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Posted: 6/13/2015 9:07:46 PM EDT
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I've seen a lot of questions lately about the various 308 platforms. I haven't tried many, but here's my experience with the DPMS>
DPMS GII Range Report I’ve had my GII for about 8 months but only lately have I really spent a lot of time with it. Before this report I had ~200 rounds through it. Here’s the boomstick: 
I made a couple changes right off the bat. First, I replaced the stock trigger with a Geissele DMR. The old trigger was a smidge rough, even for a DPMS “milspec” trigger. The Geissele is great. Very easy to install and adjust and has a nice clean break and reset. I also swapped the gas block for a Syrac adjustable, hoping to tame the recoil as much as possible and give me a little more flexibility regarding ammo selection, especially to try some hotter loadings. I swapped the A2 grip for a MIAD. The scope is a vortex 2.5-10x32 on a bobro 20moa base. Love the Vortex and the mount. I’ll definitely be after another Brobo in the future. The installation is absolutely foolproof and has a repeatable zero when removed/reinstalled. The fit and finish are quite nice. Everything fits together without a lot of wobble. It’s been very very reliable- the only malfunctions I’ve had are when I turned the gas down a couple notches too low. That’s user error on my part, but part of the learning curve for different loadings. It’s slim, light, and handles great. I primarily shoot ar15s(well, M16s). That’s what I was trained on, that’s what I’ve competed with, and that’s what I’m comfortable with. This is my first attempt at a .308 semi, and I’m not very experienced as a bench rest shooter, but I’ve learned a lot over the last few months. My intent is to compete in some local matches and ring some steel up to and including 1000. I’ve tried about 13 types of ammunition, but only used 11 for this test. For this test I didn’t include any the South African and German milsurp- not terribly interesting and not very accurate. YMMV. 
I picked up a decent sample of match/plinking/hunting loads from the reasonably affordable to the more premium variety. These are 10 rounds groups at 100 yards, fired at ~1 min intervals for 10 minutes. Then I let the barrel cool for 15-20 minutes between groups. I removed the bipod and shot off of a front box rest and sandbag with a rear bag. Federal American Eagle 150 FMJ 
Hornady 168 ZMAX 
Remington Core-Lokt 150 SP 
Federal GMM 168 SMK 
Nosler 168 CC BTHP 
Barnes Vor-Tx 168 TSX 
Nosler 175 CC BTHP 
Black Hills 175 TMK 
Federal Tipped Trophy Copper 165 
Hornady Superformance 178 BTHP 
Black Hills 175 MHP 
I pulled that last one to the left when the shooter to my right, who had previously been shooting .22LR all day, decided to dump 25 rounds of 5.56 from his AR. I think it’s fair enough to discount that round, bringing the group to .753 MOA. I suppose I could have removed the worst 1-3 of every group and had better numbers, but I think the data as it stands is helpful enough. That’s an average of 1.81 MOA for the set. It seems to be a little picky, with some surprisingly good and "less good" performances. I'm sure a better shooter with a proper rest could wring out tighter groups. I've also considered getting a 6-24x50 for this rifle. The 10x is good enough at 100 no doubt, but I think more magnification would help me hold a more consistent sight picture and demand that my position be more stable(otherwise the reticle would probably move too much). a) 10 rounds groups are tough to shoot very consistently. b) The semi really is less forgiving c) If you feed it ammo it likes, it’ll shoot well. I’m happy to answer any questions and would love some pointers from anyone who has something helpful to add. Thanks, hope this helps. |
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very nicely done... thanks for the info... I guess there is a reason why Federal Gold Medal Match is sort of the standard by which all other ammo is judged... I just free floated an M&P10, I am waiting on the spacer for the buffer (changed the stock). I have about 5-7 diff types of ammo, will try to do the same although I don't shoot worth a shit...  |
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Most competition shooting I've done is 10 rounds slow fire in 20 minutes, so yes, that was an aspect of it, but...
I chose 10 round groups mainly because they're more statistically meaningful. Molon started a great thread about it a few years ago. http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_3_118/279218_The_Trouble_With_3_Shot_Groups.html That thread made me a believer! I also find shootig to be about 1/10 as frustrating with 10 round groups. I don't have to chase my groups as much and I get to see how the round does as the barrel heats up. |
| Also, I did this shooting over 2 days- 4 groups one day, 7 another. It takes awhile! I plan on doing one 10 minute string during a 20 minute range "hot session", use the other 10 minutes to do some dry fire, let the barrel cool, stretch out, get some water, etc. cold sessions are about 10 minutes, so you can really only accomplish 2 groups an hour. |
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Brass looks good for the most part. Very light dual ejector marks on most- similar to what you'd see from an m16(except of course there are two). A bit of primer flow is common, but generally not severe imo.
