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Posted: 2/1/2006 11:53:18 AM EDT
I have recently viewed the website of a city department in my state. It is a public forum style website like this; I do not believe that the site is sponsored by the department. The thread I read was filled with a heated discussion over professional courtesy. Every possible view point seemed to be expressed; such as cops should never write cops, cops should be given a little extra room over the public, and (the view out in left field) every cop should be written up. What bothered me were the ones who thought that wearing a shield/badge made them better. That no cop/deputy/trooper/ranger/etc deserves a ticket or to be arrested. I completely disagree with that.

Now I am not saying that I write a ticket to every cop that I stop. I have only written one or two cops in my day. But what makes a cop think he can drive 90 + mph in a 50 or 60 mph zone off duty and get away with it. I admit I have let many cops off who did something that I thought needed a ticket for. But where should the line begin and end when it comes to writing another cop a ticket. I would NEVER give a cop a freebie if they were driving drunk. The same goes for the guys in my department, friends, and my family. DWI never deserves a warning. Too many people have been killed by drunks.

I have been stopped twice since I became a LEO. I have never gotten a ticket, I was warned both times. I never flashed my badge or asked for a warning, I left it up to the OFFICERS DISCRETION. Had I gotten a ticket, I would have taken my lumps, paid it and moved on. We as law enforcement officers are not above the law. If anyone should be walking the fine line of the law it should be us. We set the example.


I just want to see what everyone else thinks about professional courtesy and where the line should be drawn. Should cops get a warning every time? Should we only arrest cops for the major crimes? How quickly should we arrest another cop?

Link Posted: 2/1/2006 3:26:24 PM EDT

Originally Posted By sballa25:
I have recently viewed the website of a city department in my state. It is a public forum style website like this; I do not believe that the site is sponsored by the department. The thread I read was filled with a heated discussion over professional courtesy. Every possible view point seemed to be expressed; such as cops should never write cops, cops should be given a little extra room over the public, and (the view out in left field) every cop should be written up. What bothered me were the ones who thought that wearing a shield/badge made them better. That no cop/deputy/trooper/ranger/etc deserves a ticket or to be arrested. I completely disagree with that.

Now I am not saying that I write a ticket to every cop that I stop. I have only written one or two cops in my day. But what makes a cop think he can drive 90 + mph in a 50 or 60 mph zone off duty and get away with it. I admit I have let many cops off who did something that I thought needed a ticket for. But where should the line begin and end when it comes to writing another cop a ticket. I would NEVER give a cop a freebie if they were driving drunk. The same goes for the guys in my department, friends, and my family. DWI never deserves a warning. Too many people have been killed by drunks.

I have been stopped twice since I became a LEO. I have never gotten a ticket, I was warned both times. I never flashed my badge or asked for a warning, I left it up to the OFFICERS DISCRETION. Had I gotten a ticket, I would have taken my lumps, paid it and moved on. We as law enforcement officers are not above the law. If anyone should be walking the fine line of the law it should be us. We set the example.


I just want to see what everyone else thinks about professional courtesy and where the line should be drawn. Should cops get a warning every time? Should we only arrest cops for the major crimes? How quickly should we arrest another cop?





I've been stopped many , many times over my career ( retiring this year ) I have always been humble and never showed up another officer. After all I was in the wrong however I think anything criminal is beyond courtesy.
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 4:10:09 PM EDT
I have been stopped two times since I became a Deputy seven years ago. Both times I was very polite, admitted that I was speeding, identified myself and was given a warning. I will admit to having mixed feelings on this issue (speeding - not criminal activity).

When I was in uniform, I spent eight hours a day in my patrol car going from run to run. The public expects an officer to knock on their door thirty seconds after they call for us and I always tried to get there as quickly as possible. This was also required to keep runs from getting backed up on us. When you spend eight hours a day speeding to get to runs it has a tendency to become a habit. I find myself driving above the speed limit quite frequently. It's not because I have no fear of being pulled over (I drive an unmarked vehicle now) but because that's what I have become used to.

In the six years I spent in uniform I think I wrote four speeding tickets. I would only consider writing someone a ticket for speeding if it was extremely excessive or posed a signifigant danger (school zone, residential neighborhood with children present etc.). The speed limits here in Indianapolis are 55 on the interstates and the average speed is about 75. Now that I'm in an unmarked I have found that it causes fewer problems if I go with the flow rather than try to slow everyone down.

I think professional courtesy is something viewed differently by everyone. Since I tend to have a laid back viewpoint on speeding, I would be more inclined to give a courtesy on this issue. I can honestly say that when you look at my track record, I have given a break to most of the people I have stopped for speeding, not just cops. I know officers who feel the opposite about speeding and would be less likely to do so.

I would never get an attitude with an officer that pulled me over, I would treat them with respect and hope that they do not write me a ticket. If they do, they do. I'm no different than anyone else. I myself would most likely not write an officer a ticket unless they were being a huge a$$hole.

