[ARCHIVED THREAD] - Stop Loss (Page 1 of 2)
Posted: 2/29/2008 1:37:30 AM EDT
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Anyone seen the trailer for this movie about (made by MTV Productions) the premise behind it is a soldier is about to ETS after going to Iraq and he is stop Lossed and decided he is not going Here is a link...what disturbed me the most is I found out about it as an advertisement on Military.com Stop Loss Definitely a political movie... |
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Message I got from the trailer I saw at the theater last weekend was "It's okay to go AWOL, soldiers, Hollywood understands!" Whatever. I've really had it with the "America/Republicans/Military/Oil = Bad" movies of the past year an a half, and this looks like it's gonna be yet another one. 
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I saw the preview when I was seing Charlie Wilson's war with my wife. Just as the theater went quiet I said "what a fucking pussy" in a somewhat louder than inside voice. Needless to say she wasnt overly impressed. I dont want to sound like a BTDT blowhard, but I have been there and have seen stop loss in action. This is a movie about the army but, as we say...U Signed the Motherfucking Contract. -BJohnson |
That is my problem with movies like this...it is as I remember a volunteer military right now also! |
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As someone who has stopped loess soldiers, Soliders on active duty view stop-loss differently based on a case by case business. Genrally, the guys who have a solid plan for life after the Army tend to get very upset. I had E-5s who had just finished up 4 years on active duty, and they had gotten in to some pretty big time 4 year universities (one was going to go to columbia). I had to tell them too bad we are going, and they all went; but many of them were very frustrated in that they weren't being able to transition. They did good jobs, but they felt they had gotten the shaft. Soliders who didin't have much lined up, were pretty accepting of their fate, but they did execute a "pro forma" "I got shfted" line for a very short period time. The soldiers who really raised hell and created problems were soldiers who were getting out for family reasons like trying to save a marriage or get better visitation agreements, and these guys had their plans flushed in a major way, and they were very upset. I am a "you signed the contract kind of guy"; but I understand the frustration on the active side about this issue. I haven't even gone done the rathole on just the soldiers who were supposed to move based on re-enlistment contracts that got frozen in place (a bigger headache). |
Agreed Jimbo, we need to look at both sides I guess and have some sort of compassion.. In 1990 I was headed for some very sweet orders that took a long time to get and I was called a few weeks before my transfer date and sent to Bahrain to wait for my ship (U.S.S. Missouri) for a few months before she got there...I was not a happy camper... So I can empathize with those that are frustrated as well.. |
| The guys who have given the all time worst stop-loss horror stories were the guys in Korea in 1990. I had soldier in the mid and late 1990's who had been in Korea when the stop loss oreder was given. They told me about guys who were on month 11 of their 12 month tour, and they were stuck over there for another 6 months. It wasn't pretty they said. |
| stop loss is extremely stupid and in my opinion, a violation of a contract. you sign that contract for a term of 4-6 years, not a day over. yet if you violate your contract with the .gov, it's the end of the world for you. then the army wonders why they have to enact a stop-loss policy. maybe if it was better for the guys it'd be a different story and people would actually want to re-enlist. |
If you have IRR time left on your contract when you get stoplossed it's not a "violation of contract" at all. |
Every service, active, guard and reserve has an 8 year initial contract. Bar none. And if you've stayed in after 8 years, you're a dirty lifer and probably want to go. 
