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Posted: 8/13/2012 9:47:19 PM EDT
[#1]
Ok, here we go. All the mags lined up.
Loaded with IMI M855. 
Start of the magazine drop test. (Forgive me if I can't keep track of how many times and how I dropped the mags before.) The Troy mag. 
12 rounds fell out. 
The TangoDown mag.
5 rounds fell out. 
The Pmag.
28 rounds fell out. 
Pmag still cracked. 
The Lancer mag.
1 round fell out. 
The Tapco mag.
25 rounds lost. 
Tapco mag still cracked. 
Tan GI mag.
2 rounds fell out. 
Tan GI jacked up lips. 
Green GI mag.
2 rounds fell out. 
Mag is in bad shape. 
Green GI floor plate buldged out. 
Green GI feed lips, didn't work before, outlook not good now... 
The mags after the 3 times drop on front, spine, feed lips, and base. 
Maybe this will help for the test fire tomorrow... 
I am not soaking the mags tonight, I will test fire after work tomorrow while the sun is still up. |
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Posted: 8/13/2012 9:54:22 PM EDT
[#2]
You win 10,000 internets..for..
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Posted: 8/13/2012 10:10:06 PM EDT
[#3]
Originally Posted By InfiniteGrim:
Can you take a napkin or something to a part of the AWM feelips and see if the rust comes off easily? If so clean a small part off and put some CLP on it and just see if it starts to rust quickly. The rust is pretty mild surface rust. 
CLP removes a little, but its still there. 
Hoppes 9 removes a little but its still there. 
If you don't want rusted Lancer mags, don't clean them in a dishwasher. 
Originally Posted By Berserkr556:
Outstanding thread ! Looking forward to drop test videos and whatever else you come up with. I'd like to see you put the mags in a chest rig and then hit the deck hard as if reacting to fire. Thanks. Ha, not my kind of "drop test". It would be a video of me rolling around trying to catch my breath. I do have a plan that involves a LBV if they make it that far. 
Originally Posted By InfiniteGrim:
You win 10,000 internets..for.. http://i245.photobucket.com/albums/gg76/gi57/MagTest/P8132319.jpg 
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Posted: 8/13/2012 10:43:22 PM EDT
[#4]
Might i suggest for the final test you shoot some holes in the mags with an AK like in the test Troy does with their Battlemag or use your AR if you don't own an AK.
Then see how many rounds you can load in each mag and function test. |
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MI, USA
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Posted: 8/13/2012 11:11:25 PM EDT
[#5]
I laughed a little bit at the beginning of the Pmag video. T'was like a man trying to hold his drink...who could hold it no longer as he spits up on the sidewalk...
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Posted: 8/14/2012 12:26:10 AM EDT
[#6]
Originally Posted By oogabooga289:
I laughed a little bit at the beginning of the Pmag video. T'was like a man trying to hold his drink...who could hold it no longer as he spits up on the sidewalk... Same here.
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Posted: 8/14/2012 12:36:46 AM EDT
[Last Edit: InfiniteGrim]
[#7]
So which ones are impressing you the most?
From this side of the camera, the Lancer and Tango Down are impressing me the most. Looks like the only bad thing with the lancer is the rust. I didn't even know teh Tango Down mags existed, and they are impressing me, but the feed lips look like they are getting tore up. Is it the picture or are the lancer feelips somewhat bend inward in the back? |
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Posted: 8/14/2012 1:00:36 AM EDT
[#8]
Very cool write up. Any idea why Lancer didn't use a stainless that wouldn't rust?
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Posted: 8/14/2012 1:00:57 AM EDT
[#9]
Originally Posted By InfiniteGrim: So which ones are impressing you the most? From this side of the camera, the Lancer and Tango Down are impressing me the most. Looks like the only bad thing with the lancer is the rust. I didn't even know teh Tango Down mags existed, and they are impressing me, but the feed lips look like they are getting tore up. Is it the picture or are the lancer feelips somewhat bend inward in the back? DSG Arms has the Tango Downs in black for $8.99 right now. |
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MI, USA
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Posted: 8/14/2012 1:20:22 AM EDT
[#10]
Originally Posted By AMUshooter10:
Same here. Glad I wasn't alone 
Originally Posted By JoshAston:
Originally Posted By InfiniteGrim:
So which ones are impressing you the most? From this side of the camera, the Lancer and Tango Down are impressing me the most. Looks like the only bad thing with the lancer is the rust. I didn't even know teh Tango Down mags existed, and they are impressing me, but the feed lips look like they are getting tore up. Is it the picture or are the lancer feelips somewhat bend inward in the back? DSG Arms has the Tango Downs in black for $8.99 right now. I think that a lot of companies are trying to offload the Gen 1's (or whatever they are called) of the Arc mags cheap since the MK2's are hitting the shelves. WI57 is testing an MK2 so results may vary. But I might be wrong, too, since I don't know much about them. I didn't even know they can't be disassembled. Which sucks. |
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TX, USA
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Posted: 8/14/2012 1:44:21 AM EDT
[#11]
Thank you for this excellent post!