These beliefs stop with traffic infractions. There are few things that piss me off more than LEO's involved in criminal activity. They damage all of our reputations and if guilty, should be paraded down the streets in handcuffs by those of us who choose to honor the oath we swore to.

I believe that as LEO's, we have few friends outside of our ranks and I do whatever I can, within the law, to avoid making any enemies within them. Just my opinion.
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 5:32:32 PM EDT
IMHO, the problem is not giving professional courtesy, but expecting it to be given.
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 5:35:33 PM EDT
Well, this thread should bring out some interesting comments.

Since becoming a LEO ten years ago I have been stopped and been given warnings, and once cited for speeding (80mph in a 65mph interstate). I extend professional courtesy to LEOs, and Emergency room folks. Basically I think of it like this. Anyone that may save my sorry a$$ some day I really do not want to write.

The flip side to this is I would write anyone including LEOs for criminal activity and DUI. I also will write LEOs with very poor attitudes. Wives/husbands of LEOs may be written if they have no proof, but they usually talk the talk.

Before someone cries "above the law", I also give lots of breaks to non-leos. However to stay employed someone has to be the lucky winners. Those winners are for; speeding at least 15mph over(still give breaks up to around 20), or disobeying a traffic control devive, DUI, suspended/revoked driving, and registration violations. I do not write much else. The most important thing on my stops is a good attitude.

If you get an AR15.com sticker that would help on my stops too

Link Posted: 2/1/2006 5:43:24 PM EDT

Originally Posted By RenegadeX:
IMHO, the problem is not giving professional courtesy, but expecting it to be given.



Saw this in court just last month with a LEO that was upset with an officer that wrote his wife a seat belt ticket ($55). Lets just say he represented himself, his wife, and his department poorly.

Professional coutesy is how most department conflicts start.
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 5:58:44 PM EDT
I got stopped for speeding, but felt that if I ID'd myself, the deputy would think I expected him to let me off. Which he might have, but I thought it would make me look like an ass. So I was very polite, took my ticket and went to traffic school.

Link Posted: 2/1/2006 6:10:03 PM EDT
I identify myself as an LEO because I usually have at least one handgun in the car with me and I let my CCW expire a couple of years ago. I always preferred to know if there was a gun in the car when I stopped it so I extend that courtesy to anyone who may stop me.
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 6:27:05 PM EDT
Depends a lot:

I was not paying attention and got stopped doing 60 in a 45. I shut up and took my lumps.

I was doing 48 in a 40 (dropped from 50 changing townships) and popped tin.

If I'm the idiot, I'll take my punishment.

efxguy
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 6:31:00 PM EDT
I let them see the badge but do not make a big deal about it. Showing the badge says I'm not a criminal, I'm not going to give you a BS excuse, I may be armed. By showing the badge I expect to be asked more questions as to where I work, and a confirmation of my LEO status. By showing my badge it also says if I am an ass on your stop you can crush my balls with a phone call to my boss. If a LEO shows his badge they may be given professional coutesy, however they may also be stopped longer while the LEO status is confirmed and asked alot more questions. Many LEO posers have been caught on traffic stops posing as LEOs expecting a quick no questions asked stop.

I wish the some folks could see some dash cam video to see how humble most officers are when they are stopped.
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 8:15:44 PM EDT
An officer in my buddies PD wrote the chief's wife a ticket. I guess he does not let anyone off at all and if he stops you, you are getting a ticket.
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 8:19:05 PM EDT
I am required by dept. general order to identify myself as a police officer and I think it is a good rule of thumb to do so. Of course you should be courtious and professional as always, but don't expect not to get written up and if you do get a ticket, don't argue with the officer, just remember what goes around comes around. I konw guys that will write a ticket to any cop no matter what and working for the same dept. Let's just say the fax machine works overtime on such occasions.
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 8:26:39 PM EDT

Originally Posted By RenegadeX:
IMHO, the problem is not giving professional courtesy, but expecting it to be given.

Yeah, I act humble as hell and never act like I expect but I always get it, and I'm just a firefighter and EMT
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 9:01:16 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Dusty_C:

Originally Posted By RenegadeX:
IMHO, the problem is not giving professional courtesy, but expecting it to be given.

Yeah, I act humble as hell and never act like I expect but I always get it, and I'm just a firefighter and EMT



I got written in uniform on my way to shift.

By one of my own City cops... who knows me.


Of course, everybody on the PD side thinks the guy's a putz and don't trust him as far as they can throw a DD at him, so... All my bros on the PD side apologized for him. I played it down, and told them it was a good stop. <shrug>

The judge threw out 3 charges, and I copped to the speeding. She asked if I'd had an MV in the last 12 months.

I responded "Your Honor, I don't think I've had an MV in the last 12 years[/i]"

She laughed.

