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Posted: 2/13/2016 10:45:15 AM EDT
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I recently built my first AR. I'm considering a couple different "red-dot" optics systems. I'm leaning heavily toward the EOTech EXPS3-4 or EXPS2-2 with the G33 magnifier.
I'm having trouble determining the difference between the EXPS2-2 and 3-4. They are nearly identical prices on the web. I see the 3-4 is night vision compatible. Is that the only difference? I want to make sure I make the right buying decision (especially given the fact there is little or no price difference between the two) |
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Eotech seals fail within 30 days, the nitrogen purge escapes and the hologram is deteriorated by moisture.
Eotech has admitted this in court, they knew this 10 years ago, and they have done nothing to fix the issue, have made no design changes, and continue to sell the sights even though they know they are defective and their advertising is false, even as they spend millions of dollars giving refunds per court order. I had a 552 that would turn off while firing because of the shitty design of the battery compartment. They have known about this issue for over a decade, will send you a new not redesigned battery compartment that will do the same thing and they still sell these sights knowing the sight will turn off while firing when the spring wear out. I had an XPS2, that made 3 trips to the range on bright sunny days and spent the rest of it's 2 years in my dehumidified safe. After 2 years, the reticle was 50% brightness left and right of center due to moisture intrusion. At low light settings the reticle is not visible left and right of center at all. I sent both back for a refund. Eotech has changed nothing and still make defect sights. The company is corrupt, and their sights are defective, and they still sell the same defective designs. Spend your money on a sight that is not defective shit. |
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Quoted: Eotech seals fail within 30 days, the nitrogen purge escapes and the hologram is deteriorated by moisture. Eotech has admitted this in court, they knew this 10 years ago, and they have done nothing to fix the issue, have made no design changes, and continue to sell the sights even though they know they are defective and their advertising is false, even as they spend millions of dollars giving refunds per court order. I had a 552 that would turn off while firing because of the shitty design of the battery compartment. They have known about this issue for over a decade, will send you a new not redesigned battery compartment that will do the same thing and they still sell these sights knowing the sight will turn off while firing when the spring wear out. I had an XPS2, that made 3 trips to the range on bright sunny days and spent the rest of it's 2 years in my dehumidified safe. After 2 years, the reticle was 50% brightness left and right of center due to moisture intrusion. At low light settings the reticle is not visible left and right of center at all. I sent both back for a refund. Eotech has changed nothing and still make defect sights. The company is corrupt, and their sights are defective, and they still sell the same defective designs. Spend your money on a sight that is not defective shit. What surprises me the most, is that there is no drop in price to reflect the reliability issues that do not occur on lesser-priced alternatives. |
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Quoted:
What surprises me the most, is that there is no drop in price to reflect the reliability issues that do not occur on lesser-priced alternatives. Quoted:
Quoted:
Eotech seals fail within 30 days, the nitrogen purge escapes and the hologram is deteriorated by moisture. Eotech has admitted this in court, they knew this 10 years ago, and they have done nothing to fix the issue, have made no design changes, and continue to sell the sights even though they know they are defective and their advertising is false, even as they spend millions of dollars giving refunds per court order. I had a 552 that would turn off while firing because of the shitty design of the battery compartment. They have known about this issue for over a decade, will send you a new not redesigned battery compartment that will do the same thing and they still sell these sights knowing the sight will turn off while firing when the spring wear out. I had an XPS2, that made 3 trips to the range on bright sunny days and spent the rest of it's 2 years in my dehumidified safe. After 2 years, the reticle was 50% brightness left and right of center due to moisture intrusion. At low light settings the reticle is not visible left and right of center at all. I sent both back for a refund. Eotech has changed nothing and still make defect sights. The company is corrupt, and their sights are defective, and they still sell the same defective designs. Spend your money on a sight that is not defective shit. What surprises me the most, is that there is no drop in price to reflect the reliability issues that do not occur on lesser-priced alternatives. People are still buying them because they do not know. |
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Quoted:
