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Posted: 3/18/2006 4:06:13 PM EDT
I got loads of extraction problems with my AR. Anybody tried this? Does it really work that well?
Link Posted: 3/18/2006 4:12:38 PM EDT
Yes it works. Save your $12 though and just get an O-ring from Home Depot for .10. I forget the size but I believe it's a #60 you need. My buddy has an 11" Bushy. From day one it has major extraction troubles. I gave him an o-ring and it has been flawless for at least a couple thousand rounds since.
Link Posted: 3/18/2006 4:15:28 PM EDT

Originally Posted By YELLOWV:
Yes it works. Save your $12 though and just get an O-ring from Home Depot for .10. I forget the size but I believe it's a #60 you need. My buddy has an 11" Bushy. From day one it has major extraction troubles. I gave him an o-ring and it has been flawless for at least a couple thousand rounds since.



This may sound like a dumb question, but do you know anything about o-rings? That makes sense, but are there a range of sizes that might fit it, ie #50-#80? In other words its a long trip to HD and I would probably buy 3 or 4 different sizes hoping one would fit right.
Link Posted: 3/18/2006 4:17:00 PM EDT
Like I said I believe you need the #60 but I am not positive. I am sure someone else will confirm soon enough.
Link Posted: 3/18/2006 4:18:36 PM EDT
Did a quick search of the archive. Yep it's a #60
Link Posted: 3/18/2006 4:21:33 PM EDT
awesome, thanks! I'll definitely try that out.
Link Posted: 3/18/2006 4:28:33 PM EDT
Hell if it doesn't work you're out one shiny dime but I bet it will.
Link Posted: 3/18/2006 11:25:15 PM EDT
i would check to see what is failing in your rifle before adding stuff to it.


dirty chamber
bad extractor spring
worn extractor
cycling problems
bad ammo/cases

there are plenty of things that could be causing it and the o-ring is just going to cover it up for awhile.


check out the troubleshooting forum.
Link Posted: 3/19/2006 5:35:03 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/19/2006 5:36:02 AM EDT by jaymeister99]

Originally Posted By eklikwhoa:
i would check to see what is failing in your rifle before adding stuff to it.


dirty chamber
bad extractor spring
worn extractor
cycling problems
bad ammo/cases

there are plenty of things that could be causing it and the o-ring is just going to cover it up for awhile.


check out the troubleshooting forum.



Already have checked it all out. After shooting 60 rounds of Guatemalan (through a cleaned chamber) it started to have stuck cases, after cleaning it out again it was fine for another 30 or so rounds. But shooting Wolf and Federal AE it had zero extraction problems, but with old Lacquer coated Wolf is jammed right up. Winchester M855 had zero extraction problems too. So seems like the thinner cased ammo with high powder charge is what sticks.

As for the extractor, I have about 600 rounds through this, after examining the extractor spring, it looks ok.

Heck, for the dime it will cost me to try this out, it looks like the easy solution.
Link Posted: 3/19/2006 5:45:55 AM EDT
I likr tyhe F-Fender ring...but I didn't have any issues before putting it in (and certainly none after) It came free with my MGI Rate Reducing buffer.


No Expert
Link Posted: 3/19/2006 6:10:12 AM EDT
I ran a D-Fender for about 4000 rounds and it worked fine, as advertised.

However, if you run a good HD extractor spring like a Wolff or Colt you probably don't need one or need an o-ring. They are more of a band-aid than anything else. That said, it won't hurt to run one "just in case".
Link Posted: 3/19/2006 6:15:31 AM EDT

Originally Posted By jaymeister99:

Originally Posted By eklikwhoa:
i would check to see what is failing in your rifle before adding stuff to it.


dirty chamber
bad extractor spring
worn extractor
cycling problems
bad ammo/cases

there are plenty of things that could be causing it and the o-ring is just going to cover it up for awhile.


check out the troubleshooting forum.



Already have checked it all out. After shooting 60 rounds of Guatemalan (through a cleaned chamber) it started to have stuck cases, after cleaning it out again it was fine for another 30 or so rounds. But shooting Wolf and Federal AE it had zero extraction problems, but with old Lacquer coated Wolf is jammed right up. Winchester M855 had zero extraction problems too. So seems like the thinner cased ammo with high powder charge is what sticks.

As for the extractor, I have about 600 rounds through this, after examining the extractor spring, it looks ok.

Heck, for the dime it will cost me to try this out, it looks like the easy solution.





The extractor and spring may "look" ok but I would at least try a new spring.