I got 60 days supervision & $80 in court costs.
Link Posted: 2/1/2006 10:33:40 PM EDT
I do not write cops tickets.

I would give ANY cop a break based on professional courtesy. Unless your talking violent felony why would you mess with another cop? Dont thugs get away with shit every single day in court? Dont politicians? Dont "sports stars"? I believe cops are better than most and deserve to be given at least as good of treatment as a scrote gets.

Now if he/she is endangering themselves or others ie drunk driving, then I'll get them home safely.
But I even do that for average citizens.
Link Posted: 2/2/2006 6:21:50 AM EDT
My feeling always was that I do not write tickets to anyone that could save my life. I assume that any brother officer driving by me on the street could very well be that person. In other words I would not write my mother a ticket because she brought me into this world so it is the least I can do for her. Like wise if I was wrestling with a bad guy that was intent on killing me and you (brother officer) jumped in and saved my life I could never write you a ticket. I assume by the very fact that you are a brother officer that you would do that for me therefore I could never in good conscience write you. The fact that you have not done it yet is irrelevant because I know you would.

I think that officers that do write brother officers have never been in that situation. Have never been on a street fighting for their lives and had another brother help pull the guy off of you and subdue him. Once this has happened to you you see a ticket in a very different way and brother officers passing you by on the street in a very different way. This is why, I think, that officers from very busy high crime departments tend to be much more courteous to brother officers and officers from smaller less violent departments tend to be more hard nosed.

So simply put in the high crime department for which I worked a traffic ticket was just not that big of a deal and if I would on occasion let civilians go with a warning then how could I ever give a ticket to a brother officer who very well save my life someday?

That said notice that I said that in my department a traffic ticket was not a big deal and that I let off civilians also. My feeling was that if i let a civilian go for something then I would extend that same courtesy to fellow officers. How can I write a cop when I let civilians go for the same thing?

This of course assumes that the officers is polite and only doing a minor thing that, if committed by a civilian, I would possibly cut them some slack. I did have a detective beat his wife and through her out a second story window and then ask me to "take care of it". No good. He went. But felony assault is very different from a traffic ticket.

Now I asked a cop in a small department why he wrote cops. His answer was interesting. This was a very rural area and he asked me what was the biggest problem or condition in the area that I patrolled. I answered homicide. We had one every night. He responded well out here in the sticks we don't. Our biggest problem was fatal car crashes due to speed. So if he did not address that biggest issue in his department for loss of life then what else was he going to do all day. He had a valid point. Not one that I agreed with but I never looked at it that way. In a job where you wrestle with a murderer so often it is easy to think of letting a guy go for a traffic ticket. But in a job where every night you see dead bodies of kids from speeding it may not be so easy to look at a ticket so lightly.

One more point. On my way to work a few nights later that same officer was getting his ass handed to him by three bad guys on a car stop on a lonely road that I drove through every night on my way to work in the city. I saw it and pulled over and drew my weapon and helped him subdue the guys until his back up came. Had I not stopped he might have been done. He never wrote me again and saw a different side of the story.

So what is right and what is wrong? You decide. But my point of view is that any officer of any department that is driving by me could potentially be a savior. A traffic ticket is a minor thing and one that I give courtesy to civilians for anyway sometimes. So how could I write a guy that would lay down his life for me without even knowing me? I could not.

And anyone that says that he would not give slack to anyone is a liar. If you pulled over your mother you would let her go. If you pulled over your wife you would let her go. So save the sanctimonious crap. Everyone has certain people in their lives that they would not write. To me someone that would take a bullet for me is on that list.
Link Posted: 2/2/2006 9:09:05 AM EDT
My personal stance is that I give courtesy for minor traffic offenses.
Link Posted: 2/2/2006 9:22:17 AM EDT
I have stopped several cops for speeding in my town. Most of them are out of state, ecspecially in the summer because we are a big tourist town. Most of the time the cop will tell me his is a cop, we talk about some things, I politely ask him / her to slow it down and enjoy the area and if there is anything they need to give me a call. I have never written a cop for speed, but I havent stopped what that was speeding to excessively, but I have only been an LEO for 3 yrs, so I am sure the time will come, but......

I have arrested a cop before, I stopped a truck full for troopers from another state (sorry and because of professional courtesy I will not tell the state), there were 4 troopers in the truck, and the driver was smashed, they were just leaving a strip club in an unorganized terriotry right by my town, as a part of patrol we usually turn around in the parker lot of the strip club. Well the truck pulled out in front of me and headed back towards my town. I followed the truck and stopped it for operation, and arrested the driver. For the most part the driver was cooperative and knew he screwed up REALLY REALLY BAD, but the passangers, all troopers were assholes. Needless to say, when he showed up for court he was very sorry and told me that he lost his job, I felt horrible, but knew I did the right thing. He even told me he would have done the same thing, and said he screwed up and he realized it after the fact.

