Posted: 3/27/2004 10:22:56 AM EDT
| Does anyone know of a website that offers just Colt Lowers for sale? I am just comparing different lowers and would like to see just how expensive Colt's are. Thanks! |
Thanks for the heads up. |
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If you want to buy a Colt, you are paying for the pony. As a Colt fan, most will want a gun that is all Colt. So if you buy a Colt lower and put other parts on it, you will really just have a kit gun...that could have been built on any lower. If you want an all Colt gun just buy one...or if you want an AR built your way any good quality forged lower will do. Good luck with what you decide. Kevin |
I have been favoring Colt lowers for my builds lately because of the lifetime warranty and hassle-free assembly from decent QC. I have had good luck with RRA lowers for the most part, but I've grown tired of filing burrs and dealing with out-of-spec dimensions in key areas. So far my Colt lowers have been flawless, which is much more than I can say for the others. From now on I won't hesitate to pay the extra few bucks to get a product that doesn't require modification to work properly. |
Same here. I have one more RRA lower left over which I am going to build. All the rest after that will be Colts. |
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Well I have never had any problems with RRA lowers so I still may go with them in the near future. Also, I ws considering a Colt lower, but now after this suit that they out on Bushmaster, etc, I have partially turned my back to them. Also, IMO, the last thing we need is gun manufacturers suing other gun manufacturers. As if our problems are not bad as it is.... They also have seemed to give up on customer service.  Besides, if all goes as planned, I won't be getting any Colt lowers. I will be getting LMT lowers. 
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This is one of the many reasons why I will never spend another cent with Bushmaster. This suit wouldn't be necessary if they didn't rip off a designation that is owned by Colt.
Says who? Have you ever had to contact Colt customer service? |
I'll bet he hasn't. I've never had a single problem with their customer service. |
Neither have I. In fact, the one time I sent a Colt in for service the problem was traced to an aftermarket (Bushy) extractor with an out of spec spring. Not only did they reimburse me for shipping but they also replaced the extractor for free. They also sent me a spare for my other rifle free of charge  It doesn't get much better than that, not to mention a turnaround time of a week. The rifle was three years old at the time, for what it's worth. |
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Sweet Jesus guys. I am not bashing Colt. And I am sorry, Customer Service was not the right word. I meant that they seemed to put all civilian orders on the back burner. They worry more about LEO and Military orders more than civilian ones. To me, their only "good" gun, in terms of them making them for civilians, is the 6400C. Everything else to me is just made of second hand military orders. And yes, I have tried to contact them about some questions on the 6400C and no matter how many times I called they never picked up, and the one time they did, the lady could not answer my question about what twist the barrel was in (this was before I found AR15.com). You guys need to seriously lighten up. If someone said something bad about RRA I would not do right to defensive mode. And yes, LMT, if they offer lowers, will be my priority over Colt. That is just how I feel. Edited to add: Yall need to open your eyes to all the gun manufacturers, not just one of them. They are all good and they all have their strengths and weaknesses. And don't say that Colt is perfect. They are not. No one is. |
This is precisely why I jumped in. There are many people here dissing Colt's service who have never even used them. It gets tiring to read day after day, particularly when they are merely parroting some mindless Internet BS. I better understand what you mean now.
I have Colts, several Rock Rivers, and a Bushmaster currently in my safe. How many brands do you own?  Most of us who are Colt fans have become this way because of our checkered experiences with other brands-and I'm no exception. I don't know of anyone who feels Colt is perfect, but they are typically far less imperfect than others. |
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While I only OWN a Rock River, I have handled and inspected pretty much every brand except LMT that I can think of. I happen to know a local gunshop owner fairly well and while I am there sometimes I handle what he has in stock (Colts, Bushmasters, RRAs, Armalites) and every now and then I see a Cavalry Arms and DPMS rifle. The only problems that I have ever saw were on a Bushmaster (poor finish on a part of the barrel) and a DPMS (loose connection between upper and lower). One time I openly compared a Colt M6400C and a Bushmaster XM15-E3S-M4. And aside from minor differences (upper marking, brakes, barrel length, and accesories like handguards) I could see no noticeable difference between the two. It was at that point that I realized that the reason Colts are more expensive is because you are paying partly for a name (and some other markings and accesories). Now I am not saying that Colt is not a nice gun. It definitely is. But since I have yet to see a major problem with any brand, I have no reason to only buy one brand. Not to hate on you too much CJ, but I think some people on this board are closed-minded and need to see that pretty much a Bushmaster is not that much different than a RRA or Colt. I do plan to get a Colt assuming that sometime in their future they start giving more attention to civilians and what they would like. But for now, there is no reason to get a Colt over a Bushmaster, RRA, or LMT. In fact, I think that LMT might actually be the new IT brand, stealing that from Colt. But that said, I will never only just buy LMT stuff, I do not believe in that. Spread the wealth, it is all good. Edited to add: I also do not appreciate VA's comments. Just because one has had nothing but good experiences DOES NOT entail that anyone with a bad experince is full of BS. I think we can all agree with that. 
