Posted: 10/17/2007 5:46:15 PM EDT
I was watching the MS13 show on National Geographic channel today. I missed half of it, but what i got was a violent gang that is bent of power by fear. I have seen them and their tags in Denver (I live in a suburb of Denver) and personally I dont fear them or the power they are attempting to gain. I feel that in a confrontation ( I never go anywhere without my CCW and a back up mag) I would win based on military training, the amount of shooting I do and the fact these thugs are general trash. I might be assuming a lot, but do others feel simular to me? I actually look forward to the day I cross paths with one of these pieces of trash.  ETA: I dont look for these fools, in fact I ahve had a gang member pull a gun on me on the highway. I evaded him and used the on and off ramps to my advantage and was able to force him off the higway without a confrontation. I avoid confrontation at all costs. I hate fighting and hate the idea of a gunfight. I would though in a heartbeat to save myself or my family. |
You need to do some more research, cowboy. MS13 isn't like other gangs. If you cross them, they don't come after you. They come after your family. They kill what you love when you can't protect it. If you do cap one, you better hope there aren't any witnesses. Shane |
Like I said I missed over half of the show, I also avoid the areas they are known to be in. |
They are pretty much nuts and will go from zero to ultra violent in a heart beat. Like most Latin gangs they are mostly a prison gang that has spread to the streets. However, unlike the Latin Kings of the Mexican Mafia there are a lot of Central Americans in their ranks some of whom may have had some commie rebel training or ties down there before they came up. Like a lot of these type of Latin gangs they like to act calm like they are being friendly and will jack you up if you let down your guard or get close. Don't trust any of them as far as you can throw them and avoid them at all costs. If you google you'll see examples of their prison tats so you'll know what to look for. I see a lot of people will try their best not to look at them, but thats not good because they'll take that as fear. If you have to cross paths with them, best to acknowledge them with a respectful nod of the head to let them know you don't fear them. However, don't get into a conversation with them and keep moving remembering to watch your reflections and be ready to go. |
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I remember a story i read several years ago when MS13 raided a pharmacy warehouse. They did'nt just break into the place like common thugs, they posted a perimiter to watch out for cops/attention with AK rifles. Some of these scum do have military training. Just another reason why i think every patrolman should have a carbine in his/her squad car. |
So? Are you suggesting that he should not confront them? Should he stay inside his house, if it would offend someone who claims affiliation with said gang? |
Discretion is the better part of valor. Just because someone is bought and paid for doesn't always mean you should take them home. Yes, you may actually *need* to, but if you do, you should probably move to another state. Shane |
Yeah.. I guess. ETA: Have you thought about being the "baddest on the block?" before the scary guys showed up? Perhaps being the only gentleman on your street with testicles that dangle? |
C'mon, you're giving these pieces of shit a bit too much credit. I certainly wouldn't go out looking to fuck with them, but they're also not some ultra elite death squad. |
I didn't say that. What I'm trying to express is that if you do have to engage one (or some) of these people, that isn't just going to be the end of it. You don't just high-five the cops who tell you what a great shoot it was and you go home to the family. You are going to have a bunch of other scum bags who are now going to be very interested in you. If you *need* to kill them, kill them. I'm not saying otherwise. After that, move. Shane |
C'mon, you're giving these pieces of shit a bit too much credit. I certainly wouldn't go out looking to fuck with them, but they're also not some ultra elite death squad. |
| I went to school with a lot of MS13 gang member in high school in VA. They arent people you want to mess with in 2000 they shot and killed someone in the high school parking lot and more resently the hacked a girls arms off behind one of the local movie theaters. So i just try and steer clear whenever possible. |
how should i put this: it's not disconcerning their capacity for violence, but the gov in limiting our ability to deal with it. |
just saying if i can aviod any conflict with them i will but if there is no other way out then.... |
Had one the other day come thru the ER with his sick kid. Was kind of odd to see a guy with devil horns tattooed on his forehead all rattled because his kid was having an asthma attack. Any other night and I'd bet he would be sending us patients probably with lacerations. |
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where are they all? I understood NC to have a high concentration of them but I never see them. At least not ones with tats on their faces and hands etc. The only Latinos I seem too see are usually hard at work, and there are a lot of them in this area. Does MS13 typically stay in their neighborhoods? Do they cruise the streets of the burbs and take people out indiscriminately? Did a google but I can't seem to figure out their MO. |
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Here's the problem as I see it. You get into a confraontation with these guys and you do kill one. Now you have the gang coming around from now until the end of time trying to get pay back. They may come at you, they may come at your family. While all this is happening you are being charged with and investigated for murder. If things go really bad you end up in jail/prison where they control everything. Your life span on the inside would be shorter than on the outside. It sickens me that in the times we live in it is actually easier (and by some people encouraged) to just let the gang do whatever it wants whenever it wants. |
Best line here. You may be a great shot on the range and under mild stressful circumstances, but these guys live violent lives and, like it or not, without proper force-on-force training or the experience of real violence, you are at a distinct disadvantage...I say this about myself as well...which is why I seek out physical and violent training. Handgun, long gun, CQB, ground combatives-unarmed, etc, etc, etc....I hope to minimize the gap and keep my eyes open. |
I concur. I have my permit and carry most places. However, thugs like this think differently than I do. That gives them an advantage to a degree. I have to "flip a switch" to turn on aggression and the determination to take somebody's life. It's recreation for them. I agree discretion and avoiding a direct confrontation would be wise. Military training and experience are definitely an asset when needed, but it's best to avoid a situation where they become necessary. |
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They tend to stay in the ethnic areas where they do business.It's easier to intimidate people who have delt with your kind in thier nation of origin,and easier to hide there too. Most of thier money comes from drug money, Meth and Heroin being the biggest share. Cops have more to worry about than anyone else.Most of the time the officer is the "states Witness" to the crime.They will try to make the witness go away either through payment,or directly. The ones that do go to prison end up running drugs inside. Unless you frequent thier parts of town,or deal with them for your habit,chances are your not going to have to worry much. And smart cops probably try to take them off the streets en masse,to make retribution more difficult. They are a problem that is only gonna get worse as we import more of our friendly nieghbors from the south. 