I guess for minor traffic infractions you could cut some slack, but when they are endangers others or using their badge to put them above others they should be arrested / summonsed.

I have only been stopped once and I was in an unmarked patrol unit going to a class downstate. Once the officer came up on the car he realized I was a cop because of the equipment in the cruiser, he just asked where I was going and I told him and he told me to have a nice day, and enjoy the training.

I think we should treat officers how we treat citizens, with the respect until the officer gives us a reason to treat them differently.

I have stopped a volunteer firefigther that works in a different town several times b/c when there is a fire in the other town he thinks he can go speeding through my town. Well one day I clocked him at 85/35, and this was the 3rd time I stopped him. He had his red light on. When I stopped him he said he had a fire to go to and he didnt have time to deal with "my shit". Well with that attitude I didnt care, I had warned him several times already and told him his red light doesnt give him the right to speed and that he isnt even supposed to use the red light in a town he doesnt work in. So i arrested him for criminal speed. I called his chief later that day and the chief praised me for doing this and also said he has been getting several complaints on this guy and the guy just didnt get the hint. He was fired and the court was very severe on him.
Link Posted: 2/2/2006 12:19:18 PM EDT
I've been stopped a few times this year. Everytime I've ID'd myself as a Federal Officer and informed the officer that I was armed. I do it as a courtesy so there are no suprises if he asks me to step out of the vehicle. I've only been given a verbal warning, and on one or two occasions, the officer has just told me to have a good day. I'm always polite and would never argue if issued a ticket. It's their call on whether or not to issue the citiation and I wouldn't be upset either way.
Link Posted: 2/2/2006 3:17:37 PM EDT
I extend courtesy to all those who may save my hide or have me under the knife someday. Fortunately I have never had to deal with another LEO when the reason for stop has ever been for anything other than traffic and have never had to deal with anything criminal when it comes to other LEO's. There is a line that can be crossed and when a LEO decides they are going to cross the line and become just like the other idiots we stop, then the courtesy stops.
My .02
Link Posted: 2/2/2006 9:16:29 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Tango7:

Originally Posted By Dusty_C:

Originally Posted By RenegadeX:
IMHO, the problem is not giving professional courtesy, but expecting it to be given.

Yeah, I act humble as hell and never act like I expect but I always get it, and I'm just a firefighter and EMT



I got written in uniform on my way to shift.

By one of my own City cops... who knows me.


Of course, everybody on the PD side thinks the guy's a putz and don't trust him as far as they can throw a DD at him, so... All my bros on the PD side apologized for him. I played it down, and told them it was a good stop. <shrug>

The judge threw out 3 charges, and I copped to the speeding. She asked if I'd had an MV in the last 12 months.

I responded "Your Honor, I don't think I've had an MV in the last 12 years[/i]"

She laughed.

I got 60 days supervision & $80 in court costs.



What were the three other cites for? I've never written more than three to anyone, let alone a
ff/EMS or LE!
Link Posted: 2/3/2006 5:30:41 AM EDT
When I was pulled over for speeding I wouldn't embarass me further by asking for a break just because I'm a cop. Pay the ticket, move on.
Link Posted: 2/3/2006 6:29:09 AM EDT
I have gone both ways on citing other Officers. When I worked the road most of the time I gave verbal warnings followed by requests for consentual searches at the end of the stop. I figured that if I let most everyone else off with a warning why not LE. I did write one Officer a cite only because of a bad attitude and his expectation of professional courtesy. I was working the interstate and stopped him for speeding (25 over). Before I could get up to his vehicle he had rolled down the window just enough to push his badge through and then rolled the window back up so that the badge was hanging outside the window. He then just looked at me through the closed window and didn't even try to talk to me. I tapped on the glass like I didn't see the badge and he put the window down and asked me if I was blind. When I told him that he was getting a cite for speeding he called me a small town hick cop and I had obviously never heard of professional courtesy. A fine example for his Dept. BTW if this sounds familiar and you are a member on this board, you're still a dickhead......7 years later.
Link Posted: 2/3/2006 7:38:22 AM EDT
Link Posted: 2/3/2006 1:39:30 PM EDT
No LEO, EMT, Fire or Military will get a cite from me unless they are a total ass about the stop. There are plenty of dirtbags out there to write. Call it what you want but LEO shouldn't eat their own.
Link Posted: 2/3/2006 3:49:12 PM EDT
My primary job is traffic so I run across a lot of cops, especially during the summer because you have to go through my two assigned counties to get to a hot tourist spot. I think there should be a proper etiquette when being stopped by another cop. Small things like don’t have your badge hanging out the window before I walk up to the door. Don’t demand I give you a warning. Don’t purposely flash your badge when digging out your license from the wallet. That annoys the crap out of me.

