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Posted: 3/20/2012 9:02:51 AM EDT
| To my considerable surprise I see that Mossberg is making AR-15's. Are they any good? |
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They're out of their element. They're using 1:9 twist barrels while the rest of the industry is moving to 1:7 twist, they're using hideous stark grips, and they're charging a premium price for it all. I'll pass. As much as I WISH what you say here is true, well, it seems the rest of the industry is still hanging on with 1/9. Mossberg in that regard is pretty much copying the rest of the industry. I agree with the other member who said good or bad their offering helps solidify the AR as a mainstream rifle. |
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They're out of their element. They're using 1:9 twist barrels while the rest of the industry is moving to 1:7 twist, they're using hideous stark grips, and they're charging a premium price for it all. I'll pass. As much as I WISH what you say here is true, well, it seems the rest of the industry is still hanging on with 1/9. Mossberg in that regard is pretty much copying the rest of the industry. I agree with the other member who said good or bad their offering helps solidify the AR as a mainstream rifle. Only the stragglers are still using 1:9. To walk into the market offering the same features as those being left behind is never a smart move, and makes them look like they did no market research. |
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Only the stragglers are still using 1:9. To walk into the market offering the same features as those being left behind is never a smart move, and makes them look like they did no market research.
Mmm... Bushmaster, Rock River, Armalite, all offer their standard rifles in 1/9 configuration. That is a pretty big chunk of the market. Ditto most bolt gun makers of the .223. I'd say they walked plumb into the middle of the crowd which I think is where they intended to be. Now, why the 1/9 is the standard, that is another questions. Seems stupid. But the history is clear enough. The only reason the 1/7 was adopted as the twist rate in the A2 were the long tracers intended as the SS109/M855 did not/does not need the 1/7. Then of course the long 70+ grain bullets came along later. I agree it seems any new maker should enter with a 1/7, but that they didn't is understandable given the market that exists today. Remember, most buyers do not care and many do not even know what a twist rate is... |
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Exactly, look at the Better brands, Colt, BCM, Spikes, PSA ETC, they are all 1/7 twist. Sorry, guys, but add Remington, Smith and Wesson and Ruger to the mix and the standard is and will be for a long time the 1/9. We can all wish it wasn't so, but being in the forest sometimes makes it hard to see the trees. |
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and begins yet another 1/9 vs. 1/7 useless thread. Yup. Can you guys even tell the difference when shooting if it's a 1/7 or 1/9? I'm guessing no. For the average Joe, 1/9 is fine, as most of us are going to be shooting the cheap 55g ammo. Unless you are shooting heavier ammo 1/7 isn't necesary. Most tend to want it as it's mil spec.....if that even matters to you. |
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Exactly, look at the Better brands, Colt, BCM, Spikes, PSA ETC, they are all 1/7 twist. Sorry, guys, but add Remington, Smith and Wesson and Ruger to the mix and the standard is and will be for a long time the 1/9. We can all wish it wasn't so, but being in the forest sometimes makes it hard to see the trees. You can throw out as many names as you want (Smith is 1:8), but how many people do you know own a Ruger vs. Colt? Remington vs. Colt? There are a lot of big names making ARs, but that doesn't mean they are a sucess at it. Smith isn't making its money off ARs, nor is Ruger. In the end, Mossberg won't be making hugh profits off their ARs either, especially since there is better out there. Regardless, we're way off topic from the OPs question. |
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Exactly, look at the Better brands, Colt, BCM, Spikes, PSA ETC, they are all 1/7 twist. Sorry, guys, but add Remington, Smith and Wesson and Ruger to the mix and the standard is and will be for a long time the 1/9. We can all wish it wasn't so, but being in the forest sometimes makes it hard to see the trees. You can throw out as many names as you want (Smith is 1:8), but how many people do you know own a Ruger vs. Colt? Remington vs. Colt? There are a lot of big names making ARs, but that doesn't mean they are a sucess at it. Smith isn't making its money off ARs, nor is Ruger. In the end, Mossberg won't be making hugh profits off their ARs either, especially since there is better out there. Regardless, we're way off topic from the OPs question. Regardless, you are wrong. My Smith is 1/9, and throwing out many names IS the gist of it. you intimated that the 1/9 was a dead dog, well, not to the lion's share of the makers in the US, and Mossberg fits right in. Not off topic, as it indicates Mossberg does know the market. Neither you nor I may buy a Ruger or Remington, but I think if you count the sales overall right now, both of them likely outsell BCM and Spikes. That is a guess, but those guns have tremendous market support and maybe it isn't your or my cup of tea, but the MARKET and Mossberg is the issue, and Mossberg simply looked at the market standard and went with it. Is it a good choice? Well, yes, for 99% of the shooters and 99% of the ammo being shot, it is. |
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NissanGuy08
You got it 100%! With over 90% of the bullets going down range from a majority of the AR's in use being 55-62 gr the 1:9 twist suits 90% of the shooters just fine. And yes you hit it right on the head it's the "I want to be milspec crowd " that pupu anything but 1:7" twist barrels!  So tell us 1:7" twist guys what percent of your shooting is done with over 62 gr bullets? I'd be surprised if it's more then 10%! Cause the sales of XM193, and Wolf. PMC etc say otherwise!
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I read a magazine article (sorry cant remember which one) but it had a write up about the Mossberg AR.. They said it was a good entry level AR but nothing special.
From what i recall, everything was pretty standard, for the money they are asking though, i would use it on a company that has been producing Ar's and has a better track record overall than Mossberg. There is really no reason to buy one as they offer nothing special from the other AR's in the market and the price isnt special either. Save your money, buy a S&W, Bushmaster, CMMG, or hell even DPMS for entry level. |
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