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5.45 FAQ Add your information & tricks here!! (Page 3 of 5)
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Originally Posted By SickMAK90:
Does the silicone spray really help the c-products magazines? I am having pretty bad luck with the mags in mine. Other than that it has been great. Didn't know that about silicon spray for the springs. Maybe someone can chime in? Wolf comes in 25rd boxes, which is good 'cause that's about exactly all I can get into my C-Products mags––-and even that's a bitch! |
If you make me a criminal with the wave of a pen, I just might have to act like one!
11C2P '83-'87. AIRBORNE INFANTRY!!!
11C2P '83-'87. AIRBORNE INFANTRY!!!
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I don't have any problem getting 30 rounds into the C Products mags. I even use a maglula benchloader made for .223/5/56 and it works great with the 5.45 too. Originally Posted By ABNAK: Originally Posted By SickMAK90: Does the silicone spray really help the c-products magazines? I am having pretty bad luck with the mags in mine. Other than that it has been great. Didn't know that about silicon spray for the springs. Maybe someone can chime in? Wolf comes in 25rd boxes, which is good 'cause that's about exactly all I can get into my C-Products mags––-and even that's a bitch! |
3/25 Marines Anbar Province 2005, All Gave Some, 48 Gave All
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I have never tried silicone but have had good success with dry Teflon lube (mold release) on CP mags. I spray both the spring and inside of the mag. The followers glide smooth as silk and the spring “twang” is gone. I can load the first 20 rounds with a 223 LULA in short order and 5 more with a bit of manipulation.
I also have tried both curved and straight 20 round CP mags. The straight mags (black followers) work best with 15 rounds. The followers are short and can tilt to accommodate the angle of the case. The curved seem to start binding after 5 or 6 rounds because the gray followers are longer. I prefer 20 rounders when working off a bench. |
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Originally Posted By SickMAK90:
Does the silicone spray really help the c-products magazines? I am having pretty bad luck with the mags in mine. Other than that it has been great. Go to Lowe's or Home Depot, and get a can of Dupont Teflon-Silicone spray. It worked damn well for me. |
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Originally Posted By FrankSL:
Originally Posted By SickMAK90:
Does the silicone spray really help the c-products magazines? I am having pretty bad luck with the mags in mine. Other than that it has been great. Go to Lowe's or Home Depot, and get a can of Dupont Teflon-Silicone spray. It worked damn well for me. So do you take it apart and just spray the springs, or spray the inside of the mags, or what? |
If you make me a criminal with the wave of a pen, I just might have to act like one!
11C2P '83-'87. AIRBORNE INFANTRY!!!
11C2P '83-'87. AIRBORNE INFANTRY!!!
| In using a Special weapons lower(uses ak74 mags Bakelite works best) The barrel from teppo and opened the bolt face up to accept 5.45, and standard 5.56 extractor. Just got it put together yesterday and after 500 rounds not a ftf or fte yet. At the feed lips on the mags I ground off the bakelite so i didnt have to cut so much out of the carrier rails. just my little experience. Runs flawless with me dias.... |
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Perhaps you guys can help me here. Took the 5.45x39 upper out for the very first time today.
