Posted: 12/3/2004 4:37:14 PM EDT
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Ok ... this is quoted from the Bible. Anyone who wishes to argue and philosophize, or express their own opinions, is naturally, up to themselves, i.e.; "free mind". The scripture is based off the NIV. Again, some might argue that the NIV is inaccurate. This is not true. Charles Caldwell Ryrie, TH.D, PH.D., and others have verified the authenticity of the NIV to the original scriptures of the "66 books" ... Genesis to Revelation. I highly encourage those whom have questions about God to do the following: Go to a church that preaches "open Bible" and Christ crucified and His resurrection. If the said church does not preach the described ... DO NOT BOTHER WITH THAT CHURCH! Go to another and ask to talk to the Pastor. Not all churches are the same. Finally, I didn't write this post to argue, because God does not argue. God says "this IS the deal ... not let's make a deal." I will not argue this nor any other post related to this. The Bible is what it is, I can only hope that this will pursuade others who might have honest questions about God, Jesus Christ and The Holy Spirit ... to seek Him and his awesome love. Again, I'm not here to beguile anyone or to discuss/debate theology. Enough of my rambles ... A few parts of scripture. Who is this Jesus? Genesis 1: 26 ... "Let us make man in our image" ... (emphasis mine) John 8: 58 ... "I tell you the truth", Jesus answered, "before Abraham was born, I AM!" (The "I AM" denotes absolute eternal existance. "I AM" is a claim to be Yahweh of the O.T.) John 2: 19 ... Jesus answered them, "Destroy this temple, and I will raise it again in three days." (If God rose Christ from the dead, and Jesus made this statement of John 2:19 ... then Jesus is God.) Matthew 28: 19 ... "Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit ..." (emphasis mine) (Notice Jesus said "In the name" i.e.; singular, a word denoting one person.) No one can go to the Father, who is God but by Christ. John 14: 6 ... Jesus said, "I Am the way, I Am the truth, I Am the life, no one goes to the Father except by me." Jesus IS God John 1: 1, John 5: 17, Matthew 1: 23; 8: 29, John 10: 30; 20: 28, Philemon 2: 6, Hebrews 1: 8; 13: 8, Revelation 1: 8, Matthew 3: 17 Of Judgment Psalm 9: 7 ... The Lord reigns forever; He has established His throne for judgment. Matthew 12: 26 ... Jesus said: "But I tell you that men will have to give account on the day of judgment, including every hidden thing, weather it is good or evil." Who is God? God says there is no other god, He knows no other. The Creator ... Genesis 1: 1, Nehemiah 9: 6, Psalm 24: 1, Exodus 20:11 Of Grace ... Romans 3:24 ... 11: 5, Ephesians 2:8, 2nd Peter 3:18, His Holiness ... Exodus 15: 11, Leviticus 19: 2, Habakkuk 1:13, Revelation 4: 8 Of Love ... Isaiah 54: 10, John 3:16, John 17: 23, Romans 8: 31 Of His Sovereignty ... Exodus 18: 11, Psalm 93: 1, Psalm 95: 3, Matthew 6: 10, Romans 14: 11 Holy Spirit Isaiah 61: 1, Zechariah 4: 6, John 15: 26, Genesis 1: 2; 6: 3; 41: 38, Isaiah 42: 1, Ezekiel 36: 27, Matthew 1: 18; 3: 11, 16-17; 10: 20, John 14: 16-17, Chap 26, 16: 7-8, 20: 22, Acts 1: 5-8, 2: 2-4, 4: 8, 31; 9:31, 13: 2, Romans 5: 5, 8: 26, 1st Corinthians 3: 16, Galatians 4: 6, Ephesians 4: 30, 1st Thessalonians 5: 19 These parts of scripture is by no means exhaustive ... just a few outlines. Ok ... about "pre-destination" No one is "pre-destined" to go to God's Kingdom or Hell, and no where in scripture implies this. Predestined ... God has determined beforehand that those who beleive in Christ will be adopted into His family and conformed to His Son (look up Romans 8:29) What it does not mean ... Predestined does not relieve man of his responsibility to believe the Gospel in order to bring to pass personally God's predestination. (Look up Romans 8: 15). About homosexuality ... Anyone with common sence can see that homosexuality is an "abomination" before God. God made Adam and Eve ... not Adam and Steve. Genesis 19: 5 says: They called out to Lot, "Where are the men who came to you tonight? Bring them out to us so that we can have sex with them". God's attitude toward the sin of homosexuality is seen in the destruction of Sodom. Look up Leviticus 18: 22 - 29, 20: 13, Romans 1: 26, 1st Corinthians 6: 9, 1st Timothy 1: 10 From here, I cut and pasted, obviously ... How to receive forgivness of sins and so be "saved" ... Repentance THE IMPORTANCE OF REPENTANCE What place should repentance have in your presentation of the gospel? Is repentance the same thing as belief? Or is it something distinct from it? Is it important to emphasize repentance, or should we never mention it in this age of grace? What does repentance really mean, anyway? These are some of the questions the soulwinner must face (and answer) regarding the subject of repentance. There can be little doubt that all men, from Adam on, have had to repent in order to have a right relationship with God. The importance of this is brought home when we realize men of every Biblical age preached it. John the Baptist preached