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[ARCHIVED THREAD] - AR45 Trainwreck (Page 1 of 2)
Posted: 4/18/2008 1:14:47 AM EDT
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Can anyone believe the complete CLUSTER FUCK the AR45 has become?? To say I'm PISSED is a fucking understatement.... NO COMMUNICATION.... The few Lowers that get shipped are either out of spec, or incomplete... Folks, if you're considering getting one of these, RUN AWAY.... Save your money until someone else fucking get's it right. I've sunk $500 into this fucking black hole, and don't expect to see anything anytime soon... |
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Basically, Mitch from khalan Weaponry still has not delivered all of the second batch from the 2007 orders and a few he did send out were very out of spec. Combined with the fact he refuses to communicate with customers in any way shape or form with the exception of a couple emails to a couple customers. I spoke to him myself via email but it all fell on deaf ears. www.cncguns.com/forum/index.php?board=31.0 |
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The difference between Batch 1 and 2 is night and day. I waited for batch 1 to clear to see how everything went before committing. Good updates, happy customers, reasonable turn arounds. I'm in. So I got into batch 2. I ordered a stripped lower, so I did receive mine, in January 2008. I had a "mostly" in spec gun so I think I was part of the early order before things started to go really awry. The things that were wrong on mine were easy fixes luckily. I took it out to the range for the first time last week and it runs great. I gotta break in the upper but the lower functions perfectly. I don't know what happened there at Mitch's place, with the exception of the tight buffer threads Justin did his part. The change in Mitch's responses via the forum and e-mail appear like a 180 degree turn around. He claimed medical issues, and his wife giving birth for some delays, but I agree this has devolved into a mess. I'm flabbergasted to hear some folks in batch 2 still don't have their receivers. My initial funds were sent in June 2007 for the 10% blank. And the AR45 part of the CNC forum has been deathly quiet the past couple of months, after months of good chat and banter. It's still a great design and Justin and TC have been great. I hope everyone gets satisfaction, and when TC gets back this thing gets back on track. |
I ordered diopters from him before I ordered my AR45. I canceled my order after 6 or 7 months of waiting and ordered them from Rainier Arms. Still waiting on my lower. I should have got a USC conversion. |
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One person is so fed up he started a parallel site for people to post their experiences with good old Mitch. I need to get my story and time line typed up and submitted to Khalan.net. Spread the word. Khalan.com/Mitch is a fucking idiot and a thief. |
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i bought two lowers from justin around sept 07. he sent them to mr. dipshit to get finished. in this time, i received two email replys about my lowers. none of which answered my question; payment options, consective serial numbers, and ffl info. i was only told i'm in batch 3. so it seems my kids will be retired before i get my lowers done. p.s. i don't have any kids at this moment |
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I've got one of Justin's 10% lowers and having watched the whole Khalen debacle unfold it looks like now it's going to end up being an expensive paperweight. Never mind that I've already got the upper, mags and all the parts to assemble the lower. Ah well, live and learn I guess. |
Why leave it a paperweight? Buy Justins jig from cncguns and the handful of suggested drill bits and finish it yourself! I think you could find someone to borrow the expensive tap. Could also gain some useful tips from the forums over there. You'd probably be MUCH better off than having that hack (KW) ruin it up for you, charge you for the pleasure, and probably never deliver. |
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It's a true shame. Mitch seems to have ruined this for now. I hope someone will pick this up, and do it right. The concept is excellent. These things would sell well if someone would get their poop in a group and provide a Justin and Tango with a quality finished product (having some customer service skills is part of this). I know both of these guys have put their heart and souls into this project. Fortunately, I got in on batch 1. It was a long wait, but that was the expectation for a custom lower. Mine took even longer because I had Mitch paint it, and another AR15 lower that I bought from him. Both turned out very well. I have about 2K rounds through the AR45 now. As I have stated many times here, the ONLY problem I had with it was three OOB's. This was due to not being broken in and me not realizing that because I did a weak charge on a full mag, it was not in battery for the first round. The last time this happened the bullet became lodged in the barrel. Pounded it out with brass rod and never hurt a thing. I never pass up a chance to show this thing off. The tan one is Khalan's lower and a CMMG 7.5" upper (shown with a Ciener conversion in it).    |