The hornady superformance had very bad marks. Deep cuts with sharp edges. I also have a GII ap4 and it will bend case rims with hot loads, but the bull barrel with its rifle length system doesn't have that issue. Also, one pierced primer on the black hills MHP. |
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Quoted:
Brass looks good for the most part. Very light dual ejector marks on most- similar to what you'd see from an m16(except of course there are two). A bit of primer flow is common, but generally not severe imo. The hornady superformance had very bad marks. Deep cuts with sharp edges. I also have a GII ap4 and it will bend case rims with hot loads, but the bull barrel with its rifle length system doesn't have that issue. Also, one pierced primer on the black hills MHP. I had similar negative experience with G2 Hunter with Hornady Superformance. Won't be shooting any more of it. Besides accuracy with it was not good....minute of moose. I've never had good results from any "premium bullet" factory hunting ammo in any firearm. Spot on....Federal Gold Match is the Gold Standard. 
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For me the accuracy of the Superformance, having shot it a few other times before doing this range report, was mediocre in this rifle. I'm sure there are rifles that like and it shoot it fantastically, buuuuut.... for me, in this rifle, there isn't enough accuracy to justify dealing with the pressure issues. The high FPS and high BC make it a fantastic long range round(potentially). I'd love to take it out to 1100-1200 yards, where it would still be going strong, but I don't think it's quite accurate enough. 2moa @ 1200 yards is mighty big. Ironically it's one of the better performers in my AP4, but the brass is even worse and still not good enough to live up to its downrange potential.
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Quoted:
For me the accuracy of the Superformance, having shot it a few other times before doing this range report, was mediocre in this rifle. I'm sure there are rifles that like and it shoot it fantastically, buuuuut.... for me, in this rifle, there isn't enough accuracy to justify dealing with the pressure issues. The high FPS and high BC make it a fantastic long range round(potentially). I'd love to take it out to 1100-1200 yards, where it would still be going strong, but I don't think it's quite accurate enough. 2moa @ 1200 yards is mighty big. Ironically it's one of the better performers in my AP4, but the brass is even worse and still not good enough to live up to its downrange potential. The longest range readily available to me is 600 yards. I got a Savage to build into a range rifle, however with a 600 yd range I figured to get the G2 have a go at it. See what happens with my match handloads. Trying to imitate or exceed Fed GMM using 168, 175 and 180 gr match bullets. Besides it'll be cheaper using an existing rifle and my middle name is Frugal. 
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I load 168 smk for my AR. Looks like yours likes it pretty well also.
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Any thoughts on your GII AP4? Thanks for your report! Yes, I have an almost identically formatted review forthcoming. BLUF: Cool rifle, super light, handles great, fit and finish is nice, BUT stock trigger is disgusting(much worse than the bull barrel), ejection port cover is iffy in that it doesn't open when you manually cycle the rifle(ok, I guess it does but as the bolt closes and only if you're a little forceful, making empty chamber checks annoying), groups about 3x as large, and can be a little crueler to brass depending on the load. I'm after an aftermarket barrel (anybody?) or even a DPMS stock bull barrel as soon as I can. For it's flaws I still have some hope, but I would have cut down a bull barrel or tried a recon if I could do it again. |
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Nice Report! Whats that weigh with the Bull Barrel? To what distance do you feel comfortable shooting with the Vortex on 10x? I see your thinking more magnification I'll put in on the scale tonight. I have only tried at 100 yards so far, but depending on target size the 10x is pretty reasonable out to 1000 yards and beyond. A local club shoots 6" gongs at 600 yards and I would be willing to try that with the 10x. To put it in perspective I think 2moa targets at 500 yards with an acog is pretty easy pickins.... if it has a nice big white background. To me, the target ID, milling, and mirage reading are just as beneficial as the increased apparent target size in a higher magnification optic. |
| My AP4 is incredibly light, I'll give it that. It's so light I don't think I would mind in the slightest a little more weight on the front end for a heavier barrel. When in comes to the weight of the recon, if you swap the stock rails for a MI keymod or similar you can save a lot of weight. Those stock rails are fairly heavy. |
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