I had a similar problem shooting Wolf, long story short........ a new extractor and spring solved it. Since then I put 920 rounds of Wolf through it without cleaning and had no problems.
Link Posted: 3/19/2006 7:00:11 AM EDT

Originally Posted By M4arc:
I ran a D-Fender for about 4000 rounds and it worked fine, as advertised.

However, if you run a good HD extractor spring like a Wolff or Colt you probably don't need one or need an o-ring. They are more of a band-aid than anything else. That said, it won't hurt to run one "just in case".



Do you know where I can get a Wolff extractor spring?

I just put the o-ring into my extractor, its insanely tight now, cant even budge the extractor to move. Dont know if this is safe.
Link Posted: 3/19/2006 7:07:22 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/19/2006 7:15:29 AM EDT by twl]
Link Posted: 3/19/2006 7:24:27 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/19/2006 7:27:57 AM EDT by jaymeister99]

Originally Posted By twl:
I suppose it would be the height of absurdity to suggest actually getting the device which was designed and built expressly for the purpose, which is the D-Fender.
And it has a US Military DTC certification for combat use.

However, at the expense of possible ridicule from the $1 crowd, I will suggest calling me and getting one sent to you post-haste.

Spaghetti-O's don't work well, although they are even cheaper than O-ring oil seals.
I'm surprised that some haven't begun ridiculing O-ring users for spending more on an O-ring than it costs for a whole can of Spaghetti-O's.

I heard the Army was using Spaghetti-O's, and they were sending them out in some sort of package that was called an MRE.




I always get a kick out of these responses.

Why dont people ridicule people for spending $12 on a D-Fender when a $2 spring or a $0.10 o-ring will do the same thing?

If the .10 o-ring I just got doesnt work then I'll spring for the $12 D-Fender.
Link Posted: 3/19/2006 7:35:28 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/19/2006 7:39:20 AM EDT by twl]
Link Posted: 3/19/2006 7:35:47 AM EDT
Are you supposed to use the spaghetti-O with some sauce still on it, or let it dry out for a while?
Link Posted: 3/19/2006 7:40:51 AM EDT
Link Posted: 3/19/2006 7:48:16 AM EDT
i use the d-fender in all of my rifles since they all have the mgi buffer and the d-fender comes with it.


i agree with twl, use what was intended
Link Posted: 3/19/2006 7:48:57 AM EDT

Originally Posted By twl:

Originally Posted By Painter:
Are you supposed to use the spaghetti-O with some sauce still on it, or let it dry out for a while?



I look for the ones that are "al dente", and wipe off the sauce and coat with CLP!



Cool- thanks
Link Posted: 3/19/2006 9:02:14 AM EDT
Link Posted: 3/19/2006 9:18:13 AM EDT
First off, before you go throwing 13 cents away on a Home Depot part or $12 on a D-Fender let me ask you the important question:

What is the make of your AR15 and more important, what is the make of the barrel, and then what's the length of the barrel?

First things first.....
Link Posted: 3/19/2006 9:37:53 AM EDT
The Home Depot o-rings are rated to about 200 degrees. My guess is they are ok for semi auto single fire shooting, but I did not test them. It would seem like the D-fender is worth it -- especially if you have one nice rifle. I would be more comfortable spending the money on multiple D-fenders if they told me what it was made from. For example, if it was made from the same material that a $35 o-ring is made from, then it would be a steal. I don't want to buy a lot of them if they are trade secrets because I am not sure what I am getting. I take nothing on faith.
Link Posted: 3/19/2006 9:49:24 AM EDT
I would try a chrome silicon extractor spring from Superior Shooting first. Might as well get a CS buffer spring and/or trigger/hammer spring while you're paying shipping.

PS, Superior Shooting is re-branded ISMI.
Link Posted: 3/19/2006 9:52:37 AM EDT
I don't see extractor springs.
Link Posted: 3/19/2006 10:08:23 AM EDT

Originally Posted By rsilvers:
I don't see extractor springs.

You'll have to call.
Link Posted: 3/19/2006 10:10:27 AM EDT
Are they like the new Brownell's ones where they are fine wire, or are they more like the Wolff wire thickness? If I coudl get the Wolff wire thickness made from CS, I would be happy.
Link Posted: 3/19/2006 10:34:29 AM EDT

Originally Posted By KA3B:
First off, before you go throwing 13 cents away on a Home Depot part or $12 on a D-Fender let me ask you the important question:

What is the make of your AR15 and more important, what is the make of the barrel, and then what's the length of the barrel?

First things first.....



I already threw away the $0.13, and I dont care! Its a DPMS CMP rifle. DPMS stainless steel cryo-freezed barrel (which I believe it is made by Wilson), 20". It also has a titanium plated bolt, carrier, and firing pin, JT match trigger.

