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Posted: 10/18/2003 8:14:34 PM EDT
[#1]
Anyone know what this is and where it came from?? It came from the AR Gods !!!! [bow] |
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Posted: 10/18/2003 9:23:41 PM EDT
[#2]
The gas port is in the barrel not the upper and you haven't explained the barrel.
A1's were never built with M4 ramps so they must be cut-aftermarket ramps. |
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Posted: 10/18/2003 9:29:43 PM EDT
[#3]
I have a Colt factory C8/A1w/ deflector upper with M4 ramp cuts...
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Posted: 10/18/2003 10:19:35 PM EDT
[#4]
Quoted: I have an A1 upper with the M4 ramp cuts and the "4" stamped above the gas port. Is it an A1 upper or a C7/C8 upper? HINT: A1 uppers do not have brass deflectors. |
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Posted: 10/18/2003 10:36:50 PM EDT
[#5]
Tweak,
Yes you are right it is a C7/C8 type Colt upper with M4 feedramp cuts and the 4 marked above the cloverleaf... When I said A1 I ws refering to the sights - which is why I attempoted to clarify (but did not do a good job). -Kevin |
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Posted: 10/19/2003 4:03:31 AM EDT
[#6]
So, to answer 455SD's original question, can we assume that he has a C7/C8 upper, and that when he referred to the "gas port" he was talking about the cloverleaf that the gas tube goes thru?[:D]
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Posted: 10/19/2003 5:58:44 AM EDT
[#7]
YES, I was talking about the coverleaf. Cut me sone slack. It was late and I just spent 10 hours walking around the Tulsa show.[:D]
This may be a C7/C8 upper. It has A1 sights and the brass deflector but no C stamped on it. |
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Posted: 10/19/2003 10:03:40 AM EDT
[#8]
Quoted: HINT: A1 uppers do not have brass deflectors. I was issued a carbine that had an A1 sight and brass deflector. They were issued after we switched from A1s to A2s but before the M4 as we see it today (87 I think) |
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Posted: 10/19/2003 4:40:19 PM EDT
[#9]
C7/C8 uppers do not have the M4 feedramps cuts into the receiver nor do they hav ea 4 above the cloverleaf...
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Posted: 10/19/2003 5:30:26 PM EDT
[#10]
DPMS now makes feedramps on there A1 uppers
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Posted: 10/19/2003 7:19:54 PM EDT
[#11]
I remember seeing an ad in Shotgun News about two years ago for factory Colt A1 uppers with M4 barrels and extended feedramp cuts. They were offered by Hoplite I believe, but could be wrong on the vendor.
They do exist, though sadly I didn't pick one up at the time they were offered. Josh |
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Posted: 10/19/2003 7:42:25 PM EDT
[#12]
So what is the real scoop on this thing? Is it some odd ball rare upper or just some goofball thing Colt put out for a short while? I'm still not real sure what I've got here.
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Posted: 10/19/2003 7:57:17 PM EDT
[#13]
Colt made a run of M4 uppers with A1 sights back circa 1986-1989 mainly for the LE market. They marketed the rifles as having "Field Sights". Colt also sold some of the uppers as part of the early XM4 or Colt 723 project starting in 1985, mainly to NSW and SF. |
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Posted: 10/19/2003 9:05:11 PM EDT
[#14]
Kevin,
I know you know what you're talking about. I quoted 455SD cuz he's the one possibly confused. [:D] TMReich, That wasn't an A1 upper tho it may have been mounted on an M16A1 or GAU-whatever. The change in the upper from M16 to M16A1 was the addition of the forward assist. The "field sight" forward assist brass deflector combo wasn't standardized in a military until the CF got into the M16 game. Other groups had bought rifles with the combo but had never named them. 455SD, Besides the "4" (which can be faked) what are the other markings on the upper? Are the ramps shiny or anodized? Is there a mark on the right side of the upper forward and slightly above the ejection port? The extended, dare I say, "M4 feed ramps", show up on quite a few uppers destined for use on carbines. The faster bolt velocity of the carbine can cause low feeds, especially with "commercial ammunition", and the M4 ramps were the fix for that. Remember, nothing (configuration-wise) is impossible where Colt is concerned. [speeling] |
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Posted: 10/19/2003 10:32:57 PM EDT
[#15]
Ah, here's one now, dunno about the ramps or "4" stamp but here's the field sight, FA, BD combo on a 11" barrelled Colt Commando, RO733. The burst version of the RO733 is the RO735.
