Posted: 4/1/2009 1:24:27 AM EDT
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Anyone recived an explanation letter from Lewis Machine and tool regarding the ever increasing lead times for delivery of goods?
I called today to check on an order I placed 11/11/08. I was told three weeks ago, that all Gas piston rifles would be ready by the end of March. I was told today it won't be until the end of May. If I am lucky. WTF? If it goes until the end of May, thts 28 freaking weeks. For the order I place in early december, i was told that I would expect to see them at the end of f**ing july. I was told when I placed the november order, that they should have been ready in mid January. Then it was early february. then it was early March. then It was the end of march. Now its F**ing May. Already lost one customer to this BS, and i still have to notify two others. Supposedly, there is a letter, by email or postal, explaining the "Plan" to get everything done. Still heavn't received mine though. |
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I just received notification today that the Badger rings I ordered March 08, 2008 have finally arrived. SWFA could not process my order because my credit card expiration date had changed. I'm glad they couldn't process my order because the last thing I want is for some product to show up a year after I ordered it and have long since forgot completely about because I got it elsewhere or decided to buy something different.
That being said, there is no way in hell I would give up my place in line right now to get a LMT upper or rifle or for that matter any other top grade equipment. If you bail out now forget about getting it at all. LMT, Colt, Noveske, Rock River, White Oak, you name it, don't like this situation any more than the consumer. They have a panic buying situation equal to, or worse than 1993/1994 and no legislation has even been proposed yet. Once legislation does get introduced there won't be anything left to sell. Patience is a virtue and I haven't always been virtuous. Sit (impatiently if you must) and ride it out. Knowing that you'll probably have it in two or three more months is a lot better than not being in line at all. LMT also supplies the armed services and as such may be giving them priority right now, and that is as it should be. The idea that even one rifle didn't make it to our men in the field, getting shot at and bombed, because it went to a civilian for their collection should be offensive to all of us. Rest easy knowing the war effort is at least partially responsible for the back log. |
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I just posted this comment in another topic here in AR Discussions.
I as well was told 6-8 weeks tops when I placed the order in mid Nov. Ive called about 3 times since mid Jan and each time it grew. LMT if you reading this its BS. Your gonna lose customers, but you wont care with that big govt / mil / le contract? Ive had 2 things (will not disclose the items) on order with LMT since Nov 2008. They told me (promised me) they were going to have all 2008 back orders filled by March 31st / April 1st. I called a few days ago and got, "Its looking more like June maybe July". "Sir be happy you ordered in Nov, the new back order timeframe if you order today is June / July 2010. WTF ? Who at the LMT factory is eating this stuff, and where is it? They are releasing stuff slower than Colt, and thats bad ! Slower than snails. They must have a big contract they cant tell about. All about Industry secrets, shhh! |
There are LMT MRP Piston rifles around. It all depends if you're willing to pay top coin (way above MSRP), or the alternative is to wait in line and be subjected to the delays you've experienced. I'm satisfied with CS at LMT and I believe they are really trying their best to meet the incredible demand. Just so that you don't feel so bad, know that I paid $1,700+ just for an piston upper. I also found a brand new Defender 2000 lower which came with a match-trigger and a SOPMOD stock for another $620 at a gun show recently. The pain hasn't subsided yet....
Hey, but look at the bright side - at least we've got choices. - BORG |
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I can't understand how a company can get so far out of whack in such a small amount of time. 3 weeks ago, all gas guns that had been ordered in 2008 would have been filled by end of March. Now its April 1, and I am still two more months out.