it (Mark 1:15); the Apostle John proclaimed its necessity (Rev. 2:5); Paul preached repentance wherever he went (Acts 17:30; 20:21 ); and the Lord Jesus Christ Himself strongly emphasized that men who refused to repent would perish (Luke 13:3, 5). So, you see, repentance is necessary for salvation. The Maxwell Street Merchant and The God of All Grace The greatest war in history is raging today. It is a war between two great ideas, and it is being fought by Christians. The one idea is held by a handful of very stubborn people. It is: That Christ in His death accomplished everything necessary to bridge the otherwise unbridgeable gap that must, of necessity, exist between a God of infinite holiness and sinners in abject ruin. Most people in Christendom hold the opposite view, and are equally stubborn in its defense. They contend that: Something must be added to the death of Christ by the sinner before salvation can be complete and final. The majority of Christians consider the first view "cheap grace," and its acceptance "easy believism." They believe that for God to do all of the saving, without the least bit of cooperation from the sinner, would encourage the Christian to sin. Usually throughout their messages, and always in their invitations to people to become Christians, they will give the sinner something to "do" in order to be fully and finally saved. A dear Roman Catholic friend was sitting with me at my kitchen table. He asked me to explain in the simplest of terms the difference between what I believe and what his church teaches. Since he is a police official, with authority over 120 deputies, I stood two .44 magnum cartridges on the table. Pointing to the first one, I said, "Rome teaches that Christ’s death merely threw the door of Heaven open. But, in order to enter, the sinner needs the mediation of Mary, the death of the martyrs, the suffering of the saints, the sacraments of the church, some attendance at ritual, some of his own good works, plus some time (days, weeks, months, or years) in a river of fire called Purgatory." Pointing to the second cartridge I used it to represent what the Bible teaches, "Christ died for sinners...Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and you will be saved." Pointing to the second cartridge, the one representing the all sufficiency of Calvary alone to completely save, he exclaimed, "This one glorifies God!" He had grasped in an instant the fact that escapes most people for a lifetime...That God is only glorified by what He is and does. Religionists, whether Protestant, Catholic, or Orthodox, many times seek to protect God from making a bad investment. If God should save someone who turned out badly, who continued to live selfishly, who persisted in certain sinful practices, who failed to appreciate his Savior, who abused Grace; that would be unfair to God. Frequently, the religionist worries that someone might gain Heaven with less difficulty than himself and that would never do! Religionists fail to recognize two things. First, that God is not glorified by His ability to bargain shrewdly with sinners, but by His infinite generosity in avalanching Grace (unmerited favor, undeserved kindness) to His enemies. Second, that the greatest motivation the Universe will ever witness is the unconditional, unretractable love from Christ at Calvary. To put it another way, at Calvary God credited your sins and mine to His Son Who had no sins, in order that He might credit His righteousness to us who had no righteousness. Peter saw this and wrote, "For Christ also suffered once for sins, the Just for the unjust, that He might bring us to God" (1 Peter 3:18). If standing at the cross, in my mind’s eye, and seeing God the Son dying my death does not make me want to know Him better, love Him more, and serve Him faithfully, nothing will! God does not need the protection afforded Him by religion! He has never saved one person that deserved to be saved...and He never will! That there is a life-style that is appropriate for saved people is beyond dispute. The Pauline Epistles are full of exhortations to conduct ourselves befitting our exalted position as those whom God has saved and blessed. But the fact that those exhortations are there also proves that they are needed...that there are believers whose life-styles do not accord with the will of God for us as revealed in Scripture. This is true of all of us some of the time, and some of us all of the time. But the question is not, do all Christians always behave as they should? The question is, did Christ on Calvary’s cross fully satisfy the justice of God for us or must we contribute something to our salvation? Did Christ there die for all of our sins or must we suffer for some of them? Is salvation a totally free gift for us because bought and fully paid for by our Lord on His cross or is there still something that we must "ante up?" Protestants have proved that they can add as many things to Calvary as Rome does. How many times have you heard that men must "Repent and believe" to be saved? The Greek word rendered "repent" means