AR Sponsor
Posted: 10/9/2014 3:15:17 AM EDT
|
i picked up a sig 716 a couple of months ago for a steal. came with a redfield battlezone using a Burris P.E.P.R. mount. i tried to get it sighted in but had no luck. i could hit paper at 100 yards but the groups were GIANT. so today i did some training with a friend that has a TON more experience than myself and competes, he had the same issue. He was hitting paper at 100 yards but we are talking like 8-10" groups. He concluded the the scope was probably shit, as i didn't buy it new, i don't know the history behind it.
im wanting to stay at or under $300 with $400 being the absolute top for a new optic. i was looking at the Vortex Viper lineup or the primary arms 4x14FFP, but was wondering if there are any others that i should get or look at instead. thanks in advance. |
|
Contact Redfield. Let them know your experience with the scope. They have a very good no excuses warranty program. They will either fix it or replace it. I've read lots of good reviews on the Battlezone. Well worth getting fixed or replaced.
As for optics, there is several by Burris that fall inline with your budget. Primary Arms has the 1-6x ACSS, that should be back in stock soon. Quoted:
i picked up a sig 716 a couple of months ago for a steal. came with a redfield battlezone using a Burris P.E.P.R. mount. i tried to get it sighted in but had no luck. i could hit paper at 100 yards but the groups were GIANT. so today i did some training with a friend that has a TON more experience than myself and competes, he had the same issue. He was hitting paper at 100 yards but we are talking like 8-10" groups. He concluded the the scope was probably shit, as i didn't buy it new, i don't know the history behind it. im wanting to stay at or under $300 with $400 being the absolute top for a new optic. i was looking at the Vortex Viper lineup or the primary arms 4x14FFP, but was wondering if there are any others that i should get or look at instead. thanks in advance. |
|
Quoted:
Why not switch to iron sights and check your accuracy that way and make sure it's not the gun precision shooting is not something most people can achieve using iron sights, and i am one of them people that CANNOT produce great groups using only irons. haha |
|
But you could, take several, three shotl groups from the 25, 50 or 100 yard line.. To get a feel for the rifle. And make sure, the group's aren't erratic in any way? And if the rifle came with a set of backup sights. You'd want to verify their zero anyway. And not rely on what the previous owner told you,.
Quoted:
precision shooting is not something most people can achieve using iron sights, and i am one of them people that CANNOT produce great groups using only irons. haha Quoted:
Quoted:
Why not switch to iron sights and check your accuracy that way and make sure it's not the gun precision shooting is not something most people can achieve using iron sights, and i am one of them people that CANNOT produce great groups using only irons. haha |
|
Quoted:
But you could, take several, three shotl groups from the 25, 50 or 100 yard line.. To get a feel for the rifle. And make sure, the group's aren't erratic in any way? And if the rifle came with a set of backup sights. You'd want to verify their zero anyway. And not rely on what the previous owner told you,. Quoted:
But you could, take several, three shotl groups from the 25, 50 or 100 yard line.. To get a feel for the rifle. And make sure, the group's aren't erratic in any way? And if the rifle came with a set of backup sights. You'd want to verify their zero anyway. And not rely on what the previous owner told you,. Quoted:
Quoted:
Why not switch to iron sights and check your accuracy that way and make sure it's not the gun precision shooting is not something most people can achieve using iron sights, and i am one of them people that CANNOT produce great groups using only irons. haha This is what I was getting at. Even with a sub MOA gun I can shoot sub MOA with irons, most irons aren't built with precision in mind anyway, they are a stop gap to keep the gun running when your primary sighting system (red dot/ scope) goes down. |
| Before you buy another scope or return it try another scope. It is not always the scope. I am sure you did it but you might want to double check the screws on your mount are torqued down to proper specs. I have seen a lot of guys with some custom bolt action rifles that couldn't hit crap and it was usually a loose or out of whack mount. Also make sure you have the mounts cross bolts pushed all the way forward in the slot on the rail. |
|
Quoted:
This is what I was getting at. Even with a sub MOA gun I can shoot sub MOA with irons, most irons aren't built with precision in mind anyway, they are a stop gap to keep the gun running when your primary sighting system (red dot/ scope) goes down. Quoted:
Quoted:
But you could, take several, three shotl groups from the 25, 50 or 100 yard line.. To get a feel for the rifle. And make sure, the group's aren't erratic in any way? And if the rifle came with a set of backup sights. You'd want to verify their zero anyway. And not rely on what the previous owner told you,. Quoted:
Quoted:
Why not switch to iron sights and check your accuracy that way and make sure it's not the gun precision shooting is not something most people can achieve using iron sights, and i am one of them people that CANNOT produce great groups using only irons. haha This is what I was getting at. Even with a sub MOA gun I can shoot sub MOA with irons, most irons aren't built with precision in mind anyway, they are a stop gap to keep the gun running when your primary sighting system (red dot/ scope) goes down. Tell that to everyone up until ~15 years ago... |
|
Quoted:
precision shooting is not something most people can achieve using iron sights, and i am one of them people that CANNOT produce great groups using only irons. haha Quoted:
Quoted:
Why not switch to iron sights and check your accuracy that way and make sure it's not the gun precision shooting is not something most people can achieve using iron sights, and i am one of them people that CANNOT produce great groups using only irons. haha Bench it or get a bipod on it and shoot groups using irons at 50 if you don't want to do 100. Your main problem might be ammo. My 716 is forgiving with some 762 NATO, but shot ZQI and PMC in 4" groups. |
|
Quoted:
I may be an Optic elitist, but its only because Ive bought plenty of cheap optics and they all sucked ass for one reason or another. Buy quality, buy once. Your Optic should be just as durable as your rifle, and in many cases, costs as much as a rifle. 
