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Posted: 7/7/2003 11:10:53 AM EDT
What are all the "levels" of Marine Corps rifle qualification(marksman, expert marksman, etc.), and what does it take to acheive each level? What size targets, how far, how many rounds...etc.? Thanks for any info.
Link Posted: 7/7/2003 12:01:14 PM EDT
I can only speak from the 1967-70 era. 50 total rounds fired. 10 from 200 meters offhand, 10 from 200 meters rapid sitting, 10 from 200 rapid kneeling, 10 from 300 meters rapid sitting, 10 from 300 meters rapid kneeling, and 10 prone from 500 meters. Each bull =ed 5 points. Each round just out of the black was 4 points. Each round that hit the target 3 points. Missed targets 0 points. Expert I believe was 240-250. Sharpshooter 230-239, and I'm not for sure, but I think marksman was 210-230. Don't ask what non quals got - it wasn't pretty.
Link Posted: 7/7/2003 2:01:05 PM EDT
M1AJon is dead-on. Good memory bro. Non- Quals usually went through the whole process of qualifying again, but if your in the FMF (Fleet Marine Force, regular marine corps, not bootcamp or special duty) that rarely happens. Semper Fi
Link Posted: 7/7/2003 2:08:19 PM EDT
Originally Posted By M1AJon: I can only speak from the 1967-70 era. 50 total rounds fired. 10 from 200 meters offhand, 10 from 200 meters rapid sitting, 10 from 200 rapid kneeling, 10 from 300 meters rapid sitting, 10 from 300 meters rapid kneeling, and 10 prone from 500 meters. Each bull =ed 5 points. Each round just out of the black was 4 points. Each round that hit the target 3 points. Missed targets 0 points. Expert I believe was 240-250. Sharpshooter 230-239, and I'm not for sure, but I think marksman was 210-230. Don't ask what non quals got - it wasn't pretty.
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Your math doesn't add up. You say 50 rounds total but you list 6, 10 round targets. I'd be interested in knowing myself.
Link Posted: 7/7/2003 2:50:28 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/7/2003 2:51:59 PM EDT by tivoli410]
I would like to know also so I can compare myself...but I need a new range, the one I go to goes out to 115 yards [:\] Anyone know of a good range in the Destin, Fl area?
Link Posted: 7/7/2003 4:28:08 PM EDT
Today's Known Distance (KD) course consists of shooting at the 200, 300, and 500 meter line. 200M-Sitting (5 rounds) Kneeling (5 rounds) Standing/offhand (5 rounds) Rapid (10 rounds)all sitting 300M-Same as above 500M-Prone (10 rounds) man-sized silouette For a maximum total of 250 points. A few years ago the Corps changed the value system to a hit/miss system for a total of 50 max points. I haven't shot that one. The last I shot it was still the 250 max points. The breakdown was; 190-199 Marksman (pizza box) 200-219 Sharpshooter (Iron Cross) 220+ Rifle Expert (The beloved cross rifles) Its funny but for some of our Marine Corps balls we wear the Dress Blue Bravo which incorporates shooting badges, you'll see some Marines wear their Expert or Sharpshooter badge and then you'll see some not wear any at all (to hide their shame). For someone who's had some practice shooting its not hard to do well. The KD course would be hard to duplicate at a civilian range because of the distances and also that we have Marines down in the "butts". A trench where the targets are and where you "pull butts"(lower the target cradle) and service targets. A human powered course! Its a good course and one of the things every Marine remembers and most share fond memories of, expect the pizza box of course. Cheers, PS-Way back in the day there was a term called "Maggies Drawers" for a Marine who couldn't shoot shit in a shit house. See the movie "JFK" they mention it about Lee Harvey Oswald interestingly enough.
Link Posted: 7/7/2003 5:00:14 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Lance1775: Today's Known Distance (KD) course consists of shooting at the 200, 300, and 500 meter line. 200M-Sitting (5 rounds) Kneeling (5 rounds) Standing/offhand (5 rounds) Rapid (10 rounds)all sitting 300M-Same as above 500M-Prone (10 rounds) man-sized silouette For a maximum total of 250 points
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This is still 60 rounds. If the max score is 250 points, that makes each shot worth 4.166 points?
Link Posted: 7/7/2003 5:33:32 PM EDT
Does anyone have a pic or link to the type of targets used?
Link Posted: 7/7/2003 7:45:32 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/7/2003 7:50:00 PM EDT by ooweberoo]
Thanks for all the great info guys! I assume the 500m target is a head/torso silouette? Does anyone know approximately how big the 5 point bull is on the 200/300m targets(2",8"...)? How about the 4 point area? If I can find the MOA of the bull, I can adjust the size to use on a 100m range. Thanks again for the info! Nathan
Link Posted: 7/7/2003 8:01:24 PM EDT
For information, you could contact a Marine Recruiter. I had a 3+ hour talk with one ( face to face.... ), and he told me all I wanted to know.