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Understand the Mil side of it but also realize that it can present some serious issues for some of the guys it happens to. I'd suggest that it can be a crutch for poor planning MIL wise as it's always something they can fall back onto. Use it, but use it WISELY. |
What contract did you sign? You should try reading it again, specifically page 2. |
I think they're using the stop loss policy wisely. They aren't just using the stop loss to put random people in random units. They stop loss a whole Unit, Company through Brigade, depending on how much of the unit is deploying. That way you're not filling empty slots right before and during a deployment. On the one hand, you'll have some disgruntled soldiers deploying, on the other you''l be sending units to Iraq that are still trying to integrate and train new soldiers to the individual unit's SOP's. |
I highly suggest you read thoroughly any contract you sign in the future because you certainly didn't read your enlistment contract that you signed for a period of EIGHT YEARS. 4 on active, 4 in the IRR with the understanding you can be called back to AD during the IRR years I see both sides. The gov is 100% within their rights to keep every one of us for the full 8 years, after all we did sign the MF contract. That being said, I'd be pissed too if I had made other plan and had to stay longer against my will. |
Sorry, but the contract is for 8 years and clearly states that during time of war you can even be retained past that. Perhaps you should have read yours. |
You should see the 2007 version. It even has specific language targeted towards the whiners.  www.dtic.mil/whs/directives/infomgt/forms/eforms/dd0004.pdf |
That's what I signed in 2000 IIRC. |
The stop-loss is written into the contract, and you still signed it. |
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Well you used to be shot for desertion - I think Private Slovik was the last to be stood up before a firing squad at the end of WWII for desertion, nowadays all you get is a dishonorable. It's no wonder so many are doing it. The Roman Army would kill every tenth man in the unit where a desertion occurred (this is where the term "decimation" came from). This had the very effective result of soldiers preventing desertion of their comrades to ensure their own survival. That was a bit extreme but I believe desertion should bring at least a few years of jail time. |
Lawlz. I did pretty much the same thing in the theater before "The Other Boleyn Girl." I spent most of the trailer making fun of the horrible southern accents. |
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What kind of commie pinko shit is this anyway. When you sign the fucking contract they tell your ass in big loud ass words that your enlistment is for eight fucking years. Did this guy get stop lossed after he did his full eight years or did he do four and is now bitching that he has to do the full eight? Every time I here that actor say" I honored my contract and I expect the Army to do the same" I want to reach throught the screen and kill that guy with a grapefruit spoon" |
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In 91 one my orders for Desert Shield clearly stated ......Unless sooner released or further extended. No Stop Loss but then again that war was short in comparison.
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I was extended for a year in 1962 in Berlin. Then for a 4 month mission specific in 67. In 75 I had a sherrifs car come to my school, take me home get my gear and was at Ft. Ord the next day, I was in the IRR but my MOS was needed. I feel sorry for the guys nowadays to an extent and I feel that there should be a working appeals process. |
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FUCK that movie.... As someone who acutally was stoplossed and deployed (additional 13 months-thanks uncle sammy!) I didn't bitch or cry or fucking go AWOL....or slit my wrists like some pussies in my Bn. I can't stand all these movies....in the valley of elah, rendition, lions for lambs, stop loss, etc... Why doesn't hollywood cut the shit and make a movie with the terrorist as the hero where he triumphantly plants and IED or something and kills US Soldiers for the climax....that may be too honest for those shitpiles. |
ME TOO!!!! Well put brother! |
Hell Yeah! 