I'm disappointed in the PMag. I'm a big fan, but it really didn't hold up in comparison to the other plastic ones. Thank you for doing the repeat drop test, to make sure it wasn't a simple case of it hitting just so on the drop test. I'll likely keep using them, but hmpfh. The GI mags demonstrate one of the reasons why I have switched to plastic mags. When GI takes a hit, it bends, but stops being as reliable. When plastic takes a hit, if it's damaged by it, it's visually very obvious (crack). And still keeps working anyway. |
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NE, USA
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Posted: 8/14/2012 2:08:03 AM EDT
[#12]
Originally Posted By TigerHawk:
Very cool write up. Any idea why Lancer didn't use a stainless that wouldn't rust? Stainless is a little softer, as well as a little more expensive. I'm also going to guess one of the solvents compromised the finish before they were subjected to water though. Again, that's just a guess though. AWM's and PMAG's are all I use. AWM's have a tendency to win these torture tests, but I'm still going to watch and see if they do as well in this one. Maybe I missed something in the videos, but from my perspective it looks like they're in the lead. |
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Posted: 8/14/2012 2:17:13 AM EDT
[#13]
Originally Posted By oogabooga289: I didn't even know there was a Gen 2 versionI think that a lot of companies are trying to offload the Gen 1's (or whatever they are called) of the Arc mags cheap since the MK2's are hitting the shelves. WI57 is testing an MK2 so results may vary. But I might be wrong, too, since I don't know much about them. I didn't even know they can't be disassembled. Which sucks. |
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MI, USA
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Posted: 8/14/2012 3:15:55 AM EDT
[#14]
Originally Posted By JoshAston:
Originally Posted By oogabooga289:
I didn't even know there was a Gen 2 version
I think that a lot of companies are trying to offload the Gen 1's (or whatever they are called) of the Arc mags cheap since the MK2's are hitting the shelves. WI57 is testing an MK2 so results may vary. But I might be wrong, too, since I don't know much about them. I didn't even know they can't be disassembled. Which sucks. Me neither till I saw this thread a few days ago: http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_3_17/578855_Tangodown_ARC___.html |
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Posted: 8/14/2012 6:08:13 AM EDT
[#15]
Nice work! Thank you for this!
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Posted: 8/14/2012 7:44:30 AM EDT
[#16]
This is a great thread. I subscribed a while ago and have been enjoying each test.
It's interesting to me how poorly the magpul pmag is holding up. The Lancer however is very impressive. Thanks for doing this.
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Posted: 8/14/2012 9:12:32 AM EDT
[#17]
I'm kind of disappointed in the Pmag's performance. I expected the Lancer AWM to do well and it has. The Troy BattleMag has impressed me, it hasn't split anywhere. I don't like the TangoDown mag because it doesn't come apart but it has impressed me with how it's held up. Once again excellent thread and thanks for taking the time and effort to bring us this thread.
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Posted: 8/14/2012 10:40:07 AM EDT
[#18]
Thanks for sharing
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PA, USA
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Posted: 8/14/2012 11:27:26 AM EDT
[#19]
The absolute best part of all this? I thought I was anal-retentive, now I know better
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Posted: 8/14/2012 11:40:03 AM EDT
[#20]
this thread is 100% bad ass
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Posted: 8/14/2012 1:21:45 PM EDT
[#21]
Originally Posted By InfiniteGrim:
Is it the picture or are the lancer feelips somewhat bend inward in the back? The Lancer lips appear to be slightly bent inward, but nothing compared to the GI mags. Test fire will tell if its too bad. Originally Posted By TigerHawk:
Very cool write up. Any idea why Lancer didn't use a stainless that wouldn't rust? They appeared to be parkerized steel, I don't know if SS would be much stronger. In all reality, its just a little surface rust. Honestly, I doubt they would have rusted if I wouldn't have degreased the crap out of the mags and then steamed them in the dishwasher. I will swing by the range later to test fire them, and post the results this evening. |
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CA, USA
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Posted: 8/14/2012 1:36:36 PM EDT
[Last Edit: ARMRER]
[#22]
I think that a lot of companies are trying to offload the Gen 1's (or whatever they are called) of the Arc mags cheap since the MK2's are hitting the shelves. WI57 is testing an MK2 so results may vary. But I might be wrong, too, since I don't know much about them. I didn't even know they can't be disassembled. Which sucks.[/quote] We designed them that way. There is no reason to take them apart. Cleaning? This test proves the ARC can be cleaned just as thoroughly without disassembly, saving time and potentially the chance of parts getting lost in the field. Spring replacement? The feed lips will wear out long before the spring needs replacement. Eliminating the floorplate gave us a 5 sided box, with great strength and one less combination of parts to fail. |
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Posted: 8/14/2012 1:42:56 PM EDT
[#23]
Am I missing something here. You started the PMAG test with a broken one?
