes arrive from china on a ups truck, they throw them in the mail and hope for the best. The chinese sure don't care. They know they are immune from lawsuits if your light craps out and you're killed or if it burns your house down. They'll just start selling them under a new name and let the dealer hold the bag for any liability. Aimpoint and Surefire face huge legal liability if something goes wrong. It won't just be some small dealer shrugging and saying "Well I couldn't afford products liability insurance so I'll file bankruptcy now, good luck suing the Red Army" Their companies are hanging out in the wind if something goes wrong and they have a name to protect. edit also there is no need for name calling, I "warned" you for name calling, however if you use that kind of language towards someone other than me you will be removed from the site. |
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Quoted: He does seem to have a serious chubby for you doesnt he. You shouldn't be buying chinese lights for self defense use. I do not understand the purpose of them other than someone cutting corners where their life is at risk. I can buy that people are buying the fakepoints to play with at the range, but what purpose does a fake surefire serve if not for self defense use? I guess maybe for hunting? The primary arms light costs $ 99. A surefire g2led with mount costs $ 89 and that's paying full retail, you can probably get it cheaper if you call around. http://www.vikingtactics.com/prod_vtac_lightmount.html# |
| Aimless, you do come off as having quite the grudge against Primary Arms. Even it it's just a grudge against the Chinese and their quality control (or frequent lack thereof), your remarks are giving off very bad vibes. I definately am getting the impression that you're deliberately undermining PA's sales. |
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Quoted: Aimless, you do come off as having quite the grudge against Primary Arms. Even it it's just a grudge against the Chinese and their quality control (or frequent lack thereof), your remarks are giving off very bad vibes. I definately am getting the impression that you're deliberately undermining PA's sales. You are mistaken. I have concerns of the sales of chinese optics and lights, it has nothing to do with any particular vendor, he seems like a pleasant guy who ships on time and takes care of any problems. I've had no complaints about Primary Arms shipping and so on. Primary Arms has pages of items besides the chinese optics and lights which are made to look like items made by other brands. You'll find no posts by me critical of their sales of Grip pods or whatever else they sell, nor do I have any problem with the sale of chinese optics for fun guns. I think the dealer has admitted that those optics are not intended for use on self defense carbines. Go back and do a search of my posts about Mueller Optics from years ago. They used to be on the board touting a chinese scope they were designing as a self defense optic (or japanese optics assembled in China might have been the claim). I stated I was skeptical of the use of that optic for self defense purposes. I purchased a cheap chinese scope that had the exact same body as the Mueller optic scope and posted photos of it. I received similar criticism from people who had been posting about the design of the scope and stating that they were looking forward to it etc. I purchased one of the scopes at my expense and it broke before I was even able to sight it in. I have years of experience with chinese optics that ended up in the trash. I've thrown out multiple Bushnells, Tascos, a BSA and even a Springfield Armory Hakko that was probably Japanese. I see the same thing again and again and there are always people that get upset when I mention this because they have one of the optics I am talking about and get their feelings hurt. At least with the optics PA is stating that those are not for use on defensive carbines. If someone wants to put this scope on their 10/22, or their .22lr AR, or their 9mm play carbine etc etc it's probably an okay choice. Lights, however, are not something I see as being purchased for use on fun guns, although I suppose this might be a good option for something like coyote hunting since it has a pretty powerful rating and doesn't cost much. |
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Aimless, you do come off as having quite the grudge against Primary Arms. Even it it's just a grudge against the Chinese and their quality control (or frequent lack thereof), your remarks are giving off very bad vibes. I definately am getting the impression that you're deliberately undermining PA's sales. You are mistaken. I have concerns of the sales of chinese optics and lights, it has nothing to do with any particular vendor. Thanks for the clarification. |
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You quoted me before I finished writing my book Somewhat unrelated http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=3&f=20&t=478795 Interesting write up on some of the chinese stuff that is out there. Hi-Vel mentioned some other chinese lights that are interesting. However I am conservative when it comes to AR accessories, particularly when it comes to items from China for reasons I already stated. If someone wants to take an educated gamble on these, then have at it, but too often someone new asks "What about such and such" chinese optic (or light now) and a chorus of Huzzahs! go out, but have any of those people done more than fiddle around with the light or maybe shoot a thousand rounds? http://www.ar15.com/archive/topic.html?b=3&f=18&t=238448&page=13 hence my reluctance to write a check every time someone tells me that a new optic is super and that I must test it  I did get my money back |
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The constant shitting on PA lights does get old.
Topic: OP, I have two. One on my AR and another for carry. I also own a Surefire M961, I sold it on eBay after owning the PA for a few months. You can be the only judge of whether its worth the money or not. No brainer for me and I am very pleased with the lights. |
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You quoted me before I finished writing my book
Somewhat unrelated http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=3&f=20&t=478795 Interesting write up on some of the chinese stuff that is out there. Hi-Vel mentioned some other chinese lights that are interesting. However I am conservative when it comes to AR accessories, particularly when it comes to items from China for reasons I already stated. If someone wants to take an educated gamble on these, then have at it, but too often someone new asks "What about such and such" chinese optic (or light now) and a chorus of Huzzahs! go out, but have any of those people done more than fiddle around with the light or maybe shoot a thousand rounds? http://www.ar15.com/archive/topic.html?b=3&f=18&t=238448&page=13 hence my reluctance to write a check every time someone tells me that a new optic is super and that I must test it I did get my money back
Well, I purchased a Micro Dot from Primary Arms. I understand that it isn't an Aimpoint, but after watching this I felt that it was reliable enough for my couch commando  requirements and my limited budget. I actually dropped it on accident once and it is still holding together pretty well.
