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Posted: 12/21/2010 4:30:08 AM EDT
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I've seen vids of the gel block almost explode, anyone have pics of the temp. cavity after the block stops moving?
This stuff is expencive but damn, maybe worth over $2 a round in .308 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mFvrr9s_M-4&feature=related |
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i wanted to see the stretch marks the bullet makes compaired to fragmenting munitions.
A lot of SP ammo is making similar temp cavity markings in jel as the fragmenting. Im thinking about a switch to SP or similar ammo because it should work at any velocity where the fragmenting dosent. |
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i wanted to see the stretch marks the bullet makes compaired to fragmenting munitions. A lot of SP ammo is making similar temp cavity markings in jel as the fragmenting. Im thinking about a switch to SP or similar ammo because it should work at any velocity where the fragmenting dosent. 
A lot of people are figuring this one out. Get a round that you can shoot and shoot well that is not "finnicky" with velocities. The TSX is a great round. I use it in several rifles including the 308 and love it. It does a tremendous amount of internal damage, penetrates deep and retains all of it's weight. The arm chair crowd will say it doesn't do well on the wind shield test but lets face it, you shoot someone through a wind shield and your going to prison for murder...in most states. P |
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The temp cavity isn't that impressive since the bullet doesn't fragment. Any particular reason you're interested in the temp cavity? I've got this diagram from DocGKR. TSX-type bullet in the last one: http://ammo.ar15.com/project/Misc_Images/DocGKR/308WPcomparison.jpg Having personally used both Hornady 5.56mm 75gr TAP and SSA 5.56mm 70gr TSX, I can tell you that these pictures accurately depict the relative wounding potential. Noticeably more internal damage with the 75gr 5.56mm TAP on deer sized game. TSX does have the edge with barrier penetration, however. |
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I have been using Barnes bullets through the entire generation of the X bullets. I really liked XLCs, liked the TSXs even better, and love the MRX because they expanded better than the TSXs, now the TTSX. The two things that these excel at are Elk hunting with fast rounds, and Coyotes out of hyper-velocity varmint rifles. I actually went back to a bonded lead core bullet for elk, because if I did not take the front shoulder out on a big bull, a vital shot would leave the animal running, and I was tracking elk for rest of the day. With a vital shot, even on elk, I always had an exit wound, but the internal organs remained intact for the most part. An expanding bullet will put them down within 100 yards from where they were shot, if hit in the vitals. I am pretty sure a bonded bullet will take out the shoulder on a bull, also. I have always liked V-Max bullets, and they shoot well out of all of my .220 Swifts. I had severe problems with 40 grain V-Maxs hitting the ribs of coyotes and blowing up, leaving a plate sized exterior wound, and an animal that is running off to die of an infection of some sort. It seems like I had about 30%of my coyotes running off when shot with VMaxs. Boom, SLAP, the coyote would roll, and I would be watching a coyote running 40 mph with a huge surface wound. The thin jacketed varmint bullets simply could not take a bone strike with a muzzle velocity of 4200 fps. I switched to TSXs for my Swifts (I cant find a good bonded bullet that will stabilize in a 1 in 14" twist barrel) and problem solved. The bullet always exits, but the coyote never runs far. |
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I actually went back to a bonded lead core bullet for elk, because if I did not take the front shoulder out on a big bull, a vital shot would leave the animal running, and I was tracking elk for rest of the day.
With a vital shot, even on elk, I always had an exit wound, but the internal organs remained intact for the most part. An expanding bullet will put them down within 100 yards from where they were shot, if hit in the vitals. I am pretty sure a bonded bullet will take out the shoulder on a bull, also. What caliber were you using with the TSX on elk? |
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I actually went back to a bonded lead core bullet for elk, because if I did not take the front shoulder out on a big bull, a vital shot would leave the animal running, and I was tracking elk for rest of the day.
With a vital shot, even on elk, I always had an exit wound, but the internal organs remained intact for the most part. An expanding bullet will put them down within 100 yards from where they were shot, if hit in the vitals. I am pretty sure a bonded bullet will take out the shoulder on a bull, also. What caliber were you using with the TSX on elk? 
