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Posted: 11/9/2004 5:43:58 AM EDT
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I tried it as an experiment with some extra parts, just to see how it worked out of curiousity. I haven't had a chance to test fire it yet though. I installed it on a simple plinker rifle just as a test, I figure I can always go to the lighter springs if I don't like it. It did result in a lighter trigger pull, but I want to do some live fire testing before making a final judgement. You make some good points.... |
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I voted, Hell Yea..... Look at it this way, the folks that haven't a clue what their doing are more than likely gonna screw it up and then you'll make more off them fixin it....  IMO it works great for those of us that understand to FC systems of semi-auto ARs and do follow instructions to the letter. I have never had a FTF on any rifle on which this has been done, ever, and the mod has always resulted in a marked improvement over the "stock" feel, YMMV. My 2 cents, Mike |
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I dont agree its reckless to post the info. It seems clear and states a warning. If you can change the alternator on a car there's a good chance you have the skill to perform this mod. Sure there are alot of morons out there but to pander to them would make us no better than John kerry. |
| I went with "Not preferred but it works" mainly due to the fact that I hate reworking other peoples output. I dislike spending more time and money on someone elses' work that didn't take the time to do a quality job first time around. I don't see it as all that dangerous. Stressing material in this situation has minimal fall out. Certainly no worse than the fix for the Bitch Slap on an AK. |
| I've been shooting and working on guns most of my life. Well, at least the last 25 years. I would not alter anything. Just shoot it like it was built. If you don't like it, shoot it till you do. If you still don't like it, call me. I'll take it off your hands for ya. |
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I've done it on a couple rifles now. "Hell yeah!" There is nothing sacred or ingenius about the AR-15 trigger. Actually, it's pretty brain-dead easy to work on. As for the modification, it doesn't cost anything, and it can really improve even "decent" stock triggers. The polishing part is a little dubious as far as improving function, but the spring manipulation is very, very good. No ignition problems on any ammo, including XM193 and the South African surplus. In addition, I cut the hook off the rear of the hammer; I've found this reduces lock time perceptibly. Also no degredation in reliability. But, as for the basic 15 minute job, perform it with peace of mind! |
| All I've done on my last couple of builds is use a set of JP "light" fire control springs that I got from Brownell's. I used them with std. RRA and Bushmaster fire control parts and with the lighter springs the trigger pull was much nicer and felt a little smoother. I have had no FTF's to date with either build. The spring kit was a very small investment and very much worth installing. |
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"Good on any gun if you know what you are doing" I'm used to tuned triggers, and the stock trigger on my Bushmaster really bugged the sh*t out of me: grittier than sandpaper, loooong pull, creepy, etc. I did the F.M.T.J and I was a lot happier with my FCG. However, I didn't do it exactly right and wound up with about 3 or 4 FTFs per 1000 rounds (shooting XM193). That was my fault, being new to ARs and the internals of rifles in general, thus my choice in the poll. I've since switched to a JP Enterprises FCG kit. |
| I have the stock RRA A2 lower parts kit and the trigger feels fine. All I used was Militec-1 grease on the pins and it feels smooth from day 1. No creep, no gritty feel, etc.. It's just stiffer than my Vepr's 2-stage trigger but overall I see absolutely no reason for me to waste money on an aftermarket trigger for my rifle. |
| I still have it on one lower; the others I've upgraded to RRA NM triggers. I've fired a few cases of ammo (mil-surp + commercial) with that gun, and I've never had a light strike or any indication that the springs are damaged beyond use. Just because the springs are no longer "factory perfect", doesn't mean they're not "good enough". |
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Possibly could be dangerous if not experienced with AR The problem with the FMTJ is two-fold: 1. FCG parts are only SURFACE hardened. This means that after smooting out the mating surfaces of the trigger and hammer, it will feel much better - at first. But now you have two soft surfaces rubbing against each other. The great feel will gradually degrade until the trigger is worse than it was to begin with. 2. The weaker spring will result in occasional FTFire. If ALL you do is punch paper - go for it. If you will ever trust your life to your rifle - NO WAY. |