This is a Kurt's Kustom (KKF) AR-upper custom built. Used a 5.45x39 AK 74 barrel, gas tube in the mid-length position. Using a Young's NM chrome bolt carrier and an Alexander Arms .221 Genghis (the original 5.45x39 AR Upper design) bolt. Also using C-products mags. Used standard Russian 5.45x39 FMJ ammo. This was my first outing with the rifle. I used 5 different mags (both the old and new versions produced). I also lubed up the bolt and carrier group a number of times. The Good: 1 - Every time I pulled the trigger, it went BANG! 2 - Every time it went BANG, it ejected the spent case. 3 - Quite accurate - honestly I was very surprised - I was getting, with a cheap red dot, under 1" groups at 25 yards and then later about 1.5" at 50 yards - big dot (5-6 MOA, I think) so some of that may have been me or just not having a good rest - I honestly think with some better technique I could have been doing 2" at 50 yards. The Bad: 1 - Numerous times when putting in the magazine and releasing the bolt, it would strip the round and push it into the chamber ALMOST all the way, but there was still about 1/4" -1/2" of the bolt not retracting into the carrier, and therefore not pushing the round all the way in and going into battery. 2 - Numerous times (about once every 3 or so rounds) after firing, it would eject the spent case but do #1 (above) - not go into battery. I'd drop the mag, pull the charging handle back, and then when I let go it would go into battery just fine. I pulled the bolt carrier group out and pulled and pushed on the bolt back and forth - it seemed tight, and it binded up as I was pulling it out all the way or pushing it back. It seemed like it was right where the gas ring was that it was binding. So I took the bolt out and it looks like the gas ring (a one-piece one) was . . . larger in diameter . . . than it should be - it wasn't flush with the groove where it rests. Is it possible that this is what is causing the battery problems? When the bolt is in full extension and is slamming back into battery, it strips the next round but just when some resistance is met as the round is going into the bore the gas ring (being a little too big and binding) gets caught and slows down the momentum of the BCG enough to cause it to just stop? I suppose one way to test this is to simply replace the gas ring. I think I have a Wolff extra power buffer spring in it, but not sure. Would having one help out with this problem as well? Any other ideas or thoughts as to what may be causing this? Overall, still fun and I had a few 5-8 round strings where everything worked just fine. |
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Originally Posted By beltfedmachine:
In using a Special weapons lower(uses ak74 mags Bakelite works best) The barrel from teppo and opened the bolt face up to accept 5.45, and standard 5.56 extractor. Just got it put together yesterday and after 500 rounds not a ftf or fte yet. At the feed lips on the mags I ground off the bakelite so i didnt have to cut so much out of the carrier rails. just my little experience. Runs flawless with me dias.... I have also found out that the bakelite mags work best, just bought 5 more to have enough to keep sitting around for it. 
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Told to me by a friend... "If God doesn't destroy San Fransisco, he at least needs to apologize to Sodom and Gomorrah..."
13.1 miles is a long distance to run...
13.1 miles is a long distance to run...
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Update:
At home, without the benefit of going back to the range, I decided to try a number of solutions. I cleaned and lubed thoroughly. I took apart the bolt carrier group, checked all surfaces, put it back together. I even swapped out the bolt into another carrier. That seemed to make things a lot looser and not so sticky on the bolt going back and forth. Thinking I had solved the problem, I tried chambering and ejecting an entire mag. Well, it works a LITTLE better (maybe 4-6 in a row with no problems) before once more not putting the round into battery. I did notice, however (neglected to really see this before) that when it binds up, the base of the cartridge (where the rim and primer are) is not seated in the bolt face - it is slightly out a wee bit to the right looking at it from behind. So it appears to me (correct me if I'm wrong) that when the bolt goes forward to strip off the next cartridge, while it is pushing it out of the mag the base of the cartridge isn't getting fully into the bolt face, so perhaps it isn't being aligned dead-center into the bore, and therefore is causing the bolt to stop due to resistance. It doesn't appear that the resistance is coming from the gas rings binding inside the bolt carrier as I had earlier suspected. Could this be a magazine issue now? If so, then ALL of my mags have this problem as it doesn't matter what mag I use. Or could it be the bolt, or just simply not enough spring tension so that occasionally the round just won't get into the bore. One last thought - ammo? Maybe too much lacquer on the rounds? These are Russian "hunting" ammo, in 25 round white boxes. |
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Originally Posted By ABNAK:
Originally Posted By SickMAK90:
Does the silicone spray really help the c-products magazines? I am having pretty bad luck with the mags in mine. Other than that it has been great. Didn't know that about silicon spray for the springs. Maybe someone can chime in? Wolf comes in 25rd boxes, which is good 'cause that's about exactly all I can get into my C-Products mags––-and even that's a bitch! I picked up 10 of the C-Products mags and have been able to get 30 in all of mine. So I'm not sure what the problem is with yours. 
