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Posted: 5/2/2012 8:10:34 PM EDT
| What's the difference between the RRA CAR-A4 upper and the Mid-Length A4 upper? Is it just where the gas block is placed on the barrel? I can't see much of a difference between them on that account. I'm going to purchase one or the other. Please help educate me. |
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I have an RRA middy. I think the cycling issues depend on what you're feeding it. Wrong powder = no workie, regardless of your gas system choice. it's a finicky round/platform combo. Mine has never seen a round that wasn't hand-loaded, BTW. If you're going to use commercial ammo, then research that first before you decide. Maybe contact the ammo mfgr? I've not used mine a lot (relative to 556 in competition), but RL7 w/ 300gr TTSX's has been both rock solid reliable and devastating to anything it touches. That, and 16" carbines look like shit. Just my $.02, -Slice |
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If you reload you can make the mid length gas work just fine. I have a carbine length RRA and I had a over gas issue with mine and I had to put an adjustable gas tube on it. It works great now.
If you get a middy you will probably need to run RE7 or 4198 and stay away from 110/296 and Lilgun. I like the 300 gr TTSX and the 405 gr jsp bullets. Whatever you get it will be a 458 Socom, one of the best pig killing rds ever made 
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from my reading all you need is a 12 in barrel to get full powder burn with the 458 socom. So if it was me I would get a 14.5" with welded flash hider and carbine gas. Conditionally! It depends very much on what powder and bullet weight is used. But...quite a few powder/bullet combinations will achieve 95% (or better) burn in a 16" barrel. |
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If you reload you can make the mid length gas work just fine. I have a carbine length RRA and I had a over gas issue with mine and I had to put an adjustable gas tube on it. It works great now. If you get a middy you will probably need to run RE7 or 4198 and stay away from 110/296 and Lilgun. I like the 300 gr TTSX and the 405 gr jsp bullets. Whatever you get it will be a 458 Socom, one of the best pig killing rds ever made True, my 18" middy has never failed to cycle using A2200 with load data from Accurate. However, the Carbine gives you more flexibility and the option to use faster burning, higher velocity powders like H110. If you are only going to use factory rounds then Carbine is the way to go. FWIW Marty has stated that H110 is not a preferred powder in the Socom (though a lot of people seem to use it very successfully!) and that he used Re7 in his testing, which works well in Middys. |
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I have all three gas lengths, handgun, CAR, and mid. The two powders I have used and like the best are H110 and Re #7. H110 will not work in a midlength with any certainty but it gives the highest velocities and outstanding accuracy. However, I do not like having different loads that will work in one but not the others, so I have reluctantly ditched H110 for the slightly slower top end Re #7 which will work in all three gas lengths. I have to give up 50-100 fps but that is just the way it is if you want to keep things simple with multiple guns in the same caliber. If you only have one, personally I think one is nuts to go with a midlength. Even Rock River said the ONLY reason they came out with the midlength is because all the 5.56 boys did not understand that just because a midlength was good in the 5.56 that it does not mean it is good in a .458S. Regardless of whether it worked properly or not, they wanted a middy, so RR gave it to them even though they knew it would not work as well. RR gave the customers what they wanted so that is the only reason we have midlength .458s. I did not directly quote them but that is the jest of it. Sometimes one must be careful for what they wish. Get the CAR, use any powder you want within reason and call it a day. Get the midlength, settle for slower velocities, and be careful which powder you choose, or for that matter, which factory loaded ammo you choose. Some of the CB stuff has been known not to work in Midlength gas systems but I think they too have switched over to powders that work in all of them, even if it means giving up a few fps.
The only reason my 20 inch has a midlength is because I wanted the rifle to match another 20 inch I had and Marty felt the CAR with a 20 inch barrel may not work properly, and he knew that with the correct powder selection the midlength would run OK. I'd much rather have had a CAR length gas on the 20 but if Marty says the midlength gas would be better with a 20 inch tube, I certainly would not argue with the 'man.' With Re #7 it runs like a scaled cat so I am quite happy with it, but I would never advise anyone else to get a midlength or a barrel longer than 16 inches. My middy/20 inch was for a very special build and had very special criteria, otherwise I would never have gone longer than 16 inches or a gas other than handgun or CAR. |
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Hornady dies from Graf & Sons, brass direct from Starline. (Shows on backorder, but when I placed my order it said "backorder quantity met".) Can't find the 405 grain Remington bullets that I'd like to try. Suggestions?
Three months to collect brass, bullets, dies etc. A lot of components are in short supply, I'd start now. |
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Hornady dies from Graf & Sons, brass direct from Starline. (Shows on backorder, but when I placed my order it said "backorder quantity met".) Can't find the 405 grain Remington bullets that I'd like to try. Suggestions?
Three months to collect brass, bullets, dies etc. A lot of components are in short supply, I'd start now. I'm looking for 405s myself so can't help you there. If you're looking to hunt, the Barnes 300 TTSX is top notch, but expensive. Be aware that because of its length load data for the TTSX CANNOT be copied from other 300's. The hornady, Remington, and other 300 JHP's are good too and the combined technology 300 has put down its share of animals too. I suggest getting a box of whatever you can get your hands on and see what your rifle likes. Accurate powders will send you data if you email them and there is a lot of data for other stuff on the Socom forum. |
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After reading the previous info I feel alittle saddened. In my haste to not wait I found a mid-operator. Should be here tomorrow. But with some of the information I have gotten from this forums great members I think I can still enjoy this firearm. If you reload you should be fine. Stock up on re7 or A2200 or one of the others shown to work in a mid gas system and shoot the hell out of it. |
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I'm looking for 405s myself so can't help you there. If you're looking to hunt, the Barnes 300 TTSX is top notch, but expensive. Be aware that because of its length load data for the TTSX CANNOT be copied from other 300's. The hornady, Remington, and other 300 JHP's are good too and the combined technology 300 has put down its share of animals too. I suggest getting a box of whatever you can get your hands on and see what your rifle likes. Accurate powders will send you data if you email them and there is a lot of data for other stuff on the Socom forum. After I get some loads worked up and tested, I really want to take it to Texas and whack some feral hogs with extreme prejudice. |
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To the load data, I asked Barnes, and they sent me the below in a PDF file.
I was 1 month into my wait for a middy from RRA, direct, then found (from here) that PK Firearms had 16" carbine .458 uppers in stock (for like $695 or something), so I cancelled my RRA order after receiving the one from PKF. In fact, they currently have .458 14.5" carbine uppers with perm. attached flash hiders in stock for $715, a little over 1/2 way down this page: http://www.pkfirearms.com/Rock_River_Arms_Barreled_Uppers/57/c Also, I did ask them specifically, and they say that the TTSX and the TAC-TX are literally the same bullet, just with different marketing. 
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