We have shot lots of elk and big bull nilgai, the TSX is the go to. It destroys the vitals and always exits leaving great blood. I'm interested to hear how many bulls this was experienced on and where in the vitals was he hit? Was he actually recovered? P |
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Quoted: Quoted: I actually went back to a bonded lead core bullet for elk, because if I did not take the front shoulder out on a big bull, a vital shot would leave the animal running, and I was tracking elk for rest of the day. With a vital shot, even on elk, I always had an exit wound, but the internal organs remained intact for the most part. An expanding bullet will put them down within 100 yards from where they were shot, if hit in the vitals. I am pretty sure a bonded bullet will take out the shoulder on a bull, also. What caliber were you using with the TSX on elk? We have shot lots of elk and big bull nilgai, the TSX is the go to. It destroys the vitals and always exits leaving great blood. I'm interested to hear how many bulls this was experienced on and where in the vitals was he hit? Was he actually recovered? P 7mm Rem Mag for the majority of Elk shot with TSXs. Five cows and three bulls are what I am basing my opinion on. |
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I won't hunt big game with anything BUT Barnes X / TSX.
Have taken everything from White Tail to Cape Buffalo with Barnes X-bullets and have had exemplary performance every time. The Cape Buffalo made it 20 yards before keeling over. The bullet was found in it and had text book expansion. |
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The bullet I really like out of the Barnes line up is the Tipped Triple Shock. I believe the plastic tip initiates expansion much better than the hollow point cavity of the TSX.
That'd be interesting to try. It might be just the thing for slightly lighter game. |
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Quoted: The bullet I really like out of the Barnes line up is the Tipped Triple Shock. I believe the plastic tip initiates expansion much better than the hollow point cavity of the TSX. I've never seen any evidence that the regular TSX's don't open up like gangbusters. The only reason for the plastic tip is to aid BC, AFAIK. |
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Quoted: Quoted: The bullet I really like out of the Barnes line up is the Tipped Triple Shock. I believe the plastic tip initiates expansion much better than the hollow point cavity of the TSX. I've never seen any evidence that the regular TSX's don't open up like gangbusters. The only reason for the plastic tip is to aid BC, AFAIK. To be honest, I haven't either, and I am just postulating this because it stand to reason that a larger frontal area would cause expansion a little quicker. I have shot MRXs and TTSXs next to TSXs in wet newspaper (I know, not scientific) and the tipped X bullets seemed to open up quicker. I have not played with MRXs much, because the last time I bought a box they were over a dollar apiece, and only come with 20 per box. But it was neat the way they stood each one up like a diamond ring in the box.  I guess that the summation of my posts in this thread are that X-Bullets, in all flavors, are very velocity dependant. They were the answer in my .220 Swifts, but were not the answer in my 7mm in longer shots. They are what they are, and work great in their given role, but I did not find them to be the death ray on very large game that I had hoped. |
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Quoted: I guess that the summation of my posts in this thread are that X-Bullets, in all flavors, are very velocity dependant. They were the answer in my .220 Swifts, but were not the answer in my 7mm in longer shots. They are what they are, and work great in their given role, but I did not find them to be the death ray on very large game that I had hoped. The problem - if you want to call it that - with the Barnes and bonded bullets is that they don't fragment. They get great penetration, but don't create the same cavity that a semi-fragmenting bullet like Nosler Ballistic Tips, Hornady SSTs, etc. do. For your typical deer, I really, really like the semi-fragmenting stuff. They still penetrate plenty deep, yet the partial fragmentation will usually put a deer down HARD. The advantage of the Barnes and bonded bullets is that they will consistently penetrate deeply, and do so even if they hit a shoulder blade or something like that. For an elk, I would probably choose the TSX as well and take the guaranteed penetration. FWIW - I'm currently alternating 150gr Nosler BTs and 140gr Barnes TSXs for each shot during hunting season. My last buck was taken with a TSX in November. The Barnes seems to be slightly more accurate than the Nosler (66gr of RL22, same seating depth). |