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Told to me by a friend... "If God doesn't destroy San Fransisco, he at least needs to apologize to Sodom and Gomorrah..."
13.1 miles is a long distance to run...
13.1 miles is a long distance to run...
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Originally Posted By CA_TX-Cop:
Originally Posted By ABNAK:
Originally Posted By SickMAK90:
Does the silicone spray really help the c-products magazines? I am having pretty bad luck with the mags in mine. Other than that it has been great. Didn't know that about silicon spray for the springs. Maybe someone can chime in? Wolf comes in 25rd boxes, which is good 'cause that's about exactly all I can get into my C-Products mags––-and even that's a bitch! I picked up 10 of the C-Products mags and have been able to get 30 in all of mine. So I'm not sure what the problem is with yours.
I tore them apart and sprayed them down with some Silicone-Teflon spray as recommended above. Haven't tried them out yet. Are you using a Lula? |
If you make me a criminal with the wave of a pen, I just might have to act like one!
11C2P '83-'87. AIRBORNE INFANTRY!!!
11C2P '83-'87. AIRBORNE INFANTRY!!!
| I handload my mags. And haven't had any issues with the trigger yet either, but I use a standard trigger on all my guns. |
Told to me by a friend... "If God doesn't destroy San Fransisco, he at least needs to apologize to Sodom and Gomorrah..."
13.1 miles is a long distance to run...
13.1 miles is a long distance to run...
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Has anyone else had issues with Silver Bear 60 grain jamming in an S&W 5.45x39 upper? I normally feed it a steady diet of Wolf MC or Black Box but ATG was running a special so I picked up a couple of 750 round cases of Silver Bear. Every couple of rounds the nose of a bullet would jam in the feed ramp. The jam could be cleared by locking the bolt open and dropping the mag. The jammed round would drop out of the mag well and would show a pretty good scar on the bullet with raised metal. Tried 5 or 6 different C P mags. Wolf would cycle fine but the Silver Bear would jam. It seemed to happen more often on the left side.
I'm going to break all the sharp edges on the lugs on either side of the feed ramps and polish them. Any other suggestions? It may just be an optical illusion but when I put a Wolf and Silver Bear side by side there appears to be a slight difference in the shap of the bullet nose. The Silver Bear seems to be a bit less rounded and more tapered which may explain why it wedges into the lugs. It could just be an illusion though. The Silver Bear seem a bit hotter than Wolf. I am running this on an extra S&W lower with a Bushmaster LPK. So far the standard spring has worked fine. I really do not think you need the heavy (red) spring unless you are going to run the old military ammo (Bulgarian or Russian spam cans). I did try different buffers and am currently running a H2. It seems to smooth things out a bit. S&W customer service just plain sucks. They are more concerned about building and selling new rifles or uppers than supplying customer part needs. I'm thinking of picking up a POLISH TANTAL AK74 as a back up and also sending a spare AR bolt to Kurt for modification to 5.45. |
| I can open your guys bolt faces up for you if you are still needin it done. just let me know I have cnc mills and lathes as well as manual lathes. I have opened std .223 bolts to work with my uppers in the calibers of 7.62xs39, 4.45x39, 9mm DI and 7.62x25 Di. just let me know |
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Thanks for the information. Sorry to hear about Kurt. My condolences to his family. When did this happen? I would have sworn I was just on his web site last month but I see now it has been shut down. Hard to keep track of time though.
Beltfedmachine- I'll keep you in mind and contact you for details when I'm ready. I have heard it both ways- that a standard extractor will work and also that it needs to be modified to function properly- which is it? |
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Has anyone else had issues with Silver Bear 60 grain jamming in an S&W 5.45x39 upper?