EDIT: FPNI, ask them to keep it and give you a price difference on a Revolution. Loopy didn't bring the company back to JUST to test out Customer Service. This AIN'T the '60s or 70's. God da-da-damn scopes that cost 1K from back then would have their ass handed to them by what's coming out today for a few hundred. Just like electronics in the God da-da-damn audio gear kit. (I'm a David Hafler kewl-aid fan. I'll take properly regulated fets;tri-path fets any da-da-damn day of the week over fucking pterodactyl tubes.) BTW: I am of fan of the VORTEX PST line. Piss on SWFA's SS line. No, SWFA doesn't even deserve that much effort in angst. |
|
Quoted:
EDIT: FPNI, ask them to keep it and give you a price difference on a Revolution. Loopy didn't bring the company back to JUST to test out Customer Service. This AIN'T the '60s or 70's. God da-da-damn scopes that cost 1K from back then would have their ass handed to them by what's coming out today for a few hundred. Just like electronics in the God da-da-damn audio gear kit. (I'm a David Hafler kewl-aid fan. I'll take properly regulated fets;tri-path fets any da-da-damn day of the week over fucking pterodactyl tubes.) BTW: I am of fan of the VORTEX PST line. Piss on SWFA's SS line. No, SWFA doesn't even deserve that much effort in angst. Quoted:
Quoted:
I may be an Optic elitist, but its only because Ive bought plenty of cheap optics and they all sucked ass for one reason or another. Buy quality, buy once. Your Optic should be just as durable as your rifle, and in many cases, costs as much as a rifle.
EDIT: FPNI, ask them to keep it and give you a price difference on a Revolution. Loopy didn't bring the company back to JUST to test out Customer Service. This AIN'T the '60s or 70's. God da-da-damn scopes that cost 1K from back then would have their ass handed to them by what's coming out today for a few hundred. Just like electronics in the God da-da-damn audio gear kit. (I'm a David Hafler kewl-aid fan. I'll take properly regulated fets;tri-path fets any da-da-damn day of the week over fucking pterodactyl tubes.) BTW: I am of fan of the VORTEX PST line. Piss on SWFA's SS line. No, SWFA doesn't even deserve that much effort in angst. Da Fuq is you saying....1k glass nowadays will blow any 2-3-$400 shit out of the water(period). Clarity is great, but durability is what really matters. At least if you actually use your guns. |
|
Quoted:
Da Fuq is you saying....1k glass nowadays will blow any 2-3-$400 shit out of the water(period). Clarity is great, but durability is what really matters. At least if you actually use your guns. It's 2014. He doesn't need to spend a da-da-damn grand. I said my piece. Peace. |
|
Make sure the scope is mounted right, torqued right, base (or anything) is not moving, throw it on another rifle if possible, or vise versa, borrow another scope. Redfield's warranty is to the original owner, but they have been known not to ask/care and will likely stand by their product for any factory defect and fix or replace it, if it is the scope anyway. Could be the rifle, mount, ammo and so on. (Rifle is used just like the scope.)
Quoted:
EDIT: FPNI, ask them to keep it and give you a price difference on a Revolution. Loopy didn't bring the company back to JUST to test out Customer Service. This AIN'T the '60s or 70's. God da-da-damn scopes that cost 1K from back then would have their ass handed to them by what's coming out today for a few hundred. Just like electronics in the God da-da-damn audio gear kit. (I'm a David Hafler kewl-aid fan. I'll take properly regulated fets;tri-path fets any da-da-damn day of the week over fucking pterodactyl tubes.) BTW: I am of fan of the VORTEX PST line. Piss on SWFA's SS line. No, SWFA doesn't even deserve that much effort in angst. Quoted:
Quoted:
I may be an Optic elitist, but its only because Ive bought plenty of cheap optics and they all sucked ass for one reason or another. Buy quality, buy once. Your Optic should be just as durable as your rifle, and in many cases, costs as much as a rifle.