Link Posted: 7/7/2003 8:26:51 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Midiman:
Originally Posted By Lance1775: Today's Known Distance (KD) course consists of shooting at the 200, 300, and 500 meter line. 200M-Sitting (5 rounds) Kneeling (5 rounds) Standing/offhand (5 rounds) Rapid (10 rounds)all sitting 300M-Same as above 500M-Prone (10 rounds) man-sized silouette For a maximum total of 250 points
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This is still 60 rounds. If the max score is 250 points, that makes each shot worth 4.166 points?
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Correction should be made to the 300 meter figures to get a total 50 shots. Only 5 rounds sitting slow fire and 10 rounds sitting rapid fire from the 300 meter line.
Link Posted: 7/7/2003 8:39:53 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/7/2003 8:40:49 PM EDT by oneshot1kill]
Originally Posted By ooweberoo: Thanks for all the great info guys! I assume the 500m target is a head/torso silouette? Does anyone know approximately how big the 5 point bull is on the 200/300m targets(2",8"...)? How about the 4 point area? If I can find the MOA of the bull, I can adjust the size to use on a 100m range. Thanks again for the info! Nathan
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The bullseye at 500 meters is 40" high X 20" wide at the widest point and 10" wide at the head area. It's a waist up shilouette. Here's the specs on all three USMC rifle qualification targets; [left]'A' Target(200-300 meters) Standing, Sitting, and Kneeling slow fire. Frame 6'h X 4'w with 12" round bullseye(5pts), 24" 4pt ring, and 36" 3pt ring.[/left] This is taking too long, I'll just try to post a pic for you.
Link Posted: 7/7/2003 8:46:02 PM EDT
Trying to get the pic...hope it works [img]http://community.webshots.com/s/image2/8/81/57/43588157WVIPpz_ph.jpg[/img]
Link Posted: 7/7/2003 8:53:10 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/7/2003 8:56:10 PM EDT by Sunset04]
Do they let you bring your own scope to boot camp? by the way, to get that pic to work for me I had to goto this url: http://community.webshots.com/s/image2/8/81/57/43588157WVIPpz_ph.jpg
Link Posted: 7/7/2003 9:06:09 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Sunset04: Do they let you bring your own scope to boot camp? by the way, to get that pic to work for me I had to goto this url: http://community.webshots.com/s/image2/8/81/57/43588157WVIPpz_ph.jpg
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No scopes are used during qualification or marksmanship training and they won't allow any personal gear. Everything that you arrive with will be taken including your clothes and you will get them back after you complete boot camp.
Link Posted: 7/7/2003 9:24:34 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/7/2003 9:29:02 PM EDT by tivoli410]
lot 'o questions... How accurate would the results be for shooting at a target with a 6" bull at 100m to simulate shooting at 200m with the 12" bull? anyone tried this and then shot at a true 200m? Do I have that to scale right or am I missing a factor? If so then to simulate 300m at 100m would be a 4" bull right? By "sitting" you mean sitting with your legs in front of you and resting the rifle on your right knee...right? Also(haha they keep comin) how is "rapid fire" determined/judged? Edited to add: What is target "D" used for?
Link Posted: 7/7/2003 10:58:10 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/7/2003 11:05:43 PM EDT by Bugs66]
Originally Posted By tivoli410: Does anyone have a pic or link to the type of targets used?
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"You may commence firing when your Dog target appears" Oh the great memories! And here are your target pictures (see B-23 through B-29): [url]www.adtdl.army.mil/cgi-bin/atdl.dll/tc/25-8/Lstill.htm[/url]
Link Posted: 7/8/2003 12:05:20 AM EDT
Originally Posted By tivoli410: lot 'o questions... How accurate would the results be for shooting at a target with a 6" bull at 100m to simulate shooting at 200m with the 12" bull? anyone tried this and then shot at a true 200m? Do I have that to scale right or am I missing a factor? If so then to simulate 300m at 100m would be a 4" bull right? By "sitting" you mean sitting with your legs in front of you and resting the rifle on your right knee...right? Also(haha they keep comin) how is "rapid fire" determined/judged? Edited to add: What is target "D" used for?
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From what I remember hearing from my brother you have quite a bit of time to get your shots off, especially if you know what you're doing And I believe you sit "indian style"
Link Posted: 7/8/2003 1:55:20 PM EDT
And I believe you sit "indian style"
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Can't see how that would ever come up in the field [:\]
Link Posted: 7/8/2003 5:03:04 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/8/2003 5:28:23 PM EDT by oneshot1kill]
My first attempt to post the USMC KD target pic failed, so here they are again... First is 200-300meter slow fire, center is 500meter slow fire, and last is the 200-300meter rapid fire target [img]http://photos.ar15.com/ImageGallery/Attachments/DownloadAttach.asp?iImageUnq=14541[/img]
Link Posted: 7/9/2003 4:47:36 AM EDT
Wow, this really brings back some memories. In the immortal words of my Drill Instructor SSgt Hanalon (243 expert) "If we can teach a four-eyed, left handed Ecuadorian how to shoot, we can teach anyone", and how about those recruits doin' the "target shed bogey" for not getting the job done in the pits. Nothing like some mountain climbers to get a recruit motivated. Great thread. L'man (227 expert) [marines]
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