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I got in on batch number 2. I did just get my lower and a buttstock assembly, but of course no lower parts kit. Looks like I won't be holding my breath for that to arrive. At least I got that much . . . . . Hope this mess gets cleared up eventually. This is a really great project and someone needs to do this project justice. |
justin sells the 10% since he is not a manf, so the fire control area needs to be milled to... |
i think you can get them also from www.centurionarms.com/ |
bob332 caught the correct on this. The lower is at 10% and is going to take a lot more than just getting a jig and doing some drilling. The fire control group area has to be milled out and the magazine well needs to be opened up all the way through. I have no desire to try any of that by myself with zero machining experience in my skillset. When I heard that Khalen was going to be completing the 10% lowers I figured it'd be a pretty straight-forward and easy process, just send in the 10% lower then get a completed one back. I guess nothing is ever simple. It's really a shame because with all the work that Justin & TC put into this concept, it looked like one of the more innovative ideas for the AR-platform in a long time. Still amazes me that NO ONE out there among the big manufacturers have jumped on this. 
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I am going to get my info on there as soon as I can get time to set down and get it all together. I just missed getting in on batch one (I was waiting to get my money back from Ameetec  ). Finally got my lower a couple months ago. It was an out of spec POS. I sent it back. Supposedly, Mitch has "resolved" all the "issues" and was supposed to send it back to me a couple weeks ago. Of course he hasn't done what he said he would do. I have my doubts that he has done anything.If I don't have it by the first of next week I am going to take the nuclear / scorched earth route. Joe |
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I urge anyone that has been screwed, who have not received their receivers, or their receivers do not work contact the Arkansas Attorney General's Consumer Protection Division. www.ag.arkansas.gov/consumers_tips_file_complaint.html I already have filed a complaint against Mitchell and Khalan Weaponry. I also want to know what will be done by Justin and Bill to help make this right for those of us who were screwed. |
I don't hold TC and Justin responsible for Khalan's bullshit at all. They lived up to their end of the bargain. If they could legally produce complete lowers, they would. |
WTF? You have got to be kidding! We are under no legal or moral obligation to "make this right". Each buyer made their own deal with Khalan to finish their lower. Justin and I have no say so in how Khalan conducts business. Both of us have spoken to Mitch about his poor business preactices and now he won't answer our calls or emails either. We were lucky to find anyone willing to finish the lowers as a manufacturer. I contacted 137 gun manufacturers and Khalan is the only one willing to take on the AR45 project. The only other option was a 10% lower you had to finish yourself. The fact that Khalan Weaponry went south in it's business dealings is no reflection on Justin and I. We didn't make you send your lower to Mitch, it was offered as an option to get your lower completed and was a good option initially. The first batch came out great with no issues. We had no way of knowing this was going to happen and no way to prevent it if we did. We are sorry this has happened but your only recourse is legal action against Khalan Weaponry or go see Mitch in person. One of the customers needs to contact a lawyer and file a law suit against Khalan Weaponry. Maybe all the screwed customers should pool their money for a lawyer if that's what it takes. Sue the company. This is not Justin's nor my fault and we have done everthing we can to get Mitch to man up. As a matter of fact, I believe Mitch has a bunch of unpaid lowers from Justin. He was planning on finishing them so in the future he would have lowers on the shelf ready to go, so Justin is out money as well. I have been approached by a couple companies offering to look at getting into the AR45 market but nothing yet as Justin is hard to get a hold of these days. Once we get together, we will figure out our next step. I'm sorry if I sound pissed but that statement was out of line. |