People are still buying them because they do not know. Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Eotech seals fail within 30 days, the nitrogen purge escapes and the hologram is deteriorated by moisture. Eotech has admitted this in court, they knew this 10 years ago, and they have done nothing to fix the issue, have made no design changes, and continue to sell the sights even though they know they are defective and their advertising is false, even as they spend millions of dollars giving refunds per court order. I had a 552 that would turn off while firing because of the shitty design of the battery compartment. They have known about this issue for over a decade, will send you a new not redesigned battery compartment that will do the same thing and they still sell these sights knowing the sight will turn off while firing when the spring wear out. I had an XPS2, that made 3 trips to the range on bright sunny days and spent the rest of it's 2 years in my dehumidified safe. After 2 years, the reticle was 50% brightness left and right of center due to moisture intrusion. At low light settings the reticle is not visible left and right of center at all. I sent both back for a refund. Eotech has changed nothing and still make defect sights. The company is corrupt, and their sights are defective, and they still sell the same defective designs. Spend your money on a sight that is not defective shit. What surprises me the most, is that there is no drop in price to reflect the reliability issues that do not occur on lesser-priced alternatives. People are still buying them because they do not know. This. I still see guys trying to sell them for $350-400 used on gun trader sights, apparently unaware they can recover full msrp sending them back. Also had a guy running a booth at a gun show (with a table full of EOs) a month or so ago tell me eotech WAS NOT issuing full refunds and that the defects were only on a certain serial range....despite me telling him I'd already received refund approval, I apparently was going to be disappointed. I'm not very disappointed with the check I got last week. |
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Quoted: People are still buying them because they do not know. Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Eotech seals fail within 30 days, the nitrogen purge escapes and the hologram is deteriorated by moisture. Eotech has admitted this in court, they knew this 10 years ago, and they have done nothing to fix the issue, have made no design changes, and continue to sell the sights even though they know they are defective and their advertising is false, even as they spend millions of dollars giving refunds per court order. I had a 552 that would turn off while firing because of the shitty design of the battery compartment. They have known about this issue for over a decade, will send you a new not redesigned battery compartment that will do the same thing and they still sell these sights knowing the sight will turn off while firing when the spring wear out. I had an XPS2, that made 3 trips to the range on bright sunny days and spent the rest of it's 2 years in my dehumidified safe. After 2 years, the reticle was 50% brightness left and right of center due to moisture intrusion. At low light settings the reticle is not visible left and right of center at all. I sent both back for a refund. Eotech has changed nothing and still make defect sights. The company is corrupt, and their sights are defective, and they still sell the same defective designs. Spend your money on a sight that is not defective shit. What surprises me the most, is that there is no drop in price to reflect the reliability issues that do not occur on lesser-priced alternatives. People are still buying them because they do not know. |
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Quoted:
Eotech seals fail within 30 days, the nitrogen purge escapes and the hologram is deteriorated by moisture. Eotech has admitted this in court, they knew this 10 years ago, and they have done nothing to fix the issue, have made no design changes, and continue to sell the sights even though they know they are defective and their advertising is false, even as they spend millions of dollars giving refunds per court order. I had a 552 that would turn off while firing because of the shitty design of the battery compartment. They have known about this issue for over a decade, will send you a new not redesigned battery compartment that will do the same thing and they still sell these sights knowing the sight will turn off while firing when the spring wear out. I had an XPS2, that made 3 trips to the range on bright sunny days and spent the rest of it's 2 years in my dehumidified safe. After 2 years, the reticle was 50% brightness left and right of center due to moisture intrusion. At low light settings the reticle is not visible left and right of center at all. I sent both back for a refund. Eotech has changed nothing and still make defect sights. The company is corrupt, and their sights are defective, and they still sell the same defective designs. Spend your money on a sight that is not defective shit. I dont DISAGREE but i have a 2006 date 552 that gets a lot of use that is still working as it should. that being,,,, I NEVER let it freeze and i NEVER let it boil either. how its used makes a big difference. for paper punching fun it will work just fine. that said a TA31 is my no fail tolerated optic |
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I had an xps 2-2 and mounted it on a 300 blackout . I then bought a magnifier . then the sight delaminated 6 months after purchase and I had to send it back . so now Im waiting on a refund check .