to rethink. It is impossible to believe something that one didn’t believe a minute before without rethinking. These are two sides to one coin, but men read all sorts of things into repentance. Recently I heard the world’s most famous evangelist saying that "to repent means to change your life...you must change your life!" He was giving lost people four or five things to do to be saved including changing their lives. God gives us one thing to do, believe. Believing is the only thing that you and I can do without actually doing anything. When I believe in the crosswork of Christ--His death for my sins--I stop doing anything and trust in what He has done! As a totally lost sinner I cannot change my life and make it pleasing to God. "Those that are in the flesh cannot please God" (Romans 8:8). All change must come from God after I have been saved. Some believe that they are to do the best they can and that Christ’s death will make up for what they lack. Others believe that Christ’s death provided some of their salvation and that they must contribute the rest. Either way, to be partly saved would be to be completely lost. Even if Christ’s death provided 99% of a person’s salvation he would still not be saved. 99% saved is 100% lost. If Christ effected 99% of my salvation I would be lost until I contributed the remaining one percent, and then I would have become my own savior. But God will not share His glory with another, and saving people who don’t deserve to be saved is what glorifies Him in Time and Eternity. Men may say, Believe and be baptized... Believe and pray...Believe and turn your back on sin...Believe and give your heart to Jesus...Believe and make a commitment to God...Believe and make Christ Lord of your life...etc. God says only--Believe! While God was still dealing with Israel as a nation, water baptism was a required demonstration of one’s faith--though the water itself saved no one. There are no required demonstrations of faith in the present Dispensation of Grace--it is simply Believe (trust) and be saved! "Lordship salvation," the teaching that one cannot be saved without making Christ the Lord of his life, is simply a euphemism for the ancient heresy of justification by works. It is the old Trojan horse with a fresh coat of paint. It robs God of His glory by compromising His grace. I’m aware that some "Lordshippers" teach that one is not saved by "making Christ Lord," but that all saved people do instantly "make Him Lord." God and Paul address the Romans as "saints." Had the Romans "made Him Lord of their lives" at the moment of salvation? They still had not presented their bodies living sacrifices at the time God and Paul wrote them exhorting them to do so (Romans 12:1). Could He be "made Lord" without their being made "sacrifices?" God and Paul address the Corinthians as "saints." They were "carnal" and "walking as men." Had they made Him Lord in order to be saved, or because they were saved? Actually, Scripture nowhere enjoins us to "make Christ Lord of our lives," either to be saved, or because we have been saved. Only the Father could make the Son Lord, and He has done that (Acts 2:36). But we are exhorted to present our bodies living sacrifices, not in order to be saved but because we have been saved. We would not need this exhortation if we had done this automatically at the moment of our coming to Christ. Unless and until we do this, we are actually rejecting His reign in our hearts and lives. All the talk about His Lordship does not change this fact. The appeal to already saved people to present their bodies as living sacrifices is made on the basis of "the mercies of God." These mercies fill the first eleven chapters of Romans, "The Handbook of Salvation." We are to become Christ’s slaves, in a practical sense, and serve Him daily... hourly because we have already been saved gratuitously, without any cause in us (Romans 3:23-24). This is our greatest responsibility and our highest privilege! No, God is not on Maxwell Street striking bargains with men. We must meet Him at Calvary, where He does all the saving and we do only all the being saved! God Bless! |
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Um, I suggest you do some research on the history of Bible translations before you accept the NIV as scripture. In a nutshell: All translations are based off of one of two different texts. The textus receptus or the textus vaticanus. The textus vaticanus has MANY proven factual errors. For that reason no English translations were made from it... until the 19th century. Prior to that time, all English translations were made from the textus receptus. |
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Like vodka and xanax, one should not mix the old with the new when trying to make a point. Jesus is about free will, love and togetherness. Divisiveness can not be legitimized through the words of Jesus. Using the Bible to point out whom we should loathe can only be accomplished by out of context quotes and mixing old testemant hate with new testament characters. Show me in context where Jesus instructs us on whom we should hate. |