Ive put up a half a dozen posts on this, and finally narrowed it down to an extraction problem.
Link Posted: 3/19/2006 10:37:37 AM EDT

Originally Posted By jaymeister99:
I already threw away the $0.13, and I dont care! Its a DPMS CMP rifle. DPMS stainless steel cryo-freezed barrel (which I believe it is made by Wilson), 20". It also has a titanium plated bolt, carrier, and firing pin, JT match trigger.
Ive put up a half a dozen posts on this, and finally narrowed it down to an extraction problem.



Do you have access to another complete bolt/carrier assembly?
If you do then install it, headspace it and shoot it.

I am thinking that the plating on the carrier is making it out of spec and that's what's causing your problems.

I had the same type of problem with a chome plated Fulton carrier, swapping out the entire Fulton B/C assembly with a stock Bushmaster one fixed the problem.

Link Posted: 3/19/2006 10:56:13 AM EDT

Originally Posted By KA3B:

Originally Posted By jaymeister99:
I already threw away the $0.13, and I dont care! Its a DPMS CMP rifle. DPMS stainless steel cryo-freezed barrel (which I believe it is made by Wilson), 20". It also has a titanium plated bolt, carrier, and firing pin, JT match trigger.
Ive put up a half a dozen posts on this, and finally narrowed it down to an extraction problem.



Do you have access to another complete bolt/carrier assembly?
If you do then install it, headspace it and shoot it.

I am thinking that the plating on the carrier is making it out of spec and that's what's causing your problems.

I had the same type of problem with a chome plated Fulton carrier, swapping out the entire Fulton B/C assembly with a stock Bushmaster one fixed the problem.




I doubt it, it works fine with all US mil surplus ammo Ive tried, Talon, Winchester, and Federal LC. But unfortunately I dont have access to another bolt carrier assembly, so I'll just have to try my .13 o-ring before anything else.
Link Posted: 3/19/2006 11:14:45 AM EDT

Originally Posted By rsilvers:
I don't see extractor springs.



I see extractor springs. They're everywhere. They don't even know they're extractor springs .....
Link Posted: 3/19/2006 12:02:32 PM EDT
You do have access to a bolt and carrier think hard my little JEDI.
Link Posted: 3/19/2006 1:04:41 PM EDT
I had extraction problems with one of my AR's, but wanted to keep the rifle as close to the original design as possible. So, I opted for a Wolf extra power extractor spring. 1K rounds later... no extraction issues.
MB

p.s. or you can try the "O" ring thing.
Link Posted: 3/19/2006 1:08:38 PM EDT

Originally Posted By mb3:
I had extraction problems with one of my AR's, but wanted to keep the rifle as close to the original design as possible. So, I opted for a Wolf extra power extractor spring. 1K rounds later... no extraction issues.
MB

p.s. or you can try the "O" ring thing.



I'll try the $0.13 o-ring first, if that dont work then I'll add the Wolff spring, and if that dont work then I'll try using Baldsnapper's bolt assembly.

Link Posted: 3/19/2006 1:18:28 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/19/2006 1:24:13 PM EDT by twl]
Link Posted: 3/19/2006 1:24:06 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/19/2006 1:27:52 PM EDT by rsilvers]
My LMT enhanced bolt with the dual springs does not work as well as a Colt bolt with a D-fender.

Are you recommending them with Wolff springs or Colt springs?

Link Posted: 3/19/2006 1:33:55 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/19/2006 1:36:08 PM EDT by twl]
Link Posted: 3/19/2006 1:34:08 PM EDT
i have tried the d-fender ring with no extractor spring and it works like a charm, though i wouldnt do that on a daily basis just tried it to see if it would work. fired everything from wolf to federal gmmk's with no extraction problems.

i use my d-fenders with the std extractor springs that came with the bolt.
Link Posted: 3/19/2006 2:17:33 PM EDT
I now run a D-Ring in all my AR's and my M-16..
I had some extracting issues with my 7.5in M-16 and the D-ring fixed it..
Its cheap get the real deal!!!
Link Posted: 3/27/2006 5:01:05 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/27/2006 5:02:40 PM EDT by swenis]
To increase extractor reliability, would you all suggest switching to Wolff Extra-Power extractor springs or using regular springs plus a D-Fender? I hear that one is not supposed to use both - is that true?

Off topic, I know, but are the Buffer Technology recoil buffers worth the 10 bucks? I keep seeing mixed reviews.
Link Posted: 3/27/2006 5:56:09 PM EDT
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