I recognize that it has limitations. |
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Optics usually cost big money, and I like to stay with the American stuff. I probably would not buy a Chinese made scope again. I did it once, and it was and still remains a good scope. It's a Tasco Euro Class something or another. I shot little groups with it on my first deer rifle decades ago, but the glass was way below Leupolds quality. It was all I could afford at the time though. I got a Leupold later. I have a soft spot for that Tasco scope, as it was my first one. I fired several thousand rounds of handloaded .270 Winchester through that rifle, and the scope never did anything stupid. It sits well pampered in the gun safe now. I'll never sell it.
When dealing with anything from China I think it's wise for one to do his due diligence. Network. Talk to people. Read reviews. View beamshots if it's a flashlight. See what they've bought and how it worked out. Marshall/Primary Arms, I haven't seen your lights tested at CPF. There are a few guys there that are good at it, and would be happy, to do a review on your light to post in the Reviews section there. There are others, but MrGman has access to an integrating sphere, and has a thread going with results from all lights he has been able to get his hands on. It wouldn't have to buy a freebie deal where you gave away a light. Members there send lights in to get evaluated and he returns them. Who has enough money to buy one of every light? I know I don't! Here is the thread: http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=229135 Check it out. Many lights are on it. Cheers. |
| still torn between the jet beam m1x and the primary arms. jet beam is 700 lumens and has a head of 2 1/4 ". im just a tad worried that it will look too big and out of place. how big is the head on the primary arms. i see its around 7 1/2 long. anyone know the head dia? |
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Aimless, you do come off as having quite the grudge against Primary Arms. Even it it's just a grudge against the Chinese and their quality control (or frequent lack thereof), your remarks are giving off very bad vibes. I definately am getting the impression that you're deliberately undermining PA's sales. I tend to agree. This is especially true when you consider the lengths PA goes to to distinguish their categories of products. They carry high end to budget, and they try to make it apparent which is to be used for what. |
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still torn between the jet beam m1x and the primary arms. jet beam is 700 lumens and has a head of 2 1/4 ". im just a tad worried that it will look too big and out of place. how big is the head on the primary arms. i see its around 7 1/2 long. anyone know the head dia? The bezel is 1.62". It is a reasonable compromise for a long throw light in that you have enough spill to work close. Here is one mounted. I will address some of the other points being discussed in this thread. I am often asked if we are going to carry our own brand of hand helds. I always say no because a Surefire G2/3 or 6/9P is so reasonable priced there is no need to. They also make a good weapon mouted light for most close self defense work. This light is obviously modeled after one of the high end Surefire weapon lights. It is a older design so we are not violating any current patents. The LED head is well made and as has been reported performs very very well. The large heat sink allow for continous opreration. Not something that a high output drop-in upgrade will allow in most handheld lights. For these reasons It has gained a good following as a hunting light. It comes with mount, a click switch and tape switch. These all add up to a lot of light for the money. I know that many (maybe most) ARs are outfitted for fun or, sport. This light fills that role very very well and comes with PA support. Also I would hope that somone that is considering one of the Surefire counterfeits sold on anti-gun Ebay because they want the look without paying the price would view this as a better option, for a lot of reasons. Those products are generally crap and many wind up being sold as the real deal. For use in most civilian self defense situations I would suggest one or two upgrades. Add a Surefire tail cap and diffuser. The diffuser will allow it to cover more ground at close range and quickly convert back to long range performance. 
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| Marshall, is there an offset mount that this will work with? LaRue LT606? If so, what ring size? Daniel Defense off your website? If so, will it mount to the rail on top of the gas block? I like the long throw on this light compared to the Surefire G2, but I need and offset mount. Thanks for your help. |
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Marshall, is there an offset mount that this will work with? LaRue LT606? If so, what ring size? Daniel Defense off your website? If so, will it mount to the rail on top of the gas block? I like the long throw on this light compared to the Surefire G2, but I need and offset mount. Thanks for your help. Becasue the base of the mount does not come off you can not use a ring mount. We stock the GG&G offset rail that works great with it. Unfortunatly It is a bit pricey. LINK |
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Aimless is a certified jackass. Funny that the keyboard he is typing on to the computer he is using to abouyt 90% of the products he uses everyday are from China. I'd much rather have a Japanese or Chinese piece of electronics than some overpriced unit that gets by on name recognition. Michael Aimless is a good guy man, and I agree with 99.9% of his posts. 
This is one of the many posts I agree with Aimless on. Dont buy china made crap for self defense weapons its too risky. |
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