This is why you follow directions and use a mild polish intended for paint. Not valve-grinding compound, like a jackass did in chat. The point is not to grind through the surface hardening. Maybe it's more of an exercise in direction-reading abilities. |
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If you have the knowledge and "common sense", it isn't a problem. But for those weekend warriors types, that will try to clean the edges up with a finger nail file, don't even try it!! I replaced fire control parts on a lot of rifle that were done by their owners that were just UNSAFE to use. The first thing I would do is toss my custom AR with a Jewell unit installed and have them try it out. After a few pulls of the trigger they usually ask how soon and how much!! Stuart |
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I've done it in 3 rifles, only one suffered light strikes and that was because I was intentionally pushing the envelope on weakening the spring to see where I needed to be. Used a new spring and whala. Over 2,000 rounds later in all the lowers and never a problem. On a SHTF rifle (none of mine are), I would say polishing the engagement surfaces would be the sole and prudent modification, as it's basically a harmless improvement. |
+1 I have tried the 15 minute trigger job and was satisifed with the results. That being said I was skeptical about losing the extra margin of reliability with surplus ammo. For this reason I replaced the cut spring, repolished the engagement surfaces, and then simply shot the snot out of the rifle in question to smooth things out. Several of my range guns have aftermarket triggers, and so far they have held up fine. My SHTF M4 has Colt's upgraded trigger, but retains stock springs for reliability. It got through a carbine class without taking a dump, so I'm fairly confident that it's reliable. |
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Completed another F.M.P.T.J. Friday on my new Colt: took a 9 pound concrete pull and wound up with a 4.5 lb. pull that goes from takeup to SNAP. I shot it Sat. and Sun. with no problems; every empty case that I picked up had a solid, deep primer strike. Color me "Hell Yea". Now that I have another one under my belt I feel very confident I can do this with every expectation of excellent results each time out. |
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Color me over-cautious but on an shtf weapon, I'ld stick with lightly polishing the surfaces and not trim the trigger. On a paper puncher go for the whole deal. I might go with yellow springs but I'm going to start with polishing only on mine. It's a little heavy but breaks real clean already |
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15 Minute trigger job = buy Jewel trigger, installation 15 minutes! This trigger is AMAZING! However, unless you're already very familiar with the mechanics of how triggers work, the instructions leave a bit to be desired. While I had no problems it's easy to see how someone with less experience would have some difficulty parsing the poorly written instruction sheet. The adjustments on this thing are a thing of beauty... easy to set the first and second stage to exactly how you want it.. Overtravel can be virtually eliminated, let off is consistent and predictable I've always used Jewel triggers on my ground hog sniper guns so when I saw one available for the AR.... had to have it. Worth every penny (bought from a board sponsor, $174 shipped. |
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Put me down for a "hell yeah!" I didn't polish engagement surfaces, but I just did my second spring cut job. Not that I won't, I just didn't have time to clean everything up before the wife got home and gave me the "Jeez, do you do anything else around here other than f**k with those guns?" routine. Second lower I've done this two. No FTF's on the first, and there's a set of springs in the grip in case some insurrgents invade Gilbert and I need a 'go to gun' (or I'll just grab a different gun.......I guess it just depends where I'm at in the house when the Morman uprising occurs!) 
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Hey! We're married to the same friggin woman!!!!!! |
p.s. I named my first trigger job hairy and scary before replacing. 
Not true. I have them on my gun and will get a light strike once every 200-300 rounds. They're great for a weekend gun but not something to be used on a rifle your life might depend on. Here's the way I see it. The AR trigger was designed for a single reason: reliability with almost any type of ammo. Almost anything that reduces the power of the springs will to one degree or another have an impact on the reliability. For those of you not familiar with the JP springs, they're reduced power trigger and hammer springs. They do a similar thing as the 15 minute trigger job by bringing the trigger weight down to around 6 lbs. |
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