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I can certainly empathize with some of this, but most people have fairly valid reasons for their opinions. My old Bushmaster went back for warranty repair three times before they kicked me to the curb with a rifle that doubled with alarming regularity. For this reason I swore I'd never buy another, even though I recently broke that promise and bought my wife a Carbon 15 "Lady". My customer service "experience" would have sent most people screaming into the night with a vendetta against them. For that reason I guess you could say that my gripe with them is personal, although I have still have plenty of things to bitch about with the slipshod way they assemble their products, even today. I have made a conscious decision not to post a review of my wife's new Carbon 15, aside to say that it's performance has been less than stellar so far.
It depends on what you mean by "not that much different". If you have a spare 30 minutes read THIS It is a frank and open discussion about the specific deficiencies of the various brands of ARs. Unlike most fanboyish discussions of this type, the people in that thread are some of the most respected instructors, armorers, and SWAT operators in the country. Once you get to the end you will see that there is a significant difference. What you do with that knowledge is up to you... |
What exactly do you expect? Civilian orders BEFORE military orders? Other manufacturers can do that, becuase they don't have military orders.
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Ok, I do not mean that Colt SHOULD put all civilian orders at first priority. They shouldn't. The military and LE officers deserve first priority. But, that being said, I still believe that Colt puts everything else on the backburner. Just because civilian sales are not top priority does not mean that they should not be considered as well. I am not an LEO, nor am I in the military, but if Colt is going to offer a civilian line to appease the masses they should at least modify, expand, or better their existing rifles. The only attempt to do that that I have seen is the M6400C. That rifle actually had some thought behind it in terms of "Hey, the civilians who buy rifles from us may like this..." To me, all the other guns are made from spare parts from military contracts. Do they even post on AR15.com? I know Armalite and Bushmaster do, but I have never seen a Colt representative post here. CJ - I am sorry that you had that experience with Bushmaster. But I think that experiences like yours are few and far between. Not to say that they do not happen but it is not that often. As for how they assemble their products, I have yet to see a poorly assembled Bushmaster. Maybe one day I will, but for now I have seen none. The only AR I have seen that is "slipshod" was DPMS described above. About that thread. I have read bits and pieces but not the whole thing. And while their opinions are good and should be respected I, as a non-civil servant, do not feel that everything they espouse applies to me. I, as a civilian, have the luxury of doing as I see fit to my gun whether or not a SWAT officer would do the same. Having their opinion on the matter, while a good thing, does not entail that it is their way or the highway. Some of what I have read I agree with, some of it I don't. I tend to agree with what Tim L said on the first page...
but I think that it is ALL manufacturers who let some lemons slip out. Now to put an end to all this. Nowhere did I say I disliked Colt products. Do I think their civilian-relations needs improving? Yes. Do I think their customer-service with regard to civilian products needs improvement? Yes. I am using a Colt carrier and H-Buffer as we speak so I am a valid believer in their quality. But I tire of certain types of people who think that one brand of AR (and one brand only!) is the ONLY way to go. Granted that you CJ are the resident Colt freak but you are not bad about it. Do I think you are obsessed with the Colt name? Yes. But you also have other ARs. I just think that sometimes the Colt name (at least in civilian matters) commands a higher price ONLY for the name. And aside from the 6400C, most of their other rifles are on par with other brands. And it is for this reason that I sometimes think the some Colt-only people seem to flaunt that all they have are Colts and are in effect saying "Look at me, I can get all Colt and pay the extra price and will never buy any Bushmaster-crap" It is the way some of these people come across that has led me to believe that people who love Colts and only buy Colts are in a sense, stuck-up. (I leave the 6400C out from comparison because it has other features which may account for some of the extra price.) Do I ever plan on buying a Colt gun? Yeah sure why not? I have nothing against their products. I have never and probably will not ever bash or talk out against any AR manufacturer because I realize that none are perfect. Plus, I have never had a bad gun period. I am only 19 and already have 5 guns, so I plan on having a substantial amount before 30. So by them I will hopefully have at least owned a little of everything. So please, let us drop this benign discussion. No one brand is the best, no matter how much you like them. And yes, I will get an LMT lower before a Colt lower IF they offer them based on Colt's over-sized FCG.
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Banal, tedious, and tiresome were the words I have been searching for When the mouth is moving, but the synapses aren't firing it's time to call it a day.
