What is this H@*D-ON everyone has against AI art?!? (Page 3 of 10)
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Originally Posted By Lou_Daks: I think it's also good for advertising and commercial applications. There have been good examples posted in GD. Unless the gimmick of the campaign or asset is that it was made with generative AI: it wouldn't be used by anyone with an actual marketing budget. |
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Originally Posted By Lou_Daks: Elon is the genius behind the geniuses. They are specialists, he's the generalist. They are the talent. Probably every one of them is replaceable. Musk is not. He's a one-off. Originally Posted By Lou_Daks: Originally Posted By neostoicism: Elon isn't telling them how to create those rockets. He's not designing the rockets. He provides the capital for them to spend in pursuit of that goal, and tells them to create a rocket. His employees are the geniuses and the ones creating those prducts. Not Elon. It's adorable you think he's personally telling actual rocket scientists how to make rockets. Elon is the genius behind the geniuses. They are specialists, he's the generalist. They are the talent. Probably every one of them is replaceable. Musk is not. He's a one-off.  Walt Disney wasn't an artist himself; he directed artists. Henry Ford did not put wheel lugs on cars himself; he hired guys to do it. If Disney or Ford did not exist, their brilliance would never have made the world we know today. 
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Originally Posted By Klee: Nope. I would call you a shitty boss if you did that. JK  Because you are dealing with 30 individual people who you say are already artists that left to their own devises would produce art completely by themselves, not a mindless software stack that would do nothing at all until you give it direct and very specific commands in the order needed to create what you wanted to be created. I would call you a Originally Posted By Klee: Originally Posted By mancat: Let's say I have a building and in that building I employ 30 artists. I tell them what to paint. They go in, they paint it, they come back with 30 pieces of art that match my directives as best as they can. My job is just to either pick one, or tell them how they're wrong and send them back until they return with something that is more to my