I think you should just slip it in. Say something like, “I just want you to know that I am armed. I am an off duty officer from {insert department}.”


But my best advice, just like I give to every other violator, is if you don’t want to worry about getting a ticket, DON’T SPEED.
Link Posted: 2/3/2006 5:47:18 PM EDT
When I have been stopped, I will identify myself as an officer only if I am carrying a weapon in the area of my wallet. If I am only carrying using an ankle holster, I will not ID myself unless I am asked.

When I have stopped fellow officers in the past, I have only written one reserve LEO, but that was a serious attitude ticket. The reserve officer made it plainly clear that he was a reserve officer in a small local town, that he was carrying a weapon without a CCW or commision card, and that he would be informing my supervisor that I had stopped him for what he considered a very minor violation (70+ in a 35MPH zone). On top of all this he also decided that he did not need to wait for me to return to his vehicle prior to attempting to leave the stop location, and also liked to throw gravel with his vehicle tires. He did get a couple cites for that one.
Link Posted: 2/4/2006 7:24:56 AM EDT
Most of the officers I've stopped and polite and only say they are the police if I ask them or they tell if they are armed. I've never written one a ticket but I have arrested one for DWI. I've been stopped a few times in 11yrs and have always informed the officer who I was only because I ride with a pistol under my right leg and don't feel like getting shot. I have also been given a ticket for speed, my fault for not watching my speed.
Link Posted: 2/4/2006 7:53:14 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/4/2006 8:01:49 AM EDT by sta1treeman]

Originally Posted By Dusty_C:

Originally Posted By RenegadeX:
IMHO, the problem is not giving professional courtesy, but expecting it to be given.

Yeah, I act humble as hell and never act like I expect but I always get it, and I'm just a firefighter and EMT

+1 I have been fortunate since I've been on the Dept., I have been stopped several times, and received 1 ticket, that was for doing 57 in a 50 zone, it was actually a 55 zone, and the officer took exception to me telling him that. I wasn't disrespectful when I said it. I took my lumps and went on. This was on a four lane divided highway. The city, a very small town, with two officers, has a reputation for writing a lot of speeding tickets, with no exceptions, so I should have known better. but 57 in a 55, or even if it was 50, is, overboard, with or without professional courtesy. ADAMSVILLE, AL. on Highway 78, if you ever come through there, slow down, regardless of who you work for. Anyone familiar with the area, will agree 100%. (edit) They have a Wal-Mart now, and since, they have eased up a bit.
Link Posted: 2/4/2006 8:07:18 AM EDT
This is a touchy subject no matter how you put it. Traffic violations are one thing. What bothers me is the LEO who hangs their badge out the window before you even get to their vehicle. I consider myself somwhat observent; I'm gonna see the badge without it being shoved in my face. I am likely to extend some leway to an LEO. My feeling is that professional curtosy the person being stopped to be a professional. The "f-you, can't you see I'm a cop" attitude has the opposite effect on my attitude towards that person.
As far as crimianl activity goes; you don't get a break from me. It wouldn't be on my highlight film for certain. As a LEO we aren't going to get the same treatment as John-Q-public. He isn't likely to get the press we are. Where I'm from, it would be front page news and the public/friends/family are not going to look at you the same way as they would someone who isn't an officer. If the day comes I have to take in a fellow LEO, I'm not enjoy it, and it wasn't my choice to make. The LEO who made the choice to drive drunk is the person putting their carear and lives of everyone on the road on the line. Save all of us the trouble and choose not to put your fellow officer into that situation, and we won't have to have this discussion.
Link Posted: 2/4/2006 9:36:38 AM EDT
In Alabama, we have Firefighter tags, and I know the tag has gotten me out of a few tickets. Does anyone else's state have special tags for LEOs or FFs? I have never seen any, just curious?
Link Posted: 2/4/2006 9:43:11 AM EDT
I see a lot of FF tags. LEO tags! I can just see the key marks...if they made them.
Link Posted: 2/4/2006 10:06:21 AM EDT

Originally Posted By TxLawDog:
I have gone both ways on citing other Officers. When I worked the road most of the time I gave verbal warnings followed by requests for consentual searches at the end of the stop.



Just to clarify.....you're asking LEO's for consensual searches?
Link Posted: 2/4/2006 2:50:32 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/4/2006 2:51:54 PM EDT by Tango7]

Originally Posted By glocktastic:
What were the three other cites for? I've never written more than three to anyone, let alone a
ff/EMS or LE!



Citation 1: Operating and Unregistered Motor Vehicle (Expired Vehicle Tags)

I don't know how the f*ck this one happened. Last summer my wife and I paid for 3 vehicles: my bike and both our cars - directly to a supervisor at DMV, and we got our reg's and our stickers. Her tag comes up valid, and we have the reg. I sold the bike but the sticker was on it. Of course, when we renewed, we were on the way out of town, so I threw my reg & sticker into my glovebox to put on when we got back.

