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Posted: 11/10/2003 1:44:32 PM EDT
Come give it to me. Which is best AR and why !?!
Link Posted: 11/10/2003 2:23:51 PM EDT
I vote no more on this question!
Link Posted: 11/10/2003 2:30:11 PM EDT
BM or Colt...BM because I hate Colt. But better than those two: Armalite...Because they produced ARs first and have been doing it the longest, and they are really expensive, so they gotta be good right? Well no, but if any company was going to give me a gun, I would pick an Armalite.
Link Posted: 11/10/2003 4:22:23 PM EDT
If it's not a Colt, it's just a copy! Quality makes it a Colt! If you're spending that much, may as well get a Colt. If you want a cheaper product that's almost as good, get the RRA or DPMS. The price between Colt, Bushmaster & Armalite isn't big enough to draw a distinction, but the horsey looks cooler than the snake, and Armalite's pegasus just isn't Manly enough.
Link Posted: 11/10/2003 5:23:46 PM EDT
I'm new to AR's, But aren't Colt's a Copy (from Armalite)?
Originally Posted By NightOwl: If it's not a Colt, it's just a copy!
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Link Posted: 11/10/2003 8:32:25 PM EDT
OUCH!!! That's going to leave a mark!
Link Posted: 11/11/2003 4:54:01 AM EDT
Colt was contracted to mass-produce the M16 for the army using Armalites design. So ya I colt is kinda a coppy, but so are all the others.
Link Posted: 11/11/2003 7:42:39 AM EDT
Colt's are only more valuable to those who value Colt's. [rolleyes]
Link Posted: 11/11/2003 7:48:48 AM EDT
I vote for Colt! :-)
Link Posted: 11/11/2003 4:38:57 PM EDT
Armalite...Because they produced ARs first and have been doing it the longest, and they are really expensive, so they gotta be good right?
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The current ArmaLite company has no connection, other than the name they purchased from a tool and die company in the Philippines, to the ArmaLite Division of Fairchild Aircraft Corporation. The Eagle Arms Company in Illinois purchased the ArmaLite [i]name[/i] and changed their corporate name to ArmaLIte. That's it. Eagle and ArmaLite are late comers to the AR15 field as is everyone except Colt's. ArmaLite makes a fine second tier AR15 rifle. Only first tier rifles are Bushmaster and Colt's. ArmaLite (and previous Eagle Arms) are a close third place. Everything else remains off the radar unless you really, really know what to look for. -- Chuck
Link Posted: 11/11/2003 4:58:37 PM EDT
One of each has worked well for me. They're both great guns.
Link Posted: 11/11/2003 6:31:32 PM EDT
Originally Posted By cecil-1: I'm new to AR's, But aren't Colt's a Copy (from Armalite)?
Originally Posted By NightOwl: If it's not a Colt, it's just a copy!
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The line ("if it's not a Colt, it's just a copy") is from an old Colt ad :) But, there's a difference between buying a design and manufacturing it vs just copying what someone else owns. Armalite designed a rifle, then sold the design when they couldn't make the numbers. The fact that the company with their name now sells the design they sold off isn't really a point in their favor, is it? I mean, if Colt sued them to get the money back (that Colt paid for licensing), would they be wrong? :) Of course, it's not the same company (Armalite) so that's silly. Just as silly as giving Armalite credit for the design.
Link Posted: 11/11/2003 7:39:51 PM EDT
I don't believe anyone ever gave the current ARMALITE company credit for the design. BUT Colt did not create the design either... therefore it is a COPY.Just like Bushmaster,RRA and every one else. I'm not putting any of them down. I don't know enough about all of them to do so. But I can't understand why alot of people on this board have the mindset that if it's NOT a colt it's somehow inferior.
Originally Posted By NightOwl: ]
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The line ("if it's not a Colt, it's just a copy") is from an old Colt ad :) But, there's a difference between buying a design and manufacturing it vs just copying what someone else owns. Armalite designed a rifle, then sold the design when they couldn't make the numbers. The fact that the company with their name now sells the design they sold off isn't really a point in their favor, is it? I mean, if Colt sued them to get the money back (that Colt paid for licensing), would they be wrong? :) Of course, it's not the same company (Armalite) so that's silly. Just as silly as giving Armalite credit for the design.
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Link Posted: 11/11/2003 7:44:45 PM EDT
I would definitely go with Bushmaster. I have shot both a Colt and a Bushmaster. They were identical in most respects; A2 sights, 16' HBAR. The only difference was that the Cold did not have a muzzle break and the Bushmaster had an AK muzzle break. But the Bushmaster was more accurate. And as far as quality both were equal. But Colt has terrible customer service and are way more expensive. Bushmaster all the way. Colts are highly overated.
Link Posted: 11/11/2003 9:15:39 PM EDT
I think a lot of people were under the impression that Colt was superior because the government uses them. Colt is just a company that got a government contract to produce rifles. That's it. Since all makers have their own little "quirks" about the AR15, one may say Colt is the only "mil-spec" rifle. This is in fact imaterial. I own both. When I get $$$ for more rifles I will go with Bushmaster. Their customer service is top notch. Their rifles are also of excellent quality. Very accurate as well. I'm not sure you'll notice the difference between a Colt and a Bushmaster other than the Colt is over priced. Yes, I think that Colts are overrated as well.
Link Posted: 11/11/2003 9:33:36 PM EDT
Go with Bushmaster. Their rifles and customer service are top-notch.
Link Posted: 11/11/2003 9:34:06 PM EDT
Originally Posted By cecil-1: BUT Colt did not create the design either...
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No, they didn't, they just worked the bugs out of it and continued to improve it in the intervening years.