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Ah...that wouldn't sell tickets ....you know the whole blowing up service members and all...the media and libertards like to look at us a evil and mean but they don't (at least I hope) don't want to see us blown up... OK, ON MY PULPIT I CANNOT UNDERSTAND THE RAMPANT TOLERATION OF THE ISLAMIC MOVEMENT AND PEOPLE AFTER WHAT HAS BEEN DONE IN OUR OWN COUNTRY AND IN OTHERS!!!! Why is it that we (U.S.) is evil and they (terrorists) are just peacful people looking for peace!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! |
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I wonder how our World War II vets feel about whiny Hollywood "Stop Loss" films. Many of them served in combat zones or near them for almost 4 years straight without going home to see their families. This movie would have never been made in the 40's during the war, and even if it had, nobody would have paid money to see it, and local theaters would have refused to show it. Our country has fallen a long way in roughly 60 years.  |
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I got stop lossed 3 days before terminal leave. I had cleared my unit, the division and post. I had no weapon, no poisition at my old unit, and no prospect of one. I also had a civilian job and a wedding lined up. It sucked and I was quite pissed. When I signed MY contract, I was told the stop loss provision was for 'WWIII' and that if it was used, then the shit had hit the fan and the draft would be reinstated. So, was I lied to? No, but my contract was not ethically represented. If those contracts were written so well, then why did they re-word them after 2003? The implementation of the stop loss policy now is due to a failure to strategically plan. We still have 20-30% of soldiers who have not deployed and are finally getting orders. Stop loss is a stop gap that hurts the long term efforts of the military. It has been used, I feel, unwisely. Especially in conjunction with 15 month tours. That said, going AWOL is for pussies, and so is this move. |
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Everyone in the military today volunteered. Initial Military Contracts are for 8 years. (you even have to initial a box next to where it explains it in 2nd grade english) Until you have reached 8 years, your ass belongs to Uncle Sugar should he come calling. Sometimes even longer. If you joined any service after Sept 11 2001 and didn't expect to spend the majority of your time deployed for the GWOT then you're a couple bottles short of a 6 pack. P.S. Ask some WWII veterans how many days they spent deployed. And there was no internet, 8 channels of AFN, AC, DFAC's, Bottled Water, DVD players, MP3 players, Satellite telephones, DSN Morale calls, Comfort trailers, Burger King, Pizza Hut, Coffee Bean, etc. etc. |
My contract as I already had posted the page 2 says the same thing in regards to the page 2 aspect of the newer contracts...in fact I just downloaded one and read it again.. To many guys enlist without reading the contract then later blame the recruiter for not presenting it properly.... It is the service members responsibility to read the contract..no matter what the recruiter says.... When you buy a house or sign a rental agreement we read the contracts, so why not even more so when we are signing our life on the dotted line??? |
Sounds like there need to be legislation to protect soldiers who get stop-lossed. Like they are guaranteed any college slot that they earned before the extension, or legal protections in family court that they cannont be penalized on visitation agreements due to an extension. Similar to the protections that Reservists have for their civvie jobs, within reason of course. I am not a veteran so I'm ignorant, but that seems to make sense. |
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Well, here's the kicker; my contract wasn't for enlistment, it was for an ROTC scholorship. The stop loss provision was part of the myriad documents I signed. What I was told about stop loss wasn't by a recruiter, it was by a Major who had no idea what he was doing, just signing cadets up. Had I known, I still would have signed, but I'd like to have had it represented properly from the get go. Regardless, we were never informed that an involuntary recall could be done in conjunction with a stop loss and you could end up serving more than the total 8 year commitment. Folks recalled at year 7.5 and stop lossed for an 18 month tour are getting shafted. These are the folks that will tell their kids and grandkids to choose a different path, and that is a shame for our country. Eight years is eight years. I get that they have us on the fine print, but involuntary recall and stop loss past terminal contract date is unethical and should be illegal. |
You don't know what you're talking about so go play in the yard while the big boys and girls talk it out. |
I don't know how many times I heard the words "The ARMY has your ASS for eight years." I have never met a soldier who didn't know. Damn I went in the DEP did basic in 11th grade and AIT after graduation and they told my young ignorant ass. |
That is what worries me right there. The public at large does not know that a standard enlistment in any of the active services is for 8 years and that you can be stop lossed. I am guessing that is NOT clearly represented in the film. Correct me if I am wrong. Wile I was never stop lossed (I kept reenlisting) I saw it happen, but everyone it happened to, all realized that the situation was within the rights of the Gov. Plus we were going to war. They had signed and that was that. U.S.M.C. baby. This movie is one more reason we are going to loose this war in the streets of America NOT the streets of Baghdad. -------------- SIGH --------------- I turly hope that I am not one day sitting with a young son or daughter of 5 watching on TV, the last Marines leave the Embassy in Baghdad as My father and I watched them leave Vietnam. IPSC_GUY SIERRA II ALPHA |