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I'd hate to think what they'd do to a family before ending the guy who killed one of theirs. I, for one, understand that my actions also affect my family. I'm not going to let some pissing contest put them in danger. Also, while I try to prepare for trouble, I don't go looking for it. |
No, they're not some ultra eite death squad, but their minds don't work like normal civilized people. They've got no qualms of conscience, and prison scares them about as much as detention scared us during high school. |
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I often wonder if/when the law abiding citizens of the United States will tire of the impotent goverment and begin to take the law into thier own hands. Illegal immigration and rising violent crime(it comes in all colors) in my area seems to be the topic on everyones lips. The general populace is getting fed up and I wonder, will it ever come to this? I harbor no doubt that were this to transpire, the .gov would lable these folks an even more dangerous "gang" then the groups of people they would target. We would then see the amount of enforcement previously unused on the original problem brought to bear on the vigilanties. |
until the "unknow/unseen" trash take your kids from school or school bus and THEN whatcha gonna do? they don't fear prison, death and certianly not YOU. I have this scum inside the prison I work in. they are like the crocodiles in the nile river, waiting to pounce, and even if you have the gun, the croc don't care. you might get lucky and get him first, or you might not.  |
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You guys are awesome and I enjoy being on this site, seriously, but I get a kick out of every one of these threads about MS13. Next thing you know an ARFCOM member is being chased by an assumed MS13 member and he almost had to draw down. My sarcasm concerning this issue comes from experience. I happen to be of hispanic heritage and grew up in neighborhoods you should never visit at night in the Los Angeles area. So here it goes, "F*CK MS13" and their central American illegal mothers too. I had the full experience of hardcore Los Angeles latino gangs and the all the idiocy it entails, I was shot by gang members in 1994 and many of my childhood friends from my neighborhood ended up as short stories if you catch my drift. The magic solution to prevent interaction with this type of scum is to STAY OUT of the ghetto areas they breed in. How hard is it to understand this? I'll say it again, avoid the hood. There are many members of this board who live in CA who are a very short drive from some of the most hardcore gang territories, but somehow this does not affect their lives, nor are they stroking their 1911 and staring out their blinds in anticipation of an MS13 encounter. I really love to hear about these stories, chances are they are "wetback central American wannabees" the kind of f*cks latino gangmembers from LA laugh at, when they run into traditional gangs, they play the role like they are NOT bangers and "no espeak english". **If you worry about gangmembers on the way to work or home, you need to think about relocating.** **If you can CCW, you are already in better shape than most southern Californians where we are infested with gangs but somehow live our life without stressing about these issues. Wish I had a CCW, and if you have a CCW and find yourself in a situation where you are going to employ deadly force, apply it liberally and hopefully you killed some real bangers and not some warehouse workers who scared you. ETA: You should be able to spot these gangmembers because they all ride in 64 Impalas on Dayton wire wheels, or can be easily spotted selling oranges or flowers on street corners. Another readily identifiable trait is the duct tail with hairnet applied. Do not forget about the crucifix too. NOT. |
That's not necessarily an option for everyone. The TH I bought 15 years ago was in a nice neighborhood... then. Now the area is gang-central. Yes, we moved, but before we did we had to convinced the newcomers that we would not put up with their ****. Fortunately it wasn't difficult and was accomplished without bloodshed. ETA: I listed the tactics used on a different thread and got told I was 1) crazy, and 2) stupid. I won't go into it again; just want to say that they worked and we were left alone. |
while I agree with your post, it is foolish to discount the gangs of any race or color. and avoidance is the best policy, however gang members are not bound to stay in their hood. although most do. and when they are not, they look out of place and actually try to blend in as much as they can. mexican and black gangs tend to travel in packs, (cowards when alone) but white trash gangs will be more of a lone wolf mentality and prey on the innocent people in the target stores parking lots. when drugs are involved, all bets are off for any race/gang. most "gang" members in my travels tend to be complete cowards when not traveling wit der hommies. even in prisons. (except when tasked to make a hit  )