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Posted: 8/14/2012 1:55:34 PM EDT
[#24]
Originally Posted By DrDrake:
Am I missing something here. You started the PMAG test with a broken one? The Pmag didn't crack until I dropped it. The picture after the blank firing doesn't show a crack. |
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USA
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Posted: 8/14/2012 2:57:56 PM EDT
[#25]
Good thread!
Don't fall for the hype... buy cheap and stack deep!!! |
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Posted: 8/14/2012 3:44:37 PM EDT
[#26]
What brand GI mags are those?
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OH, USA
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Posted: 8/14/2012 3:49:06 PM EDT
[#27]
Drdrake what made you think the test of the pmag started with a broken mag? Looked to me like the Pmag started out new out of a brand new sealed package.
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CA, USA
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Posted: 8/14/2012 3:54:14 PM EDT
[#28]
W157-
Nice test(s), btw. |
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Posted: 8/14/2012 5:32:52 PM EDT
[#29]
Okay, I missed the vid where it began to develop a crack.
Out of curiosity, have you considered building a drop test fixture to ensure the drops are consistant? I'm not going to make excuses or turnn this into a testing debate however it is very important to understand no two drops are alike unless duplicated vix a fixture. Even then there are subtle differences. |
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Posted: 8/14/2012 6:30:46 PM EDT
[#30]
Originally Posted By ArmedPete:
This is a great thread. I subscribed a while ago and have been enjoying each test. It's interesting to me how poorly the magpul pmag is holding up. The Lancer however is very impressive. Thanks for doing this. The PMag hasn't rusted and nothing has deformed in response to chemical exposure. So the crack (which is common to other polymer magazines) is the only issue in this that we could have done better in. That said, even with the crack the PMag will still function when inserted into the magazine well of the weapon unlike the damaged USGI. Increase in spine strength without affecting the high all round, proven performance of the PMag was one of the primary goals of the M3 PMag program. As a result the PMag M3 does have a several fold increase in spine strength over the current PMag magazine. |
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Posted: 8/14/2012 7:17:33 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 35mm_Shooter]
[#31]
Originally Posted By Magpul:
Originally Posted By ArmedPete:
This is a great thread. I subscribed a while ago and have been enjoying each test. It's interesting to me how poorly the magpul pmag is holding up. The Lancer however is very impressive. Thanks for doing this. The PMag hasn't rusted and nothing has deformed in response to chemical exposure. So the crack (which is common to other polymer magazines) is the only issue in this that we could have done better in. That said, even with the crack the PMag will still function when inserted into the magazine well of the weapon unlike the damaged USGI. Increase in spine strength without affecting the high all round, proven performance of the PMag was one of the primary goals of the M3 PMag program. As a result the PMag M3 does have a several fold increase in spine strength over the current PMag magazine.  The surface rust has had zero effect on the function of the AWM mag, yet the crack on the PMAG resulted in it spitting out 93% of its rounds during the drop test. And this is not the first test to show the crack problem, I can't count the number of times I've seen this failure mode on PMAGs. I own over 200 PMAGs, I have no vested interest in bashing them. This constant spin just irks me.