[center][red][b]CAUTION BANDWIDTH THEFT IN PROGRESS[/b][/red][/center] [img]http://www.civiliangunner.com/images/coltcommando.jpg[/img] [center][b]Note the A1 lower on this R0733[/b][/center] The upper used on the RO733 is the same part number as that used on the 14.5" barrelled Colt Carbine RO723 (RO725 with burst) but a different one than used on the field sight BD FA equipped 20" barrelled rifles, model numbers RO711, RO713, RO715, RO719. What do you think the difference between the carbine and rifle uppers is? Colt's PN for the field sight carbine upper is 64948 there is no NSN listed. PN for the field sight rifle uppers is 64603. Edited to make smartass comment more apparent. |
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Posted: 10/20/2003 6:19:57 AM EDT
[#16]
Tweak
Other than the 4 above the clover leaf, there are no markings whatsoever on this upper. The feed ramps are anodized like the rest of the upper. This upper had a Colt 16" 1in9 pencil barrel on it when I got it. I removed the barrel and have had the upper in my parts box for about 7 years. |
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Posted: 10/20/2003 7:01:22 AM EDT
[#17]
Quoted: TMReich, That wasn't an A1 upper tho it may have been mounted on an M16A1 or GAU-whatever. The change in the upper from M16 to M16A1 was the addition of the forward assist. The "field sight" forward assist brass deflector combo wasn't standardized in a military until the CF got into the M16 game. Other groups had bought rifles with the combo but had never named them. Tweak- The carbine I was issued was the same upper as the picture you posted but with a 1/7 14.5" M4 profile barrell. It had a forward assist, brass deflector, A1 sights and standard carbine handguards. I can't remember what markings the receiver had, but as I stated earlier, we called it a CAR15; we had also called the previous version the same thing. The only picture I have that you can see the carbine features is from 89. I dont mean to hijack this thread so maybe I should post it elsewere. |
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Posted: 10/20/2003 2:42:44 PM EDT
[#18]
I didn't get a chance to examine them closely but we have four carbines running around with A1 sights and M4 barrels. Policy requires either a Colt or FN and suspect that they are Colts. They've been around for at least five years or so.
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Posted: 10/20/2003 4:10:05 PM EDT
[#19]
When I went to the Colt Armorers School we talked about this issue. Per Colt ALL Carbine uppers now have the M4 feed ramps. ALL Carbine barrels now have the M4 barrel extension. The difference between Carbine and rifle uppers are the M4 feed ramps.
Colt did and does make a Carbine upper with A1 field sights, FA and brass deflector with M4 feed ramps. SAW has them in stock right now. |
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Posted: 10/20/2003 6:56:27 PM EDT
[#20]
green you are mistaken
i have had a A1 M4 colt upper with the m4 feed ramps cut buy factory i thought i had a rare upper but was not sure ...its about time this has been brought up. i bugged people forever on this but could never get a answer it seems the same thing is happining here . i edventually sold the upper to a guy named BOOM on the EE and he parted it out for more than i sold it to him for .. ive always wonderd what the oringinal story behind this upper was or if it had any value ? hummmm what would you experts on this subject say this is /or was to me was worth? [url="http://www.hunt101.com/?p=50557&c=548&z=1"][img]http://www.hunt101.com/img/050557.JPG[/img][/url] [url="http://www.hunt101.com/?p=50552&c=548&z=1"][img]http://www.hunt101.com/img/050552.JPG[/img][/url] [url="http://www.hunt101.com/?p=50546&c=548&z=1"][img]http://www.hunt101.com/img/050546.jpg[/img][/url] [url="http://www.hunt101.com/?p=50553&c=548&z=1"][img]http://www.hunt101.com/img/050553.JPG[/img][/url] |
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