I have. I posted about it some where way back in this thread. I've officially had 0 malfunctions with several hundred rounds each of bulgarian, and russian 5.45 ammo. With the silver bear I've had several different problems. First problem, at first after every other shot the bolt carrier would only partially strip the next round out of the magazine. That stopped happening after I put several hundred rounds through the upper. Second problem, I had a dud round, strong primer strike, no bang. I re-chambered it and the same thing happened 
Third problem, if I chamber a round and then try to extract it, it's hard as shit to get out of the chamber. I've had to do the slamming the butt stock on the ground while pulling the charging handle back on occasion. Fourth problem, probably related to the problem above, I had my first failure to extract(ripped the rim off of the case) Fortunately I got the case of Silver bear 60gr for $90 per 750 rounds so I'm not too bumbed out about the stuff being crap. Anyone having any problems with their gun who is also using Silver Bear I'd suggest trying a different ammo before thinking that the gun is the problem. |
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Condolences to Kurts family. Shame that we lost another good man.
Does anyone have a good explanation on how to machine the 5.56 bolt to make it work for 5.45 pictures would be great if possible. I just ordered another kit from Model 1 (3rd this month) and want to have a spare bolt for that configuration. Thanks Guys. 
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Originally Posted By sitkashooter:
i have had no issues with silver bear 545X39 in my S&W What hammer spring were you using? The extra heavy or your standard one? |
"Sad enough to say that alone I can barely light a match but together we can burn this place down"
ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
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I'm having issues with my rifle.
I took my 5.45x39 AR to the range today and ALL 8 of my mags failed to feed the next round - I could feed them manually when I pulled the charging handle, but each time I fired it and it ejected the spent case, the bolt failed to strip the next round off the mag into the chamber. WTF? One thing of note - I have to REALLY slam the mags in to get them to stay in, especially when the bolt is closed - otherwise they just fall out - they aren't engaging the mag catch. I've tried to bend them a little (with a Brownell's tool) - like I said, manually charging or hitting the bolt release feeds them EVERY time from almost every mag (the older ones sometimes jam up but I suspect they have issues due to their age and their followers) - the rounds sometimes bind up, bend, etc. - BUT I just don't understand why I can manually charge every round, but when I shoot and try to let the rifle itself due the feeding it won't strip the next round. |
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Originally Posted By VivaLaFrance:
I'm having issues with my rifle. I took my 5.45x39 AR to the range today and ALL 8 of my mags failed to feed the next round - I could feed them manually when I pulled the charging handle, but each time I fired it and it ejected the spent case, the bolt failed to strip the next round off the mag into the chamber. WTF? One thing of note - I have to REALLY slam the mags in to get them to stay in, especially when the bolt is closed - otherwise they just fall out - they aren't engaging the mag catch. I've tried to bend them a little (with a Brownell's tool) - like I said, manually charging or hitting the bolt release feeds them EVERY time from almost every mag (the older ones sometimes jam up but I suspect they have issues due to their age and their followers) - the rounds sometimes bind up, bend, etc. - BUT I just don't understand why I can manually charge every round, but when I shoot and try to let the rifle itself due the feeding it won't strip the next round. What type of mags? What type of AR? I suspect some of these custom jobs built from AK74 barrels *may* be contributing to the problem. |
If you make me a criminal with the wave of a pen, I just might have to act like one!
11C2P '83-'87. AIRBORNE INFANTRY!!!
11C2P '83-'87. AIRBORNE INFANTRY!!!
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Awhile back I posted about Silver Bear jamming in the feed ramps on my S&W 5.45 upper while Wolf would feed okay. I also mentioned that I though the edges of the lugs around the feed ramps seemed to have heavy burrs compared to other uppers I own and that I though the burrs were probably the cause of the jams.
