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Posted: 4/23/2016 1:21:55 AM EDT
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Just as I was getting ready to ask the hive about the Faxon Gunner 16" vs. the Ballistic Advantage Premium Hanson 16" ss, somebody had to turn me onto the Lothar Walther light mid that's on sale. The BA is $70 more than the Faxon and they are almost identical in weight. The LW is $54 more than the BA and 7oz (almost a half pound) heavier. The LW has a stellar reputation, not to say the other two don't have their fan base here. Not crazy about the extra weight or price of the LW, but I do salivate about the accuracy, wylde chamber, polygonal rifling, twist, and the fact that it's QPQ stainless. I think I just need more information, but just typing the specs makes me almost hit the "add to cart" button on the LW!
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One thing to keep in mind is that the are more things that contribute to accuracy than all of the fancy stuff like Polygonal rifling, wylde chamber, etc.
My old Rock River A4 barrel was a heavy profile. It had sub-bar specs but it was amazingly accurate. I stopped worrying about accuracy when I realized I wasn't a bench rest shooter. 2-3moa with Wolf and I'm happy. I would get a Faxon gunner barrel if I were you. |
| Help me out guys. What else do you need to know in order to give me some information? I know it sounds contradictory, but I want a lightweight barrel and I want it to be accurate. A tall order, I know, but I've been researching this too long. I have the Faxon Gunner at 21.92 oz., the BA premium at 22 oz., the Wilson Combat at 26 oz., and the Lothar Walther at 29 oz. My budget cap is $300. The rifle will be scoped with a 1-5 and shooting mostly 55gr (and possibly 62gr) inside of 300 yds. If this were an open sight or dot gun, I could live with 2-3moa, but with the scope I need better than 2moa. I've been on the MOA all day thread and it wasn't helpful for this application. |
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If accuracy is your desire then I would get the Lothar Walther.
May be more expensive than the other two but I doubt you will regret it. Still pondering the other two to save some money then I will throw you a curve ball and say try a Green Mountain barrel instead. I have a Lothar Walther 18" in build process and have no doubts about what it will do compared to my Ballistic Advantage and even my highly accurate Green Mountain barrel. The Faxon I have not tried yet mostly because I could not find the accuracy reviews like I could the other three. Within a month I will do a shootout with all three of mine and I already know which one my money is on. |
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What does being a "Chick" have to do with barrel accuracy?
My wife asks a lot of questions about her AR's as well, not because she is a chick, but she is a damn good shot! I like my ballistic advantage barrels, I have 3 of them now and just ordered another one tonight which happens to be for my wife's rifle, they guarantee 1 MOA or less, if you don't attain that, they will work with you to help figure the problem out or they will send you a new barrel, that said, I have never had to send one back and will continue to use their stuff. You can find them for less than on their website, I normally pick mine up on ebay for far less than their advertised price on their website and get free shipping. |
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If accuracy is your desire then I would get the Lothar Walther. May be more expensive than the other two but I doubt you will regret it. Still pondering the other two to save some money then I will throw you a curve ball and say try a Green Mountain barrel instead. I have a Lothar Walther 18" in build process and have no doubts about what it will do compared to my Ballistic Advantage and even my highly accurate Green Mountain barrel. The Faxon I have not tried yet mostly because I could not find the accuracy reviews like I could the other three. Within a month I will do a shootout with all three of mine and I already know which one my money is on. I had looked at the Green Mountain barrels for my last lightweight build, but 30.4 oz. was a bit too much. When I read the description of the Lothar Walther to my buddy, he told me the same thing as you, adding it sounded like his Noveske, but for less money (and weight). I can't wait to see your report. |
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I like my ballistic advantage barrels, I have 3 of them now and just ordered another one tonight which happens to be for my wife's rifle, they guarantee 1 MOA or less, if you don't attain that, they will work with you to help figure the problem out or they will send you a new barrel, that said, I have never had to send one back and will continue to use their stuff. You can find them for less than on their website, I normally pick mine up on ebay for far less than their advertised price on their website and get free shipping. That's what's kept them in the running. It's reassuring to find a company that stands behind their product like that, rather than coming back with snarky "it's not for bench rest" comments. |
