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Posted: 5/26/2004 3:45:25 PM EDT
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First off, sorry for not being able to find a FAQ on this, as I am sure there is one. I have been lurking for a while so as to not ask a dumb ass question, but have reached my limits on searching the archives here for answers. I am buying first AR-15 and have a budget in the $800-900 range. I am in WA state, so no dumb bans on mag capacity, but really don't care too much about scopes and accessories I can add later (or buy more guns to accomodate as this will probably not be my only AR in the long haul). I will almost certainly be buying used because I don't see the point in paying the new rifle premium here. 1st Q: Are there any reasons to buy new that I don't know about? 2nd Q: Kit or whole gun? I am military trained on general field maitenance and assembly of M16 and other personal weapons, but am not sure of the civvy marketplace/compatability issues. 3rd Q: Do I wait for Sept and see if the AWB sunsets or buy now? (usual problem: I want it now!) 4th Q: Do I buy Basic A2 config or go along lines of 16" M4? I am looking for basic battle rifle/carbine for plinking and general home defense (I like handguns too, but a carbine beats a handgun any day). Maybe varminting, but I have a .22-250 that does varmints in just fine (also other hunting rifles and shotguns, so this part isn't really an issue). Anyway: A2 Handguard and sights? A3? A4 rail? Straight stock or M4 type? 16" or 20"? Just want advice from the guys who have been around a while and can tell me what they wish they did 1st time around. 5th Q: Everyone says ABCs for brand. Can't afford the Colt premium, and RRA and Oly seem to be a LOT cheaper. Does cheap = crap? I know to go forged not cast. Any advice from the AR-15 guru's here? Thanks in advance. Scrum |
| nothing wrong with RRA or Oly (just don't get the oly 'plinker' model). only cheap brand to avoid is Hesse/vulcan arms. for 8-900 you should be able to find a used preban AR here on the Equipment Exchange or in a local shop. if preban status isn't that important to you then i would buy a lower through a dealer and then find a nice used upper on the EE. for 8-900 you could buy a rifle, 500rds of ammo, and a few mags. |
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link deleted They have really great AR uppers and parts! Also their customer service can not be beat! Try www.cmmginc.com Unless you are interrested in japanese porn  Aimless
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I'm a newbie but I did my homework, read a lot of AR-15.com threads, and asked questions and I ended up getting exactly the right rifle for my first AR. The one bit of advice I would give would be to go with a flat-top. It will cost a bit more (@$100.00) for a quality detachable handguard but it will give you so many options over the standard A2 upper. I LOVE the traditional look of the carry handle and almost went with an A2 and I'm SO thankful I didn't. Even though the handle stays on 100% of the time right now I see an Eotech or Aimpoint somewhere in my future and that will be much easier with the handle removed. |
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Scrum, I was in your position 4 months ago, trying to decide what to buy and wanted to stay within reason, being this was my first AR. I really had been looking for more than a year and took every opportunity to shoot all of the different AR's I could. I found there are a number of good AR's out there and you can spend many a dollar on some of them. The Wilson's and Baer's are approaching the 2-grand mark, and I am just not convienced they are worth it. Not that they are not fine rifles, but I do not feel the extra $800 to $1100 are worth it. I narrowed my search to the Bushmaster and Rock River Arms. I already owned a RRA 1911 Basic Liminted Match and I can assure this pistol is by far superior to the Wilson and Baer's, without a doubt. I may not know AR's well, but I can really hold my own on handguns. I setteled on the RRA A4 with a 20" barrel, Weaver Gas Block and free float aluminum handgaurd. I purchsaed the RRA National Match, which I highly suggest, the two-stage trigger is outstanding, from my local dealer and I ordered the upper directly from RRA. Total invested with shipping is around $850. On top I mounted a Nikon 3.3-10x44AO scope in a RRA high mount. The rifle shoots out of this world. The fit and finish is great and the feel and balance are just right. The RRA folks are great to work with and Robert S. in the AR department will answer any question you have. I will never buy any other brand of AR. I know this is strong words for a new AR owner, but I am just that satisfied. You will not go wrong. They just received a major government contract with the DEA and I believe the FBI-and these guys do not buy cheap stuff, after all they are spending our money. 77Bronc |
| If you shop around you could find a couple different Colt configurations for about $900 - $950 new. If you do some research you may come to the conclusion that the Colts are of consistent top quality. The premium is not for just the name. Many brands would serve well and I'm not trying to add to or start any brand wars. This is just what I've found. I was going to get a Bushmaster, nothing wrong with that, but for about $100 more I felt the Colt was certainly worth it. |
| My main advice would be to get a flat top so you leave options open to yourself later (most people I know that buy an A2 as a first purchase, change to an A3 within six months or wish they had bought an A3). Buy some mags and a lot of ammo, shoot your gun a lot, then think about accessorizing it. |