EDIT: FPNI, ask them to keep it and give you a price difference on a Revolution. Loopy didn't bring the company back to JUST to test out Customer Service. This AIN'T the '60s or 70's. God da-da-damn scopes that cost 1K from back then would have their ass handed to them by what's coming out today for a few hundred. Just like electronics in the God da-da-damn audio gear kit. (I'm a David Hafler kewl-aid fan. I'll take properly regulated fets;tri-path fets any da-da-damn day of the week over fucking pterodactyl tubes.) BTW: I am of fan of the VORTEX PST line. Piss on SWFA's SS line. No, SWFA doesn't even deserve that much effort in angst. It is all relative.. no kidding things have gotten better since then, but so has the high end glass, it is not like it is stuck static in 1970 technology. Paying the premium today gets you unbelievable glass. I would normally prefer to buy higher end glass (and none made by the same 14 year old that made my sneakers.).. new high end glass is like the holy grail of clarity, quality, tracking etc., 70's high end stuff is like a dixie cup in comparison. |
|
Quoted:
Make sure the scope is mounted right, torqued right, base (or anything) is not moving, throw it on another rifle if possible, or vise versa, borrow another scope. Redfield's warranty is to the original owner, but they have been known not to ask/care and will likely stand by their product for any factory defect and fix or replace it, if it is the scope anyway. Could be the rifle, mount, ammo and so on. (Rifle is used just like the scope.) It is all relative.. no kidding things have gotten better since then, but so has the high end glass, it is not like it is stuck static in 1970 technology. Paying the premium today gets you unbelievable glass. I would normally prefer to buy higher end glass (and none made by the same 14 year old that made my sneakers.).. new high end glass is like the holy grail of clarity, quality, tracking etc., 70's high end stuff is like a dixie cup in comparison. Quoted:
Make sure the scope is mounted right, torqued right, base (or anything) is not moving, throw it on another rifle if possible, or vise versa, borrow another scope. Redfield's warranty is to the original owner, but they have been known not to ask/care and will likely stand by their product for any factory defect and fix or replace it, if it is the scope anyway. Could be the rifle, mount, ammo and so on. (Rifle is used just like the scope.) Quoted:
Quoted:
I may be an Optic elitist, but its only because Ive bought plenty of cheap optics and they all sucked ass for one reason or another. Buy quality, buy once. Your Optic should be just as durable as your rifle, and in many cases, costs as much as a rifle.
EDIT: FPNI, ask them to keep it and give you a price difference on a Revolution. Loopy didn't bring the company back to JUST to test out Customer Service. This AIN'T the '60s or 70's. God da-da-damn scopes that cost 1K from back then would have their ass handed to them by what's coming out today for a few hundred. Just like electronics in the God da-da-damn audio gear kit. (I'm a David Hafler kewl-aid fan. I'll take properly regulated fets;tri-path fets any da-da-damn day of the week over fucking pterodactyl tubes.) BTW: I am of fan of the VORTEX PST line. Piss on SWFA's SS line. No, SWFA doesn't even deserve that much effort in angst. It is all relative.. no kidding things have gotten better since then, but so has the high end glass, it is not like it is stuck static in 1970 technology. Paying the premium today gets you unbelievable glass. I would normally prefer to buy higher end glass (and none made by the same 14 year old that made my sneakers.).. new high end glass is like the holy grail of clarity, quality, tracking etc., 70's high end stuff is like a dixie cup in comparison. Exactly...And in the $700 range you can get scopes like quality leupolds or trijicon accupoints...nothing in the 3-$500 range can compare at all, Especially nothing from primary arms, LOL. My favorite of the cheap shit is probably the burric m-tac or Fullfield 2 line, as for durability, I have an NC star mk3 rubber armored something or other, that I throw at walls from time to time, and the thing still functions perfectly...It was the first magnified optic I ever bought, clarity is terrible though, but damn the thing is a tank. |
|
I would just ditch the scope, get better with irons while you save, and get a better scope.
I'm with the few others on optics quality. I, too, used to somewhat cheap out on optics. Once I made the move to optics that cost about as much as the rifle, I saw what the big deal was all about. I feel the Leupold Mk 6 1-6 is probably the best match for the Sig 716 Patrol. And the price (~$1600-2000) falls right in line with the quality of the gun IMO. Picture just because: 
|
AR Sponsor