I had a chance to make it to the range on Friday and was pleased with the results from honing the edges of the lugs on either side of the feed ramps. No jams in 200 rounds. I’m sure it depends on which sub did the machining on your particular barrel assembly for S&W and how well it was inspected as to whether you have the same issue. For me the fix was simple. I used a fine, tapered round India stone. About 30 minutes of patient hand honing on the lug edges on both sides of both feed ramps and I had all the burrs gone. The lugs are hardened of course and you are not trying to round or chamfer the edges, just remove any rough burrs that may bite into the bullet nose and cause it to hang up. Before I started I tried mimicking the path with a bullet up through the feed ramp. I could feel the Silver Bear bite in while the Wolf would slide through although it felt rough. After honing, both rounds slid through smoothly. Just watch the leading end of the stone so you do not accidently hit the edge of the chamber. If you are not comfortable, stuff a couple of 1” round patches behind the lugs to protect the chamber. Clean thoroughly when done to remove all the grit. I went on the cheap and picked up a Magpul rear flip up to back up my EOTech. Not bad for the price. I forgot my front post adjusting tool like an idiot. I’m about 2” high at 50 yards but did put 5 shots in a 2” group. Not all that good but with my old eyes and bi-focals. I’m satisfied that in a pinch I can use them after I get the front post adjusted. |
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How to Open 5.56 bolt to 5.45 (Drawing only)
Thought this could be useful for those who want to know what needs to be done to a 5.56 bolt to make it work for a 5.45 setup. Thanks to: Hebrew_Battle_Rifle Link to Drawing Topic |
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I am considering a S&W upper or waiting for the rumored Spikes Mid-length.
My plan would be to re-barrel in 5.56 when the 5.45 barrel is shot out. In costing this out, I want to know what parts are standard and could be reused in a different upper. As I understand, the special Lower parts are heavy hammer spring and maybe an H3 buffer. Are the only modified upper parts the bolt, barrel and extractor? |
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Originally Posted By sierra80mk:
I am considering a S&W upper or waiting for the rumored Spikes Mid-length. My plan would be to re-barrel in 5.56 when the 5.45 barrel is shot out. In costing this out, I want to know what parts are standard and could be reused in a different upper. As I understand, the special Lower parts are heavy hammer spring and maybe an H3 buffer. Are the only modified upper parts the bolt, barrel and extractor? As far as I know, yes. I am going to buy an M4gery chrome lined barrel and bolt in 5.56 for when my S&W is "shot out" or I run out of non-corrosive ammo options. I have a little under 3,000rds of Wolf 60gr stuff but a carbine class or two would quickly eliminate that! |
If you make me a criminal with the wave of a pen, I just might have to act like one!
11C2P '83-'87. AIRBORNE INFANTRY!!!
11C2P '83-'87. AIRBORNE INFANTRY!!!
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I purchased a M1S 5.45 bolt and firing pin for my S&W upper because I'd heard you could run the M1S bolt and firing pin reliably with a 5.45 rifle using a standard hammer spring. This was important to me so I could run .22lr, 9mm, 556, and 5.45 in the same M16 lower receiver without knocking out the pins and changing out hammer springs. THIS IS ABSOLUTLY FALSE! You must still use a heavy hammer spring with the M1S bolt and FP. |
The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots & tyrants.
-Thomas Jefferson
-Thomas Jefferson
| I did a search of the forum and didn't find the info I'm looking for. Has anyone used a Sightmark (or other brand) 223 bore sighter on their 5.45x39 chambered rifle, and does it work pretty well?. I haven't been able to locate a bore sighter specifically for 5.45 and was wondering if folks use the 223 instead. Thanks. |
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Originally Posted By Jerad:
I purchased a M1S 5.45 bolt and firing pin for my S&W upper because I'd heard you could run the M1S bolt and firing pin reliably with a 5.45 rifle using a standard hammer spring. This was important to me so I could run .22lr, 9mm, 556, and 5.45 in the same M16 lower receiver without knocking out the pins and changing out hammer springs.
THIS IS ABSOLUTLY FALSE! You must still use a heavy hammer spring with the M1S bolt and FP. Jared, I sat down with Model1Sales and asked these questions at the Mesquite Gun Show 2 weeks ago. The owner told me you do not need a heavy hammer spring to get the 5.45 to engage the firing pin correctly. He said he shoot 5.45 all the time while developing the bolt and FP with standard springs. My personal 5.45AR functions flawlessly with factory springs. Jared, I think you need to tell M1S so they know and can fix the problem and we all benefit! My $0.02 P.S. 5.45 Kicks Friggin ASS! Happy_gopher |
American by birth, TEXAN by the Grace of GOD.
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I have two 5.45 uppers made with Bulgarian barrels and Alexander Arms bolts. I have improved ignition to about 99%. I had to shorten the tails on both bolts to do that.