I am not just talking about piston guns either. I have a CQB and two lowers on order as well. And nothing. 3 weeks ago, I was told it looks like the lowers are ready, and they are waiting on the CQB, and they should all ship together. Didn't happen, and I am still waiting. And all this is without explanation. Thats what bothers me the most. I am anxious to see this supposed letter explaining the situation. Maybe that will show up in a month or two. |
| I understand everyone's pain. I'm waiting for a second rifle from them. But, keep in mind, that the reason LMT rifles are in such high demand is because they make quality rifles. You don't make quality products by rushing things and cutting corners. I am glad they are not cranking out sub par rifles just to meet demand. Because when I get my rifle, I don't want it to be sub par. However, I agree that they should not make promises on arrival times if they cannot keep those promises. |
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Quoted:
I can't understand how a company can get so far out of whack in such a small amount of time. 3 weeks ago, all gas guns that had been ordered in 2008 would have been filled by end of March. Now its April 1, and I am still two more months out. I am not just talking about piston guns either. I have a CQB and two lowers on order as well. And nothing. 3 weeks ago, I was told it looks like the lowers are ready, and they are waiting on the CQB, and they should all ship together. Didn't happen, and I am still waiting. And all this is without explanation. Thats what bothers me the most. I am anxious to see this supposed letter explaining the situation. Maybe that will show up in a month or two. The problem is almost certainly due to the fact that you ordered two totally different items. Don't think for a second that those lowers are just going to sit and wait for the CQB MRP to get done. LMT would rather ship them out to one of their high volume customers and keep them happy than to have them sitting there, waiting for your MRP. Then, of course, the MRP will become available and your lowers are gone. Now they've got an MRP sitting there waiting on lowers. You guessed it... the MRP gets shipped out rather than sitting there waiting on the lowers. And so the game continues. Just go to Gunbroker, bend over, and take it like a champ.  Might as well get it over with now. If your order ever shows up from LMT you can put what you don't want to keep on Gunbroker and someone else who has finally accepted the reality of today's AR15 market will bend over for you.
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I understand that ALL the major AR manufactures are getting hammered equally, I'm sure its not just an LMT issue. But its a good sign that LMT products are in such high demand.
All that being said, since Christmas - I bought a complete LMT Defender and then in the last 3 weeks I ordered and RECEIVED 3 LMT complete lowers and a piston upper. I understand the frustration at the backlogs - but the stuff you want is out there. Order from the factory and get in line - or stay in line if you already have, but in the meantime just paitently AND aggressively scan all the sites that sell LMT products. The stuff WILL come into stock sooner than you think. If you find it, then cnx your order with the factory. For instance, one of the companies I bought a lower from about 2 weeks ago sold out within a couple of hours. I figured there was no way they would have anymore for months. Less than two weeks later they just got some more in stock today. |
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Quoted:
I just posted this comment in another topic here in AR Discussions. I as well was told 6-8 weeks tops when I placed the order in mid Nov. Ive called about 3 times since mid Jan and each time it grew. LMT if you reading this its BS. Your gonna lose customers, but you wont care with that big govt / mil / le contract? Ive had 2 things (will not disclose the items) on order with LMT since Nov 2008. They told me (promised me) they were going to have all 2008 back orders filled by March 31st / April 1st. I called a few days ago and got, "Its looking more like June maybe July". "Sir be happy you ordered in Nov, the new back order timeframe if you order today is June / July 2010. WTF ? Who at the LMT factory is eating this stuff, and where is it? They are releasing stuff slower than Colt, and thats bad ! Slower than snails. They must have a big contract they cant tell about. All about Industry secrets, shhh! Magpul had a very good explanation for what was going on in their situation. It may have similarities to the situation with LMT. This is just speculation on my part and my description/ understanding of it may not be entirely accurate or complete, but here goes: Due to the political climate and the uncertainty of the future of "assault weapons" being available to the general public/ average citizen it has created a huge demand currently. This is not part of a normal business cycle and there is no way to predict the future demand or availablity for products. So investing capital in new machinery, processes, what-have-you can not be justified because of the potential of no return on the investment for expanding prodution along with the uncertainty of a large enough market even existing for many of their products in the future. Basically