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Posted: 8/16/2010 10:32:59 AM EDT
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I'd like to draw on the expertise of this forums members. I appologize if this has been covered, just redirect me.
It seems to me that a better optic w/ a FastFire II might be a Leupold 2.5-8x36 Mark 4 MR/T as oposed to the Burris XTR-14. I don't say this as a knock on the Burris (I own a few and like them all), it just seems to me that you can really extend the range of the rifle by going w/ a higher magnification scope and not give up anything at shorter distances because you would still have the FastFire II. Am I missing something in this comparison? Thanks for any input. FYI - I'm considering this combo on a 16" 6.5 Grendel Another FYI - the scopes are identical in length and weight |
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Just read this section for awhile and you'll pick up lots of info.
If it were me, I'd focus primarily on the attributes of your main optic and do a cost/benefit analysis and see where you are. The FF is really just a distraction from the key analysis. Opting for a main optic based on the use of a FFII back-up is like trying to decide what car to buy based on the floor mats you've picked out. The FF is an emergency CQB optic and a decent one. I have one on an FN 57 pistol, a Benelli M4 shotgun (at least until I replace the crappy rail) and have a LaRue piggyback mount for an ACOG that I can't decide if I want to use. That said, I'd never give a minutes thought to the FF when deciding on the main optic especially among the choices you appear to be weighing at this point. I have seen the XTR with the FF mounted on it though and I think it silly to put it on a 1-4x scope. Just me though. I'd say it makes more sense with something like the NightForce 2.5-10x scopes or the Loopy you cite where the min. magnification makes it hard to use up close. That round reaches out a decent distance too and over 4X magnification would be handy. |
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BigHat,
Thank you for your response, I appreciate it. I think I understand the sentiment of your post. I think like a lot of people, I'm looking for that right combo to cover a lot of bases. It may not exist to perfection at least not at the price point that I've allowed. Thank you again |
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I think like a lot of people, I'm looking for that right combo to cover a lot of bases. It may not exist to perfection at least not at the price point that I've allowed. Thank you again You didn't say what your purposes were. With a FF & one of those scopes, you're looking at $800 minimum in optics, mounts not included. That's not a bad budget at all, but it depends on what you want to accomplish with it. |
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I think like a lot of people, I'm looking for that right combo to cover a lot of bases. It may not exist to perfection at least not at the price point that I've allowed. Thank you again You didn't say what your purposes were. With a FF & one of those scopes, you're looking at $800 minimum in optics, mounts not included. That's not a bad budget at all, but it depends on what you want to accomplish with it. Hey Flats, thanks for chiming in. I guess what I'm wanting to accomplish w/ it is to cover all of the bases from zero to 600+ yards, w/ a good amount of precision that I don't think a magnified red dot can deliver. I will hunt mule deer and probably pig w/ it as well. It will also be a toy for the range. Not too likely, but would be a SHTF gun if necessary. |
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I think like a lot of people, I'm looking for that right combo to cover a lot of bases. It may not exist to perfection at least not at the price point that I've allowed. Thank you again You didn't say what your purposes were. With a FF & one of those scopes, you're looking at $800 minimum in optics, mounts not included. That's not a bad budget at all, but it depends on what you want to accomplish with it. Hey Flats, thanks for chiming in. I guess what I'm wanting to accomplish w/ it is to cover all of the bases from zero to 600+ yards, w/ a good amount of precision that I don't think a magnified red dot can deliver. I will hunt mule deer and probably pig w/ it as well. It will also be a toy for the range. Not too likely, but would be a SHTF gun if necessary. I'm in the process of sorting out optics for a home defense/hunting rig, and I've read more on scopes in the last month than is probably healthy. CQB I know, but scopes, not so much. I'm only interested in 300 yds & in, so you'll probably want more upper end magnification than what I've been considering (3x9). Here's what I found: 1. There is no precision one-size-fits-all that will cover 0-300, let alone 600. Even a $1000 ACOG is a compromise for close quarters. A red dot (or EOTech) rules inside a structure. 