I also have a S&W 5.45 upper. Had to shorten the bolt tail on that one as well. It runs at 99% as well. I run standard springs in all three. |
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I'm looking at a DPMS bull upper chambered in 5.45x39. The seller states that it fires 5.45 and .223. Is that possible or is he mistaken?
Quote from ad, "Details for rifle include: Barrel - 16" Bull Barrel, 5.56x45 caliber (shoots .223 also), M4 feed ramps. Upper Receiver - Flattop, extended M4 feed ramps, milspec hardcoat finish. Other details - Includes Bolt, Bolt carrier, and charging handle, rail mount gas block." Thanks Casey |
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Originally Posted By BlitzAttack:
Barrel - 16" Bull Barrel, 5.56x45 caliber (shoots .223 also), M4 feed ramps. Upper Receiver - Flattop, extended M4 feed ramps, milspec hardcoat finish. Other details - Includes Bolt, Bolt carrier, and charging handle, rail mount gas block." Perhaps you need glasses 
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Originally Posted By happy_gopher: Originally Posted By Jerad: I purchased a M1S 5.45 bolt and firing pin for my S&W upper because I'd heard you could run the M1S bolt and firing pin reliably with a 5.45 rifle using a standard hammer spring. This was important to me so I could run .22lr, 9mm, 556, and 5.45 in the same M16 lower receiver without knocking out the pins and changing out hammer springs. THIS IS ABSOLUTLY FALSE! You must still use a heavy hammer spring with the M1S bolt and FP. Jared, I sat down with Model1Sales and asked these questions at the Mesquite Gun Show 2 weeks ago. The owner told me you do not need a heavy hammer spring to get the 5.45 to engage the firing pin correctly. He said he shoot 5.45 all the time while developing the bolt and FP with standard springs. My personal 5.45AR functions flawlessly with factory springs. Jared, I think you need to tell M1S so they know and can fix the problem and we all benefit! My $0.02 P.S. 5.45 Kicks Friggin ASS! Happy_gopher hmm... I haven't tried wolf, maybe that will work. Are you having success with Surplus? |
The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots & tyrants.
-Thomas Jefferson
-Thomas Jefferson
| As usual I find a thread that answers in a few minutes most of the questions I have asked myself over the last couple months. I spent a great deal of time waiting for my AR 5.45 barrel to arrive and finally gave up.........I bought several AK74 virgin barrels and started my lathe and my milling machine going and attacked with vigor and enthusiasm..........Installation of the barrel extension took pencil work, adding machines, depth mikes and a headspace gauge from AK builder but was finally accomplished..............correct placement of the gas port required a bit of head scratching and measuring of my M4 5.56 barrel but was finally drilled and correct. This was followed by the building of a "bushing" for the barrel to adapt the .750" gas block to the smaller barrel of the AK74...............so far so good. Barrel fit, gas tube had the correct positioning and the headspace was perfect. Now to the bolt.........opened it up to .4" (same as the S&W) and left the extractor alone.........works perfect except only about 25% ignition on test firing. I modified the firing pin a bit to increase protrusion and had a fine primer strike and now about 50% fired ok. removed .010" from tail of bolt and modified tip of firing pin and finally ended up with about 75% ignition. Read this thread, saw the mention of heavy hammer springs and thought what the heck. I have ordered some springs but in the meantime I rewrapped the stock spring for additional tension and hit the range again.........95% went off without a hitch. I suspect the heavy spring will be the answer. Has anyone tried to increase the weight of the AR hammer?? If you look at the hammers on the AK rifles they are basically a sledge hammer driving a flimsy firing pin.......It appears to me there is room to add weight to the sides of the AR hammer and perhaps add enough force to the primer strike to get good ignition without using the heavy spring..........that would prevent the heavier trigger pull the heavy spring brings you. The marriage of the 5.45 round with the AR platform is a marriage made in heaven, sure is a kick to shoot...................llc |
5.45 FAQ Add your information & tricks here!! (Page 3 of 5)
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