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Posted: 8/14/2012 8:14:22 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Magpul]
[#32]
Originally Posted By 35mm_Shooter:
Originally Posted By Magpul:
Originally Posted By ArmedPete:
This is a great thread. I subscribed a while ago and have been enjoying each test. It's interesting to me how poorly the magpul pmag is holding up. The Lancer however is very impressive. Thanks for doing this. The PMag hasn't rusted and nothing has deformed in response to chemical exposure. So the crack (which is common to other polymer magazines) is the only issue in this that we could have done better in. That said, even with the crack the PMag will still function when inserted into the magazine well of the weapon unlike the damaged USGI. Increase in spine strength without affecting the high all round, proven performance of the PMag was one of the primary goals of the M3 PMag program. As a result the PMag M3 does have a several fold increase in spine strength over the current PMag magazine. The surface rust has had zero effect on the function of the AWM mag, yet the crack on the PMAG resulted in it spitting out 93% of its rounds during the drop test. And this is not the first test to show the crack problem, I can't count the number of times I've seen this failure mode on PMAGs. I own over 200 PMAGs, I have no vested interest in bashing them. This constant spin just irks me.35mm_Shooter, this is not the first PMag/Polymer mag thread in which you have expressed your opinions that we are somehow dishonest. |
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Posted: 8/14/2012 8:44:38 PM EDT
[Last Edit: PBOutdoors]
[#33]
Originally Posted By Magpul:
Originally Posted By ArmedPete:
This is a great thread. I subscribed a while ago and have been enjoying each test. It's interesting to me how poorly the magpul pmag is holding up. The Lancer however is very impressive. Thanks for doing this. The PMag hasn't rusted and nothing has deformed in response to chemical exposure. So the crack (which is common to other polymer magazines) is the only issue in this that we could have done better in. That said, even with the crack the PMag will still function when inserted into the magazine well of the weapon unlike the damaged USGI. Increase in spine strength without affecting the high all round, proven performance of the PMag was one of the primary goals of the M3 PMag program. As a result the PMag M3 does have a several fold increase in spine strength over the current PMag magazine. I want to point out i did not bash your product. I have spent a lot of money on your products. Your mag broke. The lancer got a little rust. |
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Posted: 8/14/2012 9:29:32 PM EDT
[#34]
 |
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Posted: 8/14/2012 9:32:35 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Magpul]
[#35]
Originally Posted By ArmedPete:
Originally Posted By Magpul:
Originally Posted By ArmedPete:
This is a great thread. I subscribed a while ago and have been enjoying each test. It's interesting to me how poorly the magpul pmag is holding up. The Lancer however is very impressive. Thanks for doing this. The PMag hasn't rusted and nothing has deformed in response to chemical exposure. So the crack (which is common to other polymer magazines) is the only issue in this that we could have done better in. That said, even with the crack the PMag will still function when inserted into the magazine well of the weapon unlike the damaged USGI. Increase in spine strength without affecting the high all round, proven performance of the PMag was one of the primary goals of the M3 PMag program. As a result the PMag M3 does have a several fold increase in spine strength over the current PMag magazine. I want to point out i did not bash your product. I have spent a lot of money on your products. Your mag broke. The lancer got a little rust. I never took it as a bash. Sorry if that came across that way. It was more an observation on how different ways of tackling the same problem has different side effects. With the current PMag we made it as strong as we could while not sacrificing other important aspects that has contributed to it's success. Some of these things have always been corrosion and chemical resistance. The biggest thing is that the M3 PMag does significantly improve in spine strength, addressing this issue. |
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Posted: 8/14/2012 10:04:08 PM EDT
[#36]
Want to thank the OP for this thread. You must have struck a nerve with some. Out of curiosity I wonder if they read the thread title "The Unscientific Plastic Magazine Test"?
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Posted: 8/14/2012 10:21:58 PM EDT
[#37]
Originally Posted By rbrin15:
Want to thank the OP for this thread. You must have struck a nerve with some. Out of curiosity I wonder if they read the thread title "The Unscientific Plastic Magazine Test"? I read the title, some folks here will take the unscientific test as gospel. There have been these unsientific tests in the past and they linger around here like a bad fart folklore. Hardly a nerve struck for the record. |
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NC, USA
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Posted: 8/14/2012 10:24:32 PM EDT
[#38]
Awesome thread can't wait to see the final results!
When are the M3's coming out again? |
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Posted: 8/14/2012 10:35:46 PM EDT
[#39]
Originally Posted By DrDrake:
Okay, I missed the vid where it began to develop a crack. Out of curiosity, have you considered building a drop test fixture to ensure the drops are consistant? I'm not going to make excuses or turnn this into a testing debate however it is very important to understand no two drops are alike unless duplicated vix a fixture. Even then there are subtle differences. No worries.
I thought about making a drop test fixture to drop the mags , but I don't know any old people that I can take their mechanical hand and rig it into a drop tester. 
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Posted: 8/14/2012 10:42:55 PM EDT
[#40]
Well sorry it too so long to post the results. Lots of running around tonight.
The major screw up that happened is apparently I haven't shot at my local range on a Tuesday night, ever, in the history of me shooting there. I drive in to find this: 
These are the posted range hours... 
But I see they close the rifle ranges so the trap shooters don't get distracted. 