what I learned was for the most part at the useful range of the cartridge I was using I actually could shoot better with out the magnifier , the 2 dot reticle is a gimmick , Im a hunter not a door kicker and I found the 2moa dot on my aimpoint pro to be easier to pick up and get on target fast . before I buy another half baked concotion of red dot and magnifier I will buy a 1x4 or 1x6 scope . I have a 1911 and a german shepard for cqb both do their job just fine for my defensive needs no red dot needed . |
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Quoted:
I dont DISAGREE but i have a 2006 date 552 that gets a lot of use that is still working as it should. that being,,,, I NEVER let it freeze and i NEVER let it boil either. how its used makes a big difference. for paper punching fun it will work just fine. that said a TA31 is my no fail tolerated optic Quoted:
Quoted:
Eotech seals fail within 30 days, the nitrogen purge escapes and the hologram is deteriorated by moisture. Eotech has admitted this in court, they knew this 10 years ago, and they have done nothing to fix the issue, have made no design changes, and continue to sell the sights even though they know they are defective and their advertising is false, even as they spend millions of dollars giving refunds per court order. I had a 552 that would turn off while firing because of the shitty design of the battery compartment. They have known about this issue for over a decade, will send you a new not redesigned battery compartment that will do the same thing and they still sell these sights knowing the sight will turn off while firing when the spring wear out. I had an XPS2, that made 3 trips to the range on bright sunny days and spent the rest of it's 2 years in my dehumidified safe. After 2 years, the reticle was 50% brightness left and right of center due to moisture intrusion. At low light settings the reticle is not visible left and right of center at all. I sent both back for a refund. Eotech has changed nothing and still make defect sights. The company is corrupt, and their sights are defective, and they still sell the same defective designs. Spend your money on a sight that is not defective shit. I dont DISAGREE but i have a 2006 date 552 that gets a lot of use that is still working as it should. that being,,,, I NEVER let it freeze and i NEVER let it boil either. how its used makes a big difference. for paper punching fun it will work just fine. that said a TA31 is my no fail tolerated optic If you shoot it enough, the 552 WILL turn off on you while shooting because the battery compartment is defectively designed. It can not handle the recoil. They will send you a new battery compartment, if they still make them, and after a while, the new one will do the same thing because they refuse to redesign the battery compartment. Just like they knew about the moisture intrusion and the seals failing and refuse to redesign them. They just keep selling their garbage to everyone including military and cops, who need their stuff to work every time, and it will not. As far as I am concerned, EoTech and L3 in general is corrupt, selling known defective equipment. They can fuck off and die as far as I am concerned. I will never give them another dime, even if they redesign their stuff, simply because they have known about these problems for a decade and did nothing about them, even now, they are still selling them. If I send $500 on a sight, I do not expect to buy a sight that has known defects that have been known for years and the company has done nothing to fix them. |
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That they're issuing refunds for these sights and still selling them at the same time is rather curious. Folks are getting retail amount refunds, L3 sells them to dealers and distributors at wholesale prices. Maybe they figure they still make money refunding those that return them, while selling new, defective, and unchanged sights to unknowing customers who don't.