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go to www.adcofirearms.com... I would highly recomend RRA for your AR.... i would strongly suggest looking into a RRA 16" midlength, chromelined, govt. profile barrel... 16" will allow you to easily round corners while being long enough for longer shots... its perfect... go with a flattop, standard trigger, Daniels defense midlength... kac covers etc... Buy a preban so at some later date you can have someone drill it out and add a Flash suppressor... look into getting a collapsible stock aswell when the ban goes... also... i would strongly point you in the direction of the tango down battle grip... a beautiful piece of work... if you don't want rails go with the R4 (m4) rra handguards... i just got some shipped to me for free and they are nice handguards... i would encourage you to look into rails because some where down the line if your still into AR's you'll wish you had them... feel free to email me if you have any questions you'd like my thoughts on... good luck! and take your time... don't rush into anything... |
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1st Q: Are there any reasons to buy new that I don't know about? -used is fine if it's in good shape 2nd Q: Kit or whole gun? I am military trained on general field maitenance and assembly of M16 and other personal weapons, but am not sure of the civvy marketplace/compatability issues. -look at kits from J&T the upper comes assembled, you purchase a lower separately and assemble that, this should not present a challenge for you, unfortunately I think their m4 is the only one offered with a chrome lining, but if you want an m4 then that'd be a good choice Also by buying the upper and lower separately you save the excise tax on assembled guns. Eagle firearms has good deals on assembled bushmaster lowers, then you could buy your upper elsewhere. Carricoz armory also has inexpensive assembled lowers, I have no experience with them but would gamble on one. Carricoz armory is also a good source for a mega stripped lower if you build your own. Cav arms sells plastic lowers that are available from various dealers, cavarms could tell you where to get them. I have several of these and they are much lighter and have held up just fine for me. 3rd Q: Do I wait for Sept and see if the AWB sunsets or buy now? (usual problem: I want it now!) -get it now, you can live without the bayo lug and collapsing stock, the flash suppressor would be useful but you can add that later fairly cheaply 4th Q: Do I buy Basic A2 config or go along lines of 16" M4? I am looking for basic battle rifle/carbine for plinking and general home defense (I like handguns too, but a carbine beats a handgun any day). Maybe varminting, but I have a .22-250 that does varmints in just fine (also other hunting rifles and shotguns, so this part isn't really an issue). Anyway: A2 Handguard and sights? A3? A4 rail? Straight stock or M4 type? 16" or 20"? Just want advice from the guys who have been around a while and can tell me what they wish they did 1st time around. -get one with a removable carry handle, don't worry about the collapsible stock because you can't get one until Sept anyway get a regular stock. Don't worry about rails and that crap until later. 5th Q: Everyone says ABCs for brand. Can't afford the Colt premium, and RRA and Oly seem to be a LOT cheaper. Does cheap = crap? I know to go forged not cast. RRA seems to be up to acceptable quality now, personally I would make sure I got one with a chrome lined barrell. ADCO is a good source. Some people love Oly, I still see reports of problems more frequently than with other ARs and there are still reports of customer service problems. |
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I'm certainly not a "guru", but I was in a simiialr situation with even less money. I was going to buy a JT or Model 1 rifle at first, but decided to save more and get something from one of the ABC guys. I built an A2 mid-length from parts from quantico arms and Bushmaster. Armalite/Eagle stripped lower Armalite A2 carbine upper Cav arms A1 length stock Bushmaster lower parts kit Total was under $800. I should have gotten a flat-top,but I wanted it "now". Getting sights for the flat-top would have cost a lot as well. $150 for a set of BUIS and at lot more for decent optics. I don't really regret buying an A2 though. I wanted to learn the irons first. Later on I can put a red dot in front of the carry handle or a compact scope on top. Or buy another rifle (SPR...mmm). If you buy before september you can always add the evil features later, for more money. Good luck with your decision. -GH |
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For your purposed uses.. I dont see any reason to wait , I dont see any advatage of a used preban . Go 16" barrel. Crome is a plus but of little matter. 16" is fine out to 75 yards and easier to swing. Flat top for sure. Later put an Eo-tech on it. If you think you can build it you can . Go read the build yourself GO HERE and then decide. My first AR was a The PCR-16  Previously an exclusive to a national wholesale distributor, the PCR-16 is now available to all dealers directly from Olympic Arms. The PCR-16 is a great new rifle. This unit is a low cost, yet very accurate carbine filled with great standard features. 16" 1x9" twist Bull barrel Free Float Handguard Picatinny Gas Block Standard Picatinny Flat-top upper Forward Assist and Dust Cover Assembly Match Grade Button Rifled Barrel Lifetime Warranty! These little 16" rifles will shoot sub inch groups at 100 yards, no problem. New in 2002. Compare to similar carbines from other manufacturers. More standard features, better accuracy, less money, lifetime waranty. The PCR-16 is the better deal hands down! MSRP: $712.00 I picked mine up $624.0 at my local dealer. I try to buy local first, then here. I would have liked to change the handguard out with a Firsh Carbine Length (7.125" in length): Part #F8R = $99.00 Its the rifle I use for local pistol/rifle matches and it always does its part better than I do mine. |
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Having recently received a box of AR goodies I definately suggest getting the Hogue grip right off the bat. I debated thinking it couldn't make much difference but I was wrong. Much more comfortable now. Also, if you are serious about accuracy and plan to shoot quite a lot, I'd pony up for a 2-stage trigger as well. If you buy a complete RRA rifle it will include the 2-stage trigger. I installed mine last night and it was definately worth it. |
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