I have found a number of problems with the NIV, myself. The NASB is MUCH closer to the original Koine Greek. There are some translations that attempt to do a "thought by thought" translation, rather than word for word, such as the Living Bible. These are very problematic for me, because I want to know what the original Greek or Hebrew or Aramaic says. Then there are those like the NASB that attempt to do word for word translations. The KJV also attempted to do word for word, but the language of the King James era makes reading a problem for some. The NIV seeks to do between a word for word and a thought for thought translation for readability, but it makes some errors. Of course, the best is to read the texts in the original language, and two years of Greek will allow you to read the Gospel of John, but more learning is required to read the other books like the Gospel of Luke. |
**How can God never have a beginning? He was always just there?** DoubleFeed ... That blows me away too ... Perhaps the book of Proverbs may give a little bit of an answer ... Chapters 18 and 19. I'm sure God will let us know when He chooses. But yes, I marvel at His awesome power. I adore Him. 
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Andy ... No pun intended ... Prove it! |
**Show me in context where Jesus instructs us on whom we should hate.** You lost me there ... where did I state this? |
I do not understand how a person can wholeheartedly believe in something that refers to itself as the final word, and there is no way to tell whether that is true. |
I used to like to smoke pot and ponder that one lol |
glazer1972 No problem, I have a KJV too ... I chose NIV so as a bit easier to read into. However, one needs the Holy Spirit to "prayerfully read/study" the Bible. |
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I have a million of them. |
Doublefeed its like the universe...Where does it end? Where does it begin? If you could get to the end of the universe and put out your hand there would be more space... and so on, and so on... God has no begginning and no end... I used to ponder that... but of course there is no answer so i just accept it on faith...God is infinite |
Correct. Revelation 1:8 "I am the Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End," says the Lord, "who is and who was and who is to come, the Almighty." |
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**I seek knowledge, but every source refers back to the Bible. I do not understand how a person can wholeheartedly believe in something that refers to itself as the final word, and there is no way to tell whether that is true.** Great questions. My answer is this ... When I received Jesus Christ as my Lord and Savoir, I felt like a new person. All I knew was that He was real, and I wish to continue in my growth and walk with Him. I still have questions ... I think in the book of Deuteronomy God states there are some things He keeps to Himself. Now, don't hold me to which book God states this, I'll have too look it up. As I look into the stars, and marvel in the great complexity of what I can see, and as I see the little things too, I can only wonder who is this God who created such things. I commend your quest for knowledge, as I do as well. LOL ... I saw JW said that he smokes pot and wonders too ... I don't doubt it, LOL Another question bears in mind ... Who am I that God loves so much to send His Son to die for me? Me?? And I know I don't deserve this love. But! I'll take it! Perhaps we'll know some time, time as we know it. Why not ask Him? |
1) There is more than one theory floating around as to whether the universe is infinite or finite. We don't know which it is yet. 2) Open space containing nothing is much different then the presence of something, ie, the presence of God. How can a lifeform at some plane of existance be infinite? Is that the ONLY lifeform anywhere which is infinite? |
As mortals, all we know is birth and death. We have no frame of reference nor earthly concept to understand the nature of an eternal life. We are all born with an inate desire to live forever, but surely if we had evolved and were not created that desire would have been bred out of us. Why would we have a desire to live forever unless God had created that longing within us? |
I keep seeing Christians claim that they have a little mind and God is so great he cannot be comprehended. I ask, why do you think this? With our aggressive reasoning abilities and relatively developed logical facilities, our ever advancing tidal wave of scientific discovery, our unprecedented speed of communication, etc, you mean to tell me that God is so great that his most advanced creation in the universe is literally unable to comprehend him, beyond the idea that both his size/location and abilites are infinite? Look at some scientific theories, and idea of popular science fiction. There are some rather huge ideas in scope out there. I struggle to understand why there is a idea so huge that words cannot capture it. |
That was 20 years ago... |