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+1 I moved into an area which, isn't really "gang central", but had a drug problem (which I discovered after moving in). Since my condo was on the corner of a back-end of the complex, it was pretty much the spot of frequent drug sales. I called the cops several times, but they always showed up after the hoodlums had departed. So one summer day, when I saw them out there, I took a lawn chair out onto the balcony and made some noise (banging it into the railing as I moved it) to make sure they noticed me. Then I took a few of my guns out there and started cleaning them. I only got as far as opening the action on my shotgun to swab the bore when they got up and left. Haven't seen them since. Avoiding bad areas is a good idea, but if you live in a bad area there's not much you can do. Fortunately, I live in a "not-so-bad" area and I really feel like we're starting to reclaim the neighborhood. All because some crazy cracker with guns moved into the corner  Just thought I'd share if anyone else was looking for ideas  _MaH |
I don't know what your tactics were, but I'm glad they worked. I don't want to be a dick but I would make a hefty bet that if I was with you on your driveway, I would have identified them as "wannabees" or "claimers". Many of these gangs are viewed as being everywhere, yet the spray painting is by a "claimer" or by a young little cousin of a supposed member from another state, who decides to "claim" or promote the gang because he is infatuated with the whole gang lifestyle. So you see a family move in, a kid or two brothers start dressing the part and make friends and the spray painting begins, next thing you know "MS13" has migrated to your city. Just an assumption, based on experience from here in Southern California. I've reported graffiti to the local P.D. and told the officers where the idiots lived and that they were "wannabees" and/or they "backed up" a gang from another city. The officers agreed they were "punks" who would probably end up dead by real gangmembers. Either way, I advise to not just own a firearm, but become proficient with it. Take some courses. Every time I get more training, I still think I suck. |
You know honestly, I don't fear the guy with tattoo's up to his neck, you know the prison variety, the guy to worry about is the punk 15-16 yr old with a Ruger P89 or Glock in his waistband, that's the kid who is high and ready to kill you for nothing. The older guy with the tats has most likely been locked up and is not a "crazy youngster" anymore but still ready to "put in work" if he has to. Having said that, even the cops treat these older guys with "respect"(not that they really respect them, it's having tact) as in they know how they operate with the prison mentality and respect is a big deal. |
Actually it was the local Sheriff's office who gave us the 411 on their activities and warned us to be careful (we were friends with some of the deputies). The drug dealing at all hours was another giveaway, especially when their customers mistook our house for theirs and knocked on our doors (front and back) at all hours. And our TH was too small for a driveway; we had a parking lot behind the row, which is where the customers would usually gather to party. A 1,000,000 cp spotlight made 'em scatter like the cockroaches they are... |
< sarcasm > BAD BAD BAD Now they know you have guns and will break in to your condo and steal them while you're not home! </ sarcasm > |
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It is not just MS13 you have to worry about. Many Asian gangs are migrating from the "Chinatowns" of larger cities to the more suburbia settings of NJ. These guys may not have the military training of the 1% of MS13 guys do, but they are heartless just the same. Again, avoiding their turf is the best preventative medicine. On the gang situation. Extended friends of ours are being forced to leave one of the last decent neighborhoods of Newark. At the end of the school year, their daughter witnessed something and now the gangs have started the harassment process. Their son thank god has started college and lives out of state, but the girl is trying to finish her senior year, while her parents are trying to find a new home that they can afford to get away from the BS. They live in constant fear and don't feel safe in their own home anymore...no they don't have a gun in the home or can afford police protection like the rich. The only thing the Newark PD will be able to do about this, is to file a report after the fact. |
You should actually take out the sarcasm. That is actually a real threat. I wouldn't want any potential thugs (real or wannabes) knowing I have firearms where I live. Keeping a low profile until you need, really need, to do otherwise is your best bet. |
you both are fools if you dont think gang members will steal your weapons when they know you are away, hell, they might just shoot you from behind as you unlock your door and then loot your house and weapons. why the fuck do people insist on advertising that they have weapons??? seriously, it is only going to take away your advantage of supprise, and more than likeley result in the criminalk eseclating the force used to rob or otherwise acomplis their goal. way to go, you just shot your self in the foot. they know you are armed, you can rest assured that the ones who fuck with you will be equaly armed. and outnumber you. hope you move soon for you and your familys sake |
You ever see The Punisher? Something like that... |