How do they explain that given the disclosed issues these sights have, they're still being sold? I returned one already, and am in the process of returning the other three. |
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Quoted:
That they're issuing refunds for these sights and still selling them at the same time is rather curious. Folks are getting retail amount refunds, L3 sells them to dealers and distributors at wholesale prices. Maybe they figure they still make money refunding those that return them, while selling new, defective, and unchanged sights to unknowing customers who don't. How do they explain that given the disclosed issues these sights have, they're still being sold? I returned one already, and am in the process of returning the other three. Interesting isn't it. Continuing to sell known defective products. |
| I guess they're technically no longer selling defective products because they changed the claims on their product's web page, other than the nitrogen out/moisture in issue, which they seem to continue to claim is fixed. The whole thing is very odd to me, I don't understand why anyone would pay the same price for a product that no longer does what it claimed when that price was established. I'm just glad I got my money back and I no longer have a dog in this fight. |
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Dude really? 
OP please don't listen to these people. Do some research on your own. A LOT of what is going around is PURE BS. Quoted:
Eotech seals fail within 30 days, the nitrogen purge escapes and the hologram is deteriorated by moisture. Dude really?
OP please don't listen to these people. Do some research on your own. A LOT of what is going around is PURE BS. alot of this stuff is the truth . really 500.00 for an optic and I had to send it back in 6 months becaue the glass had de-laminated . I am at fault because I had read the issue's before I bought mine but you know what they say about assuming . well I was the dumb ass once but wont be that guy again with this product . All I know from my personal experience is this is all not B.S. |
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Quoted:
Dude really?
OP please don't listen to these people. Do some research on your own. A LOT of what is going around is PURE BS. Quoted:
Eotech seals fail within 30 days, the nitrogen purge escapes and the hologram is deteriorated by moisture. Dude really?
OP please don't listen to these people. Do some research on your own. A LOT of what is going around is PURE BS. You obviously did not read the lawsuit. I made it hot in case othet people have not read it. Link |
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Quoted:
alot of this stuff is the truth . really 500.00 for an optic and I had to send it back in 6 months becaue the glass had de-laminated . I am at fault because I had read the issue's before I bought mine but you know what they say about assuming . well I was the dumb ass once but wont be that guy again with this product . All I know from my personal experience is this is all not B.S. Quoted:
Quoted:
Eotech seals fail within 30 days, the nitrogen purge escapes and the hologram is deteriorated by moisture. Dude really?
OP please don't listen to these people. Do some research on your own. A LOT of what is going around is PURE BS. alot of this stuff is the truth . really 500.00 for an optic and I had to send it back in 6 months becaue the glass had de-laminated . I am at fault because I had read the issue's before I bought mine but you know what they say about assuming . well I was the dumb ass once but wont be that guy again with this product . All I know from my personal experience is this is all not B.S. My XPS2 made 3 trips to the range on sunny days and spent the rest of the 2 years in my humidity controlled safe and suffered from moisture degradation. |
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Quoted:
Dude really?
OP please don't listen to these people. Do some research on your own. A LOT of what is going around is PURE BS. Quoted:
Eotech seals fail within 30 days, the nitrogen purge escapes and the hologram is deteriorated by moisture. Dude really?
OP please don't listen to these people. Do some research on your own. A LOT of what is going around is PURE BS. page 27 paragraph 108 of the lawsuit restating L3s own findings: 108. An EOTech test engineer subsequently prepared a single-page summary of the results, reporting that two “Significant Findings” of the testing were that “[n]itrogen & moisture content reach[] near ambient levels within a 1 month period” and that the use of a “[d]essicant [sic] provides a significant improvement to moisture content but only for a short period of time (< 1 month).” According to a former EOTech optics engineer, all of the senior managers were aware of the results, including Mangano. so yeah, really. Total loss of nitrogen purge and intrusion of moisture in 1 month. ie 30 days. |
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I dont DISAGREE but i have a 2006 date 552 that gets a lot of use that is still working as it should. that being,,,, I NEVER let it freeze and i NEVER let it boil either. how its used makes a big difference. for paper punching fun it will work just fine. that said a TA31 is my no fail tolerated optic +1 for this argument. I have yet to see a failure in my 552. |
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