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I guess that the summation of my posts in this thread are that X-Bullets, in all flavors, are very velocity dependant. They were the answer in my .220 Swifts, but were not the answer in my 7mm in longer shots. They are what they are, and work great in their given role, but I did not find them to be the death ray on very large game that I had hoped. The problem - if you want to call it that - with the Barnes and bonded bullets is that they don't fragment. They get great penetration, but don't create the same cavity that a semi-fragmenting bullet like Nosler Ballistic Tips, Hornady SSTs, etc. do. For your typical deer, I really, really like the semi-fragmenting stuff. They still penetrate plenty deep, yet the partial fragmentation will usually put a deer down HARD. The advantage of the Barnes and bonded bullets is that they will consistently penetrate deeply, and do so even if they hit a shoulder blade or something like that. For an elk, I would probably choose the TSX as well and take the guaranteed penetration. FWIW - I'm currently alternating 150gr Nosler BTs and 140gr Barnes TSXs for each shot during hunting season. My last buck was taken with a TSX in November. The Barnes seems to be slightly more accurate than the Nosler (66gr of RL22, same seating depth). +1, good explanation. I use them for the fact that if a buck of a life time is exiting I can shoot him up the rear and know it will exit his chest. We also hunt where there is a mixed bag of whitetail/nilgai and whitetail/elk. A tough bullet is required at all times. I shoot a lot of coyotes with the 224 70gr TSX and it slams them down dead. Weds. morning i shot one at 300 yards with my 556 bolt gun and expansion was text book. He had a 1" hole behind his off shoulder and died in the road where he stood. P |
| I shoot the TSX out of my .300 Weatherby which is more velocity than your 7mm Mag and can't say I've ever had problems. However; on thin skinned game they can do just an "in and out". I don't like TSX on whitetail. I've had devastating results with the Nosler Btips but they tear up the game too much IMO> |
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Re: Losing meat when shooting Nosler BTs. I have generally been able to take good broadside shots, in which case you don't lose much meat. A few of the shots where the bullet exited the front shoulder was a different story. It can take a pretty good chunk of meat and turn it into bloody goo. |
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Re: Losing meat when shooting Nosler BTs. I have generally been able to take good broadside shots, in which case you don't lose much meat. A few of the shots where the bullet exited the front shoulder was a different story. It can take a pretty good chunk of meat and turn it into bloody goo. Yes, it's very dependent on where you take the game. However, sometimes it can be just wild what that bullet can do. I took a pronghorn at about 300 yards standing quartering towards me and the bullet took 3 ribs with it; the entry hole was the size of my fist. Could this have happened with other bullets? Probably but I've just seen too many torn up animals with it. My experience of course. It IS extremely effective. |
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Quoted: Quoted: The bullet I really like out of the Barnes line up is the Tipped Triple Shock. I believe the plastic tip initiates expansion much better than the hollow point cavity of the TSX. I've never seen any evidence that the regular TSX's don't open up like gangbusters. The only reason for the plastic tip is to aid BC, AFAIK. From the Barnes website: The new Tipped TSX features the same 100-percent copper body with multiple rings cut into the shank. It delivers the same gnat’s-eyelash accuracy and "dead right there” performance—but with an added polymer tip that boosts BC and improves long-range ballistics. The tip and a re-engineered nose cavity provide even faster expansion. |
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What factory .308 loads for a bolt gun using the TSX would you guys recoment for elk? I don't reload. Well, I'd suggest you go buy 3 or 4 different TSX loads from a variety of manufacturers and shoot them for groups. Take the one that shoots the best. I shoot a lot of Weatherby Ammunition. I know Barnes is supposed to be making their own ammunition now as well. |
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Quoted: From the Barnes website: The new Tipped TSX features the same 100-percent copper body with multiple rings cut into the shank. It delivers the same gnat’s-eyelash accuracy and "dead right there” performance—but with an added polymer tip that boosts BC and improves long-range ballistics. The tip and a re-engineered nose cavity provide even faster expansion. Well, you learn something new everyday. I'd be surprised if it makes much difference. The regular TSX already opens up in the first inch to an inch and a half. I don't see how it could make much of a difference if it opened up a tiny bit faster. Either way, I was wrong... |
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What factory .308 loads for a bolt gun using the TSX would you guys recoment for elk? I don't reload. Well, I'd suggest you go buy 3 or 4 different TSX loads from a variety of manufacturers and shoot them for groups. Take the one that shoots the best. I shoot a lot of Weatherby Ammunition. I know Barnes is supposed to be making their own ammunition now as well. The BH Gold 168gr TSX is very accurate out of several rifles we have tried them in. I have taken elk, nilgai, hog and whitetail with excellent results. P |
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One thing about Barnes bullets is that some rifles just don't like them. My friend DPeacher has a 6.7x55 that just won't shoot them well, although they run like gangbusters in anything else. Weird... Same with my Custom Mod 70 in 300 Win mag. It is extremely accurate with the Scirroco and B.T. but throws the Barnes X like a damn brick. |
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