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The Faxon Gunner has been proven to be an MOA capable barrel and is lightweight while still having enough to meat forward of the chamber to resist groups opening up after a string of rapid fire like a traditional pencil profile. That and Nathan's responsiveness has kept them in the running. A shame nobody has posted 100 yd Gunner pics. Nathan's CS reminds me of MSARDave. A rare quality these days. |
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I like how you say "I want it to be accurate" and then list your ammo as what will assuredly be el-crappo full metal jacket plinking fodder. Just caught that.... Unless you're running a tuned hand load with 55gr Hornady FMJ (which can be a solid 1.5 MOA), you're not going to get match grade accuracy out of it. Best bet would be to load some SMK or similar 52-60gr OTM if you're looking at that slug weight. |
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I like how you say "I want it to be accurate" and then list your ammo as what will assuredly be el-crappo full metal jacket plinking fodder. Swing and a miss. Save your soothsaying skills for guessing peoples weight at the carnival. Looks like some of the bile from GD has once again seeped into a technical discussion. |
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Just caught that.... Unless you're running a tuned hand load with 55gr Hornady FMJ (which can be a solid 1.5 MOA), you're not going to get match grade accuracy out of it. Best bet would be to load some SMK or similar 52-60gr OTM if you're looking at that slug weight. Quoted:
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I like how you say "I want it to be accurate" and then list your ammo as what will assuredly be el-crappo full metal jacket plinking fodder. Just caught that.... Unless you're running a tuned hand load with 55gr Hornady FMJ (which can be a solid 1.5 MOA), you're not going to get match grade accuracy out of it. Best bet would be to load some SMK or similar 52-60gr OTM if you're looking at that slug weight. I have a couple hundred rounds of Black Hills left over. Not sure if I'll use those for break-in. The vast majority will be 55gr handloads. I just checked my reloading supply list and I have over 7600 55gr and 1000 64gr. |
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Just wait patiently for the next LaRue sale and get a PredatAR barrel. sub-moa accuracy and light weight. That said I also have a faxon pencil barrel and a BA barrel in my .308. Quoted:
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My budget cap is $300. Just wait patiently for the next LaRue sale and get a PredatAR barrel. sub-moa accuracy and light weight. That said I also have a faxon pencil barrel and a BA barrel in my .308. I had been watching them for a couple of years. Either the sale price was still to high for me, or they were sold out, so I gave up on that. |
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I have a couple hundred rounds of Black Hills left over. Not sure if I'll use those for break-in. The vast majority will be 55gr handloads. I just checked my reloading supply list and I have over 7600 55gr and 1000 64gr. Quoted:
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I like how you say "I want it to be accurate" and then list your ammo as what will assuredly be el-crappo full metal jacket plinking fodder. Just caught that.... Unless you're running a tuned hand load with 55gr Hornady FMJ (which can be a solid 1.5 MOA), you're not going to get match grade accuracy out of it. Best bet would be to load some SMK or similar 52-60gr OTM if you're looking at that slug weight. I have a couple hundred rounds of Black Hills left over. Not sure if I'll use those for break-in. The vast majority will be 55gr handloads. I just checked my reloading supply list and I have over 7600 55gr and 1000 64gr. What kind of slugs? With the right hand loads, they can be decently accurate. When things are working right my Hornady 55gr FMJ & 25gr. TAC combo gives me right around 1.25-ish MOA. I run this as my "Under 200 yard" load for 3-Gun. Over that, it's 77gr OTM only because my matches usually stretch to 500 meters. |
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Call me for a discount if you agree to post your shooting results. 
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A shame nobody has posted 100 yd Gunner pics. Call me for a discount if you agree to post your shooting results.
I'd jump all over that...I'd even do some 200 yard targets for you!   