Thankfully it's our freedom of choice based on valid, firsthand, hard won experience that makes the human experience such a valuable thing to behold. Not to mention man's ability to recognize and overcome his innate tendency to rationalize whatever conclusion suits him, despite compelling and inarguable data to the contrary. Whether that ability comes as a constructive consequence of self-actualization or is simply a matter of him passing beyond adolescence and into adulthood is certainly beyond the cognitive reach of this discussion My personally owned Colts are more than mere range toys used to fill a void in a classically shallow and utterly meaningless existence. Three of them are used regularly as PD patrol weapons. They have been deployed in life threatening situations where innocent lives may have depended on their absolute reliability and quality. Perhaps if punching paper or harvesting an occasional deer were all I cared about I wouldn't mind relying on an alternative that cut a few corners in the interest of preserving an attractive retail price point. Once it was established that my needs transcended pure recreation my choice became clear. Fortunately I've never felt the need to toe the line or put aside reason to fit into whatever clique is popular on a given day. I'm quite grateful for that trait, because I'd be ill-equipped to live with myself otherwise. Seeking out such acceptance is juvenile and ignorant to a immensely pathetic degree. For me, the peace of mind that comes from a well-built weapon with a lifetime warranty is well worth the additional cost. Not walking around with a chip on my shoulder, or having an inferiority complex that needs to be assuaged (like a few of the more passionate Colt bashers and clone defenders) is priceless It's been a pleasure 
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Thank you. Finally, someone acknowleges that maybe, indeed, that even though no one brand is perfect (in the sense of never EVER having any problems with their products) that it is still ultimately up to the end-user to seek out and purchase that which best suits his needs and wants. The facts that some of your rifles see police duty (with you father IIRC (I remember when you first came to AR15.com )) is quite a commendable thing. But in a situation in which those rifles had to be used, I would be confident to use and or let someone use my RRA. Zero malfunctions and almost 2500 rounds down range. With that in mind, I would definitely say that their are probably many who would trust their rifle with their lives. And odds are those people do not all own Colts. And you as the Token Colt freak will realize, as I do, that a lot of people on these boards dislike, maybe even hate Colt. The reasons why are their reasons, not mine. But you at least have to admit that there must be something that has gotten that many people angry. I also agree with the statement that one who
is someone with no clear goal in mind other than to be the "first one on the block" to get the latest and greatest. This is once how I felt about Colt. I thought that people who bought them were only trying to get the best and the most expensive to flaunt that exact fact, that indeed they own the most expensive rifle on the block. But I also realize that to many, the Colt name means quality and legacy. And that I respect. To go back to the clique idea, I feel that LMT has just become that new "clique". The rash of people who are out buying LMT uppers (not the MRP ones due to their ingenious design), shows that most people do drop all reason and sense to get the newest percieved "best" out there. Personally I know of a guy here in town who for a couple of months has wanted a Colt M6400C. He had the Colt itch bad and when he finally got the money to get it he instead bought a LMT 16" upper and a RRA lower. That is the exact kind of case that I think of when I imagine these people who seem to get what is "hot" in the AR market at the time. All I ever wanted to see out of this thread was a Colt-only-lover to admit that, in fact, even the almighty Colt has a few problems every now and then and that the other brands out there are ok in their own sense. (I pictured Colt-people as defenders of the strong argument which, unlike defenders of the weak argument, rule-out the contrary.) Actually, the main point of this thread was to see if Colt sold lowers-only to civilians but that was answered pretty quickly.
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I still can't figure out why you would bother to troll the Colt forum just to get a rise out of a few other members? 
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Haha. You wish I was trying to get a rise out of you dont you?  If you think I am a troll you are far from the truth my friend. Very, very far. The original topic was to see if Colt sold lowers-only to civilians. It then progressed to a conversation about the merits and defects of Colt rifles. If you actually look into my last post you will see that I NEVER said I dislike Colt. And if I stated that I would actually like to see a Colt-owner say that Colt's products are not always perfect is that too much to ask? I love my RRA, but I openly admit that I am sure that they do not always put out perfect rifles. They have their flaws like many other AR manufacturers. Even though you may not know what I am talking about, I do think CJ does as he has been the one kind enough to carry this ongoing, interesting conversation out. |
I suggest you try this on the Bushmaster forum . You would be bounced and flamed in a heartbeat.
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More than likely. Because we all know die-hard Bushmaster fans are more rabid that the Colt fans and will attack with greater fury.
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| The above Tactical Forums thread and this thread are the reasons I have gone to using only Colt parts for my "social" weapons. RRA will still fill the bill for range queens, though. Don't even get me started on my experiences with Bushmaster... |
That's the problem, they are not all good. Some are better. You can use objective evidence and specifications to show who is better than the rest. Being a QC guy I go with ArmaLite followed by Colt as a close second. |