Link Posted: 11/12/2003 3:14:40 AM EDT
As far as a company being around, and making the better firearm.... I have a Colt peacemaker from 1873. I have never seen a Armalite, Bushmaster firearm even close to that old. Overall which company has been in the game long enough to work on QC at all levels??? [b]COLT[/b] Listen guys, the U.S. has used 99.9% Colt for it's M-16 and variant battle rifles. The other guys made barrels and parts here and there. Colt rules the AR/M-16 world like it or not. Now I like competition, so I'm glad the other guys are around to keep that going. The fact remains, the other companies are using Colt's R&D over the past 30+ years to work from. If Colt had put a can opener on the M-16 in 1975, and made it standard, you would have BM, RRA, etc selling you their version of that can opener on today's rifles, and we would have a group of people telling you how much better it is than Colt's. Get my meaning.
Link Posted: 11/12/2003 7:49:20 AM EDT
Now I like competition, so I'm glad the other guys are around to keep that going. The fact remains, the other companies are using Colt's R&D over the past 30+ years to work from. If Colt had put a can opener on the M-16 in 1975, and made it standard, you would have BM, RRA, etc selling you their version of that can opener on today's rifles, and we would have a group of people telling you how much better it is than Colt's. Get my meaning.
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I see them all copying Colt's feed ramps now. They also do the M4 barrel, but that's just appearance anyway. How many inferior copies of M4 Handguards are out there? Heck, the year Colt discontinued their lightweight carbine barrel, Bushmaster "invented" it. Also, as I said, Colt is more money, but it's not a lot. 50-100$ isn't a lot in this price range. Besides, Bushmaster should have better customer service, they've had a lot of practice! :) (My main experience with BM's customer service was when I called to ask if they offered replacement 30 round mag bodies, and the guy lectured me on how it was against the law and they wouldn't help me break the law.) I've helped my brother and a couple other folks work the kink's out of their BM's, mostly extractor stuff. My Colt M4 hasn't had a problem. I've used Colt's warranty work for a 1991, and they were quick, efficient and free, including reimbursing me for shipping to them.
Link Posted: 11/12/2003 8:06:07 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/12/2003 8:07:43 AM EDT by G-CODE]
This is a very good read [url=http://64.177.53.248/ubb/Forum56/HTML/000497.html]Looks like Colt's the best[/url] There is even some guy named "Tweak" involved in that thread.[;)] I'm a Bushmaster guy myself, mostly because Colt's prices are usually out of my reach. But that thread was a real eye opener for me. YMMV
Link Posted: 11/12/2003 12:17:40 PM EDT
Man, that guy gets around. [;D]
Link Posted: 11/12/2003 12:32:01 PM EDT
Current civy production Colt vs Bushmaster? Give me the Bushmaster. I've had both, no contest.
Link Posted: 11/13/2003 7:54:53 PM EDT
I DON'T THINK PEOPLE WITH COLTS SHOULD BRAG ABOUT THERE MILITARY SERVICE AFTER ALL THE GOV. GOES WITH THE LOWEST BIDDER. THE COLTS WE CARRIED WHEN I WAS IN THE ARMY WERE CRAP. I OWN ALL KINDS OF BLACK GUN AND I'M HAPPY WITH ALL. THAT MEANS BM, COLT, DPMS, ECT..... I DONT THINK THE WEAPON IS THE PROBLEM IN MOST CASES BUT THE SHOOTER. IN SHORT, BE HAPPY WITH WHAT YOU CAN AFFORD OR WITH WHAT YOU HAVE BECAUSE WE ARE ALL ON THE SAME TEAM. I THINK. ITS NOT HOW YOUR HAIR BLOWS IN THE WIND AS LONG AS IT BLOWS.
Link Posted: 11/13/2003 8:47:42 PM EDT
[lolabove][lol]
Link Posted: 11/13/2003 8:54:05 PM EDT
I would get Armalite, as they are, in my experience, flawless, and they use mil-spec fire control units. Bushmaster and RRA rate highly for me. Don't forget, Gentlemen, that FN now holds the military contract.
Link Posted: 11/13/2003 9:15:56 PM EDT
Originally Posted By NightOwl: If it's not a Colt, it's just a copy! Quality makes it a Colt! If you're spending that much, may as well get a Colt. [red]If you want a cheaper product that's [s]almost[/s] just as good, get the RRA [s]or DPMS.[/s][/red] The price between Colt, Bushmaster & Armalite isn't big enough to draw a distinction, but the horsey looks cooler than the snake, and Armalite's pegasus just isn't Manly enough.
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[flame]
Link Posted: 11/14/2003 8:13:09 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/14/2003 8:15:34 AM EDT by SP10]
I routinely shoot with 2 friends who own Bushies. They both have experienced FTF, boltovers, etc with their guns when they were new, using good mags and ammo. I've seen both of them go for the Leatherman to remove a badly stuck case. Both friends had problems just before we attended a PFDC carbine course, most of which were worked out as the new BM uppers they had purchased were broken in. The only (unpremeditated) jam experienced during our recent PFDC course was with one of these BMs. The 2 preban Colts used ran fine, as did a single RRA AR15.com LEGP. 2 of 3 BMs ran without a hitch during the course, in which ~700+ rounds were fired in 3 days by each shooter. The BM used by my friend Chris, which experienced the single jam during our night shoot, also has a tight mag well. He used Orlites, which are the only mags which drop free in his gun(!) Another of my friends, ICU on this board, took a new BM with a flattop superlite upper which was only sighted in just before the course. It ran fine. I think Bushies are generally a good gun, but I far and away prefer my late 80's, early 90's grey Colts. I've shot a fair number of rounds through my Colts over the years, and I've had virtually ZERO problems with them. I can't say the same for the few Bushmasters I've seen.
Link Posted: 11/14/2003 2:43:43 PM EDT
Colt.
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