tuckahoe, i think you are placing blame in an area where it shouldn't go. the issue is w/ khalan, not justin and tc. you are dealing w/ 2 seperate and independent entities, justin for the 10% lower and then khalan to finish it up. i can sympathize w/ your situation but placing blame where it should not go is not going to help the situation, imho. i think tc's first response in this thread kind of proves their place in this situation - to call the police on khalan.... |
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tuckahoe, Now I'm really confused. In your post on the cncgun.com forum, you stated you received both your receivers and the only problem was one did not have the mag catch slot milled out. That's it, that's your problem? What do you think Justin and I should do about one unmachined slot? www.cncguns.com/forum/index.php?topic=416.45 Give me a damn break! There are guys here that don't even have their lowers yet. |
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Guy's, I started this as a BITCH FEST against Mitchell and Khalan Weaponry, NOT CNC and Tango Chaser. Without them, there would be no AR45, period. I wish someone was LOCAL to Khalan, and could go drop a big steaming turd in his office, and ask him WHAT THE FUCK??? ALL I really want right now is A WEEKLY UPDATE from him. I don't need a personal email. I don't need a phone call. WHAT I think we need is a list of people who have paid, in order of earliest to latest, and what is going on. I guess I'm gonna have to file the police report, contact the Atty General, etc. FUCK! oh well, guess I paid a "STUPID" tax. The thing that sucks is, I probably can't even get my 10% lower back. |
Are you kidding? WTF has Justin and Bill done but bring to market one of the coolest AR out there. Youre beef is with KW. What do you want them to do, give your money back because someone else screwed you?
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NOT their fault. have to say i'm with Bill, TaylorWSO, and the rest on this. direct your anger towards the target that deserves it, namely mitch. he's the one that (once again) has turned out to be a disingenuous, unprofessional hack. TC and Justin have done nothing but create and produce their parts of a very cool product. they deserve our thanks, not demands for cleaning up khalan's mess. caveat f-ing emptor. |
Like maybe my AR 45 receiver gets shipped to my dealer finished and in spec. I will be in KW town in june, I may stop by and say Hi to Mitchell 
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You're in luck. I have a Khalan trouble ticket for you. |
HA HA HA....A "Khalan trouble ticket".... Those are about fucking worthless.... No, wait...they ARE FUCKING WORTHLESS..... We got JERKED around again.... He must be sitting back fucking laughing his ass off at us.... Hope he enjoys the fucking money he's scamming from us... |
When approaching the building, think about this: You can be sure he has a LOT of firearms inside (AR45's that belong to his customers), so beware he's heavily armed! But on the bright side, since he did the final/critical machining to them, they probably won't function! |
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Are 10% receivers still available? Anyone with an unaltered 10% receiver that wants to part with it? It is a big ass mess. I feel for those involved. I have only been screwed 2 times by the "gun community" in ten years of internet buying/selling/trading. It burns for a long time I can tell you. Hopefully this gets resolved but that sounds iffy at best. I hate lawyers because usually the only one that wins is the lawyer and his bank account but it would be nice if either civil or criminal charges could be filed and brought against him. Typically in court the jury tends to side more with the customer than the business. In this instance I would say that would be a no brainer. |
 I just spit my drink out!10mm, get a hold of Justin on www.cncgunc.com. I know he has 10% lowers still available. |
Let me know when you plan on visiting....I may be able to JOIN YOU.... Heck, we could have an AR45.COM Reunion in Mitch's hometown.... |
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Thank's TC. I was informed right around the end of the year it was ready to go pending lower parts kit. After countless emails requesting it be shipped without the LPK, I finally received it the first week in April. That's why I was wondering which batch I finally ended up with. The receiver is a beautiful piece of craftsmanship. Parkerized mags are near to impossible to insert. Blued mags are somewhat better. But I haven't had much time to work at tweaking them. |
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I have yet to find GG mags that are square. Multiple minor squeezing in a vice should square up all your mags and make them fit drop free or colse to it. I tired 10 different mags and none fit as I received the mags. All had to get the squeeze to fit. The magwell is not any tighter to the mags than a standard AR magwell is to M16 mags, it's just that GG mags are not perfectly square but the AR45 magwell is. |
[ARCHIVED THREAD] - AR45 Trainwreck (Page 1 of 2)
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