So now I have to drive to the other local range, buy a membership, get the key, drive up into the hills... And here I am. 
Mags, ready to be loaded. 
All loaded just fine with the StripLula. 
All cleaned and lubed up SR-15. 
And I'll be back when the videos upload....
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Posted: 8/14/2012 11:21:52 PM EDT
[Last Edit: WI57]
[#41]
Ok here we go.
The Troy mag, ran fine, did not drop free.
The TangoDown mag, ran fine, dropped free.
The Pmag, ran fine even with cracked lips, did not drop free.
The Lancer mag, ran fine, dropped free.
The Tapco mag, ran fine with the crack, did not drop free.
The Tan GI mag, went in tough, ran fine, had to be yanked out.
The Green GI mag, ug, ran ok, had some issues, I'm keeping it around for corrosion testing...
The end result. 
Rifle ran just fine, like usual. 
Green GI mag didn't do so well. 
I'll put it back up for the pictures. 
Followers. 
Troy is developing a crack in its lip. 
TangoDown is missing a chunk on the inside of the lip but still works fine. 
Pmag is cracked but still functions if its gently handled, feeds fine when its in a rifle. 
Lancer is a little rusted but works just fine. 
Tapco is cracked, but still feeds. 
Tan GI is bent all to hell but somehow functions, but gets stuck in the mag well. 
Green GI mag worked ok for a while, then fell apart. Also gets stuck in mag well. 
So far the base plates are doing OK. 
Got them home, time for another soak... 
I read somewhere this PB Blaster is some good stuff, makes cleaning easy. 
The warning makes me wonder what will happen. 
Arranged nicely. 
Time to see what happens. 
Looks like some nasty stuff, stinks worse than Simple Green. 
I'll let this one sit until tomorrow evening. 
eta- corrected description |
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Posted: 8/14/2012 11:29:09 PM EDT
[#42]
OP, this makes for an interesting read.
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MI, USA
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Posted: 8/14/2012 11:43:16 PM EDT
[#43]
Not to be a picky dickhole, since I'm enjoying this as much as everybody else, but I think the macro shot of the Tapco mag spine is labeled as Tango Down.
Anyway, can't wait to see what happens next! |
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Posted: 8/14/2012 11:49:58 PM EDT
[#44]
GI Mag: "No workie"
Thanks again for an awesome test. I'll refrain from responding to Magpul's irrelevant post to prevent the derailing of a great thread. I will however respond to the comment regarding "unsientific[SIC] tests in the past and they linger around here like a bad fart folklore". I would think that's the last thing they should complain about considering that the highly unscientific youtube PMAG "tests" is what gave rise to their popularity in the first place. Countless dollars were blown on PMAGs because of these "tests". |
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Posted: 8/15/2012 12:02:35 AM EDT
[#45]
Originally Posted By oogabooga289:
Not to be a picky dickhole, since I'm enjoying this as much as everybody else, but I think the macro shot of the Tapco mag spine is labeled as Tango Down. Anyway, can't wait to see what happens next! Good eye.
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Posted: 8/15/2012 12:02:50 AM EDT
[#46]
Originally Posted By 35mm_Shooter:
GI Mag: "No workie"
Thanks again for an awesome test. I'll refrain from responding to Magpul's irrelevant post to prevent the derailing of a great thread. I will however respond to the comment regarding "unsientific[SIC] tests in the past and they linger around here like a bad fart folklore". I would think that's the last thing they should complain about considering that the highly unscientific youtube PMAG "tests" is what gave rise to their popularity in the first place. Countless dollars were blown on PMAGs because of these "tests". Thank You.
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Posted: 8/15/2012 12:37:13 AM EDT
[#47]
CAUTION: PB B'LASTER may affect some plastics.
Sorry, got a twitch when I saw that picture. Fascinating thread, OP. Thanks for spending your money and doing this. |
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USA
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Posted: 8/15/2012 12:39:12 AM EDT
[#48]
I really dig the test are "unscientific." This is real shit. When I am responding to a callout, hunting hogs or whatever i might be doing. My magazines will not be in a fixture or controlled environment.
I can't wait to see the "last mag standing" when this is done.
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Posted: 8/15/2012 1:16:03 AM EDT
[#49]
I'm happy to see the Lancer doing so well. There really haven't been any surprises yet.
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Posted: 8/15/2012 1:27:26 AM EDT
[#50]
Looks like the polymer mags are all going to continue to feed whether they are cracked or not because putting them in the magwell is pushing them back together, that is if the feedlips dont break. Which means the lancer might fail first IF the feelips bend enough.
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