all they can do is ramp up production through more shifts/ hrs but that is still liimited to the production capacity of their resources available to them now. In addtion, any government orders must be given priority by contractual obligation meaning their orders are filled first and everyone else is pushed back. Also factor in the sizable purchases being filled first for the large scale purchasers (such as Brownell's) and the attention given to the individual purchaser's order is even more limited when going thru the manufacturer. A matter of supply and demand while meeting their obligations to all those who keep them in business. Cavalry Arms has also explained this in one of their threads- the gist being its more profitable/ a more sound business decision to sell their products in bulk to distributors/ dealers than selling directly to the public even tho they still do this as a part of their business (like Magpul and LMT). But the fact is that the product you are ordering may be more readily available thru a distributor than going thru the manufacturer. It really is just business and not personal. You're just a victim of their reputation and the quality of their products. I'm still waiting on my opportunity to get another LMT receiver also so I feel for ya. I'll see if I can find that Magpul thread and post the link. |
| I called LMT yesterday and inquired about a complete rifle, just an upper or just a lower. Estimated delivery date was as Feb. 2010. I ain't waitin' that long. Scored a complete lower off gunbroker for $329 same day. More that I wanted to pay, but there it was. I couldn't resist. Now for a matching upper. |
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I just posted this comment in another topic here in AR Discussions. Edited to add; Funny you mention it like this (below). I'll go one better. In fact the order I have is for 2 complete rifles. The exact same model for both. The order was placed through a very large dealer / distributor that sells mainly to LE departments only. So why didn't it get priority? No I didn't order in Nov 2008 just because of the election shite. It was actually something I had just put off long enough. In fact I had called them in Oct 2008 and should have just went for it then, but like a dumb ice I waited. Stupid me. I as well was told 6-8 weeks tops when I placed the order in mid Nov. Ive called about 3 times since mid Jan and each time it grew. LMT if you reading this its BS. Your gonna lose customers, but you wont care with that big govt / mil / le contract? Ive had 2 things (will not disclose the items) on order with LMT since Nov 2008. They told me (promised me) they were going to have all 2008 back orders filled by March 31st / April 1st. I called a few days ago and got, "Its looking more like June maybe July". "Sir be happy you ordered in Nov, the new back order timeframe if you order today is June / July 2010. WTF ? Who at the LMT factory is eating this stuff, and where is it? They are releasing stuff slower than Colt, and thats bad ! Slower than snails. They must have a big contract they cant tell about. All about Industry secrets, shhh! Magpul had a very good explanation for what was going on in their situation. It may have similarities to the situation with LMT. This is just speculation on my part and my description/ understanding of it may not be entirely accurate or complete, but here goes: Due to the political climate and the uncertainty of the future of "assault weapons" being available to the general public/ average citizen it has created a huge demand currently. This is not part of a normal business cycle and there is no way to predict the future demand or availablity for products. So investing capital in new machinery, processes, what-have-you can not be justified because of the potential of no return on the investment for expanding prodution along with the uncertainty of a large enough market even existing for many of their products in the future. Basically all they can do is ramp up production through more shifts/ hrs but that is still liimited to the production capacity of their resources available to them now. In addtion, any government orders must be given priority by contractual obligation meaning their orders are filled first and everyone else is pushed back. Also factor in the sizable purchases being filled first for the large scale purchasers (such as Brownell's) and the attention given to the individual purchaser's order is even more limited when going thru the manufacturer. A matter of supply and demand while meeting their obligations to all those who keep them in business. Cavalry Arms has also explained this in one of their threads- the gist being its more profitable/ a more sound business decision to sell their products in bulk to distributors/ dealers than selling directly to the public even tho they still do this as a part of their business (like Magpul and LMT). But the fact is that the product you are ordering may be more readily available thru a distributor than going thru the manufacturer. It really is just business and not personal. You're just a victim of their reputation and the quality of their products. I'm still waiting on my opportunity to get another LMT receiver also so I feel for ya. I'll see if I can find that Magpul thread and post the link. Read the in red section above in my original posted quote. |