I never got around to it, and figured the worse I'd get would be a "Failure to diplay" - a technical. When he ran my "28" my plates come up expired. Can't find the recepit/registration with the sticker attached to it, and DMV had no info. I had the sticker and the reg in my hand.

Bad on me for not taking the 5 minutes in the lot and pasting the sticker on.

Citation #2 - Failure to Present Driver's License Upon Demand of a Law Enforcement Officer.

I went round and round with him about this one. I wa on my way to work. In the course of my career as a FF, I've lost pagers, cell phones, house and car keys, pens, lights, knives... usually while crawling into a wreck in a muddy ditch.

As a result, I've adopted the practice of carrying absolutely nothing I can't afford to lose while on duty - including my wallet.

In IL the charge is purely a technical one - in fact, the State Code specifically states that if you present a valid DL at your hearing, the charge MUST be dismissed without prejudice.

After he gave me a ration about not forking over the plastic, I rattled off my DL # from memory. Which unfortunately resulted in:

Citation #3 - Operating a Motor Vehicle Without a Valid Driver's License (Expired DL)

My bad - I had renewed late 4 years ago - like Nov and I forgot that IL DL's expire on birthday, not date of issue. Mine was issued on my B-day several years ago, and I'd always renewed it before expiration.

In addition, sicne I didn;t have a valid DL, he made me fill out an ROR bond on scene.

After he had issued me the citation (which took him thirty minutes to write), he told me


I was gonna let you off on the speeding, but then all this other stuff came up.


Which I believe like I believed Clinton telling us he never had sexual relations...

My bros on the PoPo side told me that they would have given me 24 hours to straighten the issue up. If I hadn't shown up with valid papers, they would have filed 'em.

They also wouldn't have kept on the side of the road on the way to work... remember how I mentioned it took this guy half an hour to write me?

The incident clock at dispatch got punched at 0642.

I was released at 0718.

My shift starts at 0700.

Of course, day shift starts then too, so I'm glad he (on midnights) got an hour of OT in return for my getting docked an hour. At least the check came from the same account.

As I said in my initial post- I'm not denying the validity of the stop. I just think that it was handled less than efficiently.

But it's over, I'm legit, and that guy's reputation got reinforced. On both sides of the building.
Link Posted: 2/4/2006 2:56:13 PM EDT

Originally Posted By doorkickerny:

Originally Posted By TxLawDog:
I have gone both ways on citing other Officers. When I worked the road most of the time I gave verbal warnings followed by requests for consentual searches at the end of the stop.



Just to clarify.....you're asking LEO's for consensual searches?



As a general rule no, but a Trooper in my county popped a Michigan Highway Patrol Officer with five kilos when he was coming back from 'vacation' on a consentual search.
Link Posted: 2/5/2006 7:46:48 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/5/2006 7:58:04 AM EDT by bruh44]
I don't think a cop should write another cop, atleast not for minor things, speeding and such. I got a ticket about 3 years ago in Tennessee. I told him I was a cop, he said then you should know better. What could I say to that? I knew he was right, he just views things differently than I do. I can't blame a guy for doing his job. What I've done, and seen done often, was hand my ID card under my DL. Does that seem like an ass hole thing to do? I don't think it is, but everybody sees things differently.
On another subject I have a friend in Florida Highway Patrol who was telling me a story about a JSO who caused a fatal accident while DUI. They some how found out the guy had been stopped several times in the past for DUI and never written. Everyone who had stopped him that did nothing more than give him a ride was named in the law suit.
Link Posted: 2/5/2006 8:15:55 AM EDT
I believe you should identify yourself as a peace officer, when stopped, if your carrying a pistol. I the officer making the stop observes the weapon, they could get a little nervouse. I do not want some rookie putting holes in me because he got scared.

I have never asked to get out of a ticket, but have been taken off the hook because I am a LEO. I do believe in proffesional courtesy to a point. Let's be honest here. If I caught one of our guys DWI, I would park his car and drive him home. One of us picks up one DWI and were out of a job. There is a lot of dam good officers out there who may screw up once, due to a divorce or major event in thier life and drive drunk. Im not saying it's right, but I have his back. If it's a keeps happening and becomes a pattern, then make the arrest.