2. You can always piggyback stuff. Aimpoint micro + hunting scope. I don't really want stuff hanging off of every rail, and for HD you'll want a flashlight as well. I ruled this out. 3. If you ignore the CQB, lit retical tactical stuff, you can get some really good hunting scopes for $300-$400. (In the 3x9 range, anyway) For 600 yards, you want a scope with 12 to 20(?)on the top end, and that just doesn't work for SHTF. But, add a good QD mount for $200, then you've got backup irons or another optic that goes on when you're not hunting or target shooting. Spend some time on the Optics Talk forums; they're very helpful. GIven your priorities, I'd get rigged for hunting/target first, spend money on good glass, and put in on a Larue or Bobro mount. Then sort out the close-in solution as time and/or money permits. |
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I think like a lot of people, I'm looking for that right combo to cover a lot of bases. It may not exist to perfection at least not at the price point that I've allowed. Thank you again You didn't say what your purposes were. With a FF & one of those scopes, you're looking at $800 minimum in optics, mounts not included. That's not a bad budget at all, but it depends on what you want to accomplish with it. Hey Flats, thanks for chiming in. I guess what I'm wanting to accomplish w/ it is to cover all of the bases from zero to 600+ yards, w/ a good amount of precision that I don't think a magnified red dot can deliver. I will hunt mule deer and probably pig w/ it as well. It will also be a toy for the range. Not too likely, but would be a SHTF gun if necessary. I'm in the process of sorting out optics for a home defense/hunting rig, and I've read more on scopes in the last month than is probably healthy. CQB I know, but scopes, not so much. I'm only interested in 300 yds & in, so you'll probably want more upper end magnification than what I've been considering (3x9). Here's what I found: 1. There is no precision one-size-fits-all that will cover 0-300, let alone 600. Even a $1000 ACOG is a compromise for close quarters. A red dot (or EOTech) rules inside a structure. 2. You can always piggyback stuff. Aimpoint micro + hunting scope. I don't really want stuff hanging off of every rail, and for HD you'll want a flashlight as well. I ruled this out. 3. If you ignore the CQB, lit retical tactical stuff, you can get some really good hunting scopes for $300-$400. (In the 3x9 range, anyway) For 600 yards, you want a scope with 12 to 20(?)on the top end, and that just doesn't work for SHTF. But, add a good QD mount for $200, then you've got backup irons or another optic that goes on when you're not hunting or target shooting. Spend some time on the Optics Talk forums; they're very helpful. GIven your priorities, I'd get rigged for hunting/target first, spend money on good glass, and put in on a Larue or Bobro mount. Then sort out the close-in solution as time and/or money permits. I used to listen to different optics forums and I found they always recommend more magnification than one really needed. Clovis, let me ask you two questions: Using a 1X optic like a red dot...what range do you feel comfortable with it? What range do you REALLY think you are going to shoot the gun out to? Most hunters do not recommend taking shots at game over 250 yards away...is the 600 yard limit for show or target practice? I don't have the best eyes, so using an EOTech at 100 yards I can hold about a 4" group, at 50 yards it's closer to <2". If that is the same for you, and you are legitimately shooting out to 600 yards, think of it this way: 600 yards divided by 12X magnification = 50 yards. In other words, when using 12X magnification, the target at 600 yards would look the same as a 1X at 50 yards. Frankly, you aren't going to be able to hold a 2" grouping at 600 yards...you would be lucky to hold an 8" target at that distance...I don't know about you but an 8" target at 50 yards is pretty easy to see. I have never advocated shooting at animals over 300 yards away. I enjoy taking shots at targets at 500 yards, but without match ammunition, good weather conditions, and a fair amount of training on your part, you aren't likely to take shots at targets that far away and expect to actually NEED the extra magnification to make a hit. Now if you are blind and only use the 1X for 25 yards and closer and you need magnification to go out to 600 yards then a 24X scope is what you are looking for, but quite frankly if that is the case go see on optometrist and practice more with your rifle. |
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