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Quoted: Quoted: . . . ballistic advantage barrels . . . they guarantee 1 MOA or less . . . https://app.box.com/shared/static/nrxjte8ebsaubcnjwd3kcw1lj6wrj2xc.jpg .... |
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Given an accuracy spec of 2 MOA with match ammunition, I would look at Green Mountain, BA and Faxon. I think all of those can do 2 MOA pretty regularly with good ammunition. My 18" 1:6 Green Mountain seems to do a pretty regular 1.5 MOA for 10 shot groups and has done a .836 MOA average for the MOA all day challenge. It's a fairly lightweight profile as well. All of that is from Fed 50gr polymer tip ammunition. |
| Get the Walther. You know the first couple rounds that don't land where you want them to your gonna be pissed at the world for not getting the LW. Yeah its heavier and it costs a few bucks more, but quality has its price. You already know you want it, so quits asking here for a answer you will regret. You already knew you were gonna buy it anyway. |
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I'll preface this by saying that I'm a newbie to AR platform rifles. I think you should take RogueNathan up on his offer. He is so confident that his Faxon barrel will meet your needs that he encourages you post your results. That tells me that he is sure that you will be completely satisfied with his product.
I have two AR barrels on order; one is a Faxon GUNNER profile barrel due to Nathan's involvement in this forum. J |
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. . . ballistic advantage barrels . . . they guarantee 1 MOA or less . . . https://app.box.com/shared/static/nrxjte8ebsaubcnjwd3kcw1lj6wrj2xc.jpg .... I don't get it. Is 1 MOA impossible for a barrel of that quality? Genuinely curious because I have never used their barrels. |
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I don't get it. Is 1 MOA impossible for a barrel of that quality? Genuinely curious because I have never used their barrels. Quoted:
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. . . ballistic advantage barrels . . . they guarantee 1 MOA or less . . . https://app.box.com/shared/static/nrxjte8ebsaubcnjwd3kcw1lj6wrj2xc.jpg .... I don't get it. Is 1 MOA impossible for a barrel of that quality? Genuinely curious because I have never used their barrels. Molon says not possible with a 10 shot group using a BA barrel. Molon only acknowledges a 10 shot or a larger qty group. Anything less than a 10 shot group is dead to him. |
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Quoted: Molon says not possible with a 10 shot group using a BA barrel. Molon only acknowledges a 10 shot or a larger qty group. Anything less than a 10 shot group is dead to him. Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: . . . ballistic advantage barrels . . . they guarantee 1 MOA or less . . . https://app.box.com/shared/static/nrxjte8ebsaubcnjwd3kcw1lj6wrj2xc.jpg .... I don't get it. Is 1 MOA impossible for a barrel of that quality? Genuinely curious because I have never used their barrels. Molon says not possible with a 10 shot group using a BA barrel. Molon only acknowledges a 10 shot or a larger qty group. Anything less than a 10 shot group is dead to him. It's easy to get a good 3 shot group. Especially if you shoot a couple groups in a row. BA's accuracy gaurantee just isn't much of a warranty. All the 10 shot groups I've seen from BA were well over 1 MOA. Even better than a 10 shot group is 3 consecutive 10 shot groups. That will really show you what a barrel is consistently capable of. |
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Molon says not possible with a 10 shot group using a BA barrel. Molon only acknowledges a 10 shot or a larger qty group. Anything less than a 10 shot group is dead to him. Quoted:
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. . . ballistic advantage barrels . . . they guarantee 1 MOA or less . . . https://app.box.com/shared/static/nrxjte8ebsaubcnjwd3kcw1lj6wrj2xc.jpg .... I don't get it. Is 1 MOA impossible for a barrel of that quality? Genuinely curious because I have never used their barrels. Molon says not possible with a 10 shot group using a BA barrel. Molon only acknowledges a 10 shot or a larger qty group. Anything less than a 10 shot group is dead to him. The other thing is that there are just over 87 variables which effect accuracy and barrel quality is just one of them. I'm always skeptical of ANY accuracy guarantee. |
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I think you should take RogueNathan up on his offer. He is so confident that his Faxon barrel will meet your needs that he encourages you post your results. That tells me that he is sure that you will be completely satisfied with his product. That and the fact that he is personable and seems to be a stand-up guy, he deserves a chance. I believe I'm in good hands. My reviews and/or recommendations are always honest and not sugar-coated. I'm on nobody's payroll.  . Sure, Walther can be plan B, but with the company's claim that, "your satisfaction is of the utmost importance to us and we will not rest until you have it", I think I'll be able to stick with plan A. I'm excited! I calculatd the build with scope (1lb 13.8 oz scope & mount(piggy)) will be around 7lbs.
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That and the fact that he is personable and seems to be a stand-up guy, he deserves a chance. I believe I'm in good hands. My reviews and/or recommendations are always honest and not sugar-coated. I'm on nobody's payroll. . Sure, Walther can be plan B, but with the company's claim that, "your satisfaction is of the utmost importance to us and we will not rest until you have it", I think I'll be able to stick with plan A. I'm excited! I calculatd the build with scope (1lb 13.8 oz scope & mount(piggy)) will be around 7lbs.Quoted:
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I think you should take RogueNathan up on his offer. He is so confident that his Faxon barrel will meet your needs that he encourages you post your results. That tells me that he is sure that you will be completely satisfied with his product. That and the fact that he is personable and seems to be a stand-up guy, he deserves a chance. I believe I'm in good hands. My reviews and/or recommendations are always honest and not sugar-coated. I'm on nobody's payroll. . Sure, Walther can be plan B, but with the company's claim that, "your satisfaction is of the utmost importance to us and we will not rest until you have it", I think I'll be able to stick with plan A. I'm excited! I calculatd the build with scope (1lb 13.8 oz scope & mount(piggy)) will be around 7lbs.Personable? I will give you the barrel if you call my wife and tell her that.
The GUNNERs are back in-stock as of yesterday. Give me a buzz and I'll get that order in. |
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Personable? I will give you the barrel if you call my wife and tell her that.
The GUNNERs are back in-stock as of yesterday. Give me a buzz and I'll get that order in. Quoted:
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I think you should take RogueNathan up on his offer. He is so confident that his Faxon barrel will meet your needs that he encourages you post your results. That tells me that he is sure that you will be completely satisfied with his product. That and the fact that he is personable and seems to be a stand-up guy, he deserves a chance. I believe I'm in good hands. My reviews and/or recommendations are always honest and not sugar-coated. I'm on nobody's payroll. . Sure, Walther can be plan B, but with the company's claim that, "your satisfaction is of the utmost importance to us and we will not rest until you have it", I think I'll be able to stick with plan A. I'm excited! I calculatd the build with scope (1lb 13.8 oz scope & mount(piggy)) will be around 7lbs.Personable? I will give you the barrel if you call my wife and tell her that.
The GUNNERs are back in-stock as of yesterday. Give me a buzz and I'll get that order in. She's a girl.... Probably wouldn't go so well if she called your wife and said nice things about you. |
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I had been watching them for a couple of years. Either the sale price was still to high for me, or they were sold out, so I gave up on that. Quoted:
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My budget cap is $300. Just wait patiently for the next LaRue sale and get a PredatAR barrel. sub-moa accuracy and light weight. That said I also have a faxon pencil barrel and a BA barrel in my .308. I had been watching them for a couple of years. Either the sale price was still to high for me, or they were sold out, so I gave up on that. Well worth the wait if you are still waiting. $225 is a steal for this LaRue Barrel. |
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I would also recommend the Faxon Gunner. Excellent quality and the profile is just about perfect. I have a 16" Gunner and it's the best pointing AR I own. I hope to get some 100 plus yard shooting in soon, but I'm waiting on some better optics.
When I was looking for barrels for my latest build, Faxon and Micro-MOA were the only two companies to respond to my multiple questions within minutes of asking. A couple others may have gotten around to it eventually but none were as quick or as professional. They also never over-sold me on sub MOA guarantees. They simply assured me If I wasn't satisfied with the quality and performance of the barrel they would make it right. Respect and customer service go a long way for me. Both these companies have done it right and have earned my future business. Here is a thread about the Faxon barrels. http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_3_12/660604_Faxon_Firearms_Barrels__NOW_with_Results_in_OP.html |
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