Now this logic does not apply to everything. I hate dirty officers and will never cover for drugs or money. SAVE the high horse attitude for your supervisors and command staff. Each sittuation is different and should be handled accordingly.
Link Posted: 2/5/2006 12:45:55 PM EDT
Link Posted: 2/5/2006 5:26:58 PM EDT
I give police the same coutesy i give everyone else who is not a career criminal. I take the minimum enforcement action that will correct the problem. That's usually a warning for traffic offenses. If the driver makes it clear by his statements or conduct that a warning will not solve the problem, then he gets a ticket, regaurdless of occupation.
Link Posted: 2/9/2006 3:02:32 PM EDT
Not for nothing, but how many of us are out there ? How many others are out there that would not think twice about putting a bullet in one us ? To me, a Police Officer is off limits ! If he or she commits a crime, then it is what it is, and I'm not losing my job or going to jail for anyone. But why would one cop write another cop ? When its your a$$ on the line on or off duty, who do you think is going to stop to help you ? I know what I would do if I saw another cop fighting with someone on the side of the road no matter what dept or state he is from. I just can't justify hitting a brother leo with paper.

Be Safe!!!
Link Posted: 2/9/2006 7:20:32 PM EDT

Originally Posted By sballa25:
Now I am not saying that I write a ticket to every cop that I stop. I have only written one or two cops in my day. But what makes a cop think he can drive 90 + mph in a 50 or 60 mph zone off duty and get away with it. I admit I have let many cops off who did something that I thought needed a ticket for. But where should the line begin and end when it comes to writing another cop a ticket. I would NEVER give a cop a freebie if they were driving drunk. The same goes for the guys in my department, friends, and my family. DWI never deserves a warning. Too many people have been killed by drunks.

I have been stopped twice since I became a LEO. I have never gotten a ticket, I was warned both times. I never flashed my badge or asked for a warning, I left it up to the OFFICERS DISCRETION. Had I gotten a ticket, I would have taken my lumps, paid it and moved on. We as law enforcement officers are not above the law. If anyone should be walking the fine line of the law it should be us. We set the example.


I just want to see what everyone else thinks about professional courtesy and where the line should be drawn. Should cops get a warning every time? Should we only arrest cops for the major crimes? How quickly should we arrest another cop?





I pretty much agree with your sentiments. I find our job is hard enough as it is.
Link Posted: 2/9/2006 10:21:28 PM EDT
There is an officer I my department, less than 1 year on the job, that has pulled the same officer over 2 times in the last 2 weeks for speeding on the same street. The second time he stopped him he told the officer that there was no way he could have gotten him on radar and told him to go ahead and right the ticket. The officer didn't write him. He stoppped him again last night and not only did he tell the officer to go ahead and write him but he was disrespectful and told him that he was picking on him and that he would continue to speed. This guy works in an adjacent city. Our new officer continued to be polite and gave him another warning asking for his Supervisor's name. Again, this guy was just an a**hole and told him to get bent. So, Our officer called his own Sgt and told him what was going on. We have video in our cars and the video was pulled out of car and reviewed. Our Sgt. left a msg. for his Sgt. to call to try and straiten this guys attitude out before we start a ticket war. He isn't representing his depertment very well and I know alot of officers there. If he had just shown a little repect for officers in the city he lives in and jurisdiction that has to live and drive in the whole mess could have been avoided. At this point the profession courtesy is going out the window.
Link Posted: 2/10/2006 3:47:43 PM EDT

Originally Posted By MPD165:
There is an officer I my department, less than 1 year on the job, that has pulled the same officer over 2 times in the last 2 weeks for speeding on the same street. The second time he stopped him he told the officer that there was no way he could have gotten him on radar and told him to go ahead and right the ticket. The officer didn't write him. He stoppped him again last night and not only did he tell the officer to go ahead and write him but he was disrespectful and told him that he was picking on him and that he would continue to speed. This guy works in an adjacent city. Our new officer continued to be polite and gave him another warning asking for his Supervisor's name. Again, this guy was just an a**hole and told him to get bent. So, Our officer called his own Sgt and told him what was going on. We have video in our cars and the video was pulled out of car and reviewed. Our Sgt. left a msg. for his Sgt. to call to try and straiten this guys attitude out before we start a ticket war. He isn't representing his depertment very well and I know alot of officers there. If he had just shown a little repect for officers in the city he lives in and jurisdiction that has to live and drive in the whole mess could have been avoided. At this point the profession courtesy is going out the window.




I agree with the above post, but I still wouldn't write the guy. I think that I'd just call my Sgt. (depending on which one is on the street) to the scene so he could see first hand as to what was going on. I'd then leave what to do to the boss on scene. I'm sure at the very least, my boss would be making a phone call! If the guy was as much of a a@@ hole as stated above, I'd be ordered to write him.
Link Posted: 2/13/2006 8:49:20 AM EDT
I have stopped several officers, emt's, firefighters, other LEO personal and I have never written any of them a ticket. There have been guys flash badges, pin them to their door jam so everyone can see their little badge, flash when they open their wallet, hang them from their mirror with a neckalace badge holder, and the ol' "I am armed, Officer from TwoBuck."

I guess the thing that erks me the most is the guys that pin their badge to their car door jam or hang them from their rear view, 99% of the time it is a reserve officer or deputy. Crap if you are a cop tell me....... "Hey man I know you got me for speeding, I work at Oom a mow mow, can you cut me a break?" That is cool with me.

Stupidity Follows:
Stopped a guy and he flashed a badge at me about 10 times while he was going through his wallet for his D.L. He was making it bluntingly obvious he had a badge so finally I asked him, "What kind of badge you have there?" .... "I am a State Inspector."....... "Oh ok, You with OSBI?"........ "No I am with the Department of Health, I inspect meat." You don't know how bad I wanted to grab myself and tell him to inspect this. Then he mentioned that he was also a Mason, and that he knew State Rep. Bubba Do Good. No I did not write him a ticket, I was too embarassed for him. I honest to God think this guy was close to being retarded or had some mental issues, that is why I did not write him.

On another note: Sort of a spin on professional courtesy

I had an incident where I ended up stopping a police officer's wife 4 times, each time she was running 70+ in a 45. The 1st time she told me who her hubby was, 2nd time same story, 3rd time I told her she really needed to slow down and that it isn't a joke, the 4th time I gave her a ticket. I know the officer, he is from a neighboring department and he is by the book. I guessed that he did not know about any of the other 3 stops, so I told her that if he called me I would change it to a warning. So he calls and sounds sorta pissy, "You gave my wife a ticket?" "Yep. Did she tell you this is the 4th time I stopped her and everytime has been 25 or more over?" "No she did not!" and hung up.

He called later "Hey thanks for having me call, there won't be a next time. Can you still change that ticket?" "Already did."

Point being LEOs need to stick up for each other, everyone hates cops. I get so sick of stupid cop stories and writing another cop a ticket for speeding or minor traffic is not a good thing. I have had cops get pissy with me cause I stopped them, when this happens I get right back on them, but I don't write them. You know Like when you aruge with your Brother? It's all good later.
Link Posted: 2/13/2006 10:19:18 AM EDT

Originally Posted By TxLawDog:
BTW if this sounds familiar and you are a member on this board, you're still a dickhead......7 years later.



I love it!
Link Posted: 2/13/2006 9:43:13 PM EDT
I work for a Federal agency, so am not involved in traffic enforcement. I've been pulled over a few times since I took this job; I've always identified myself; my attitude has always been one of respectful contrition; the officer's attitude in response has ranged from lip-spittle-flying anger to curiosity about my job (" is your agency hiring, how do I apply", etc.). Regardless of the initial attitude, I've always been cut a break, and for that I am deeply grateful.

I would never ask for or demand professional courtesy, but when it is given, it is appreciated, and creates a reservoir of good-feeling toward whatever agency granted it. I consider it a favor, and I always try to repay favors however I can. If an officer chose, instead, to write me a ticket, I would accept it as gracefully as possible; I'm the one in the wrong, so getting uppity about it would just be hypocritical. After about my third or fourth time of getting pulled over and getting cut a break, I've made a real effort to slow down and adhere to traffic laws in general; there's just no sense in pushing one's luck, and why the hell is everyone in such a big hurry, anyway?
Link Posted: 2/15/2006 7:05:49 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/15/2006 7:10:47 PM EDT by combatvet1]
My stance on it goes like this, I speed 9 over on highways most of the time and usually not more than 5 in city limits. I don't write people (anybody) citations for doing the same thing I do. If you choose to go over then I might cite you. As for LEO's I have never wrote a fellow officer a citation. I feel that I give the general public warnings on so many differant offenses why would I write a cop? I would not stand by and let any LEO get away with commiting a felony or arrestable offense (DB, AB ect.) since I would be setting myself up for a possible suit or misconduct charges by hiding it or covering it up.

Iv'e been stopped several times. I do identify myself as Police Officer and let them know that I am armed. I don't ask for any favors and am always respecfull. I have been issued 1 citation and as fate would have it I did some part time work for the guy a year later with now bad feelings. Plain and simple I was wrong and can't be mad at the Officer for doing his job. I would be no better then the people who yell and use profanity at us when I stop them.

With that said I did stop a fellow officer from anouther jurisdiction for 10-55 one time. I left his car parked at the scene and gave him a ride home without arresting him. One week later I was alone on a DB that was going south in a hurry, the officer I cut a break drove to my jurisdiction (we were seperated by the Mississippi river) and backed me. After I whent 10-95 with my subject he appologized for how I had been forced to meet him the week before.

The only cop I have ever wrote a citation to was a city cop, since I got him doing 92/55 and he went 10-80 on me for several miles. When I finnaly got the vehicle stopped along with 4 other squads for back up he told me that he was a cop (showed me his Id and badge) and I had no idea how to do my job. Im not sorry about it I feld obligated to write him since there was no proffesionalism on his part. Ive worked in a city with alot of violent crimes I know what it was like and I never let it go to my head like he did.

With that said you all be safe, watch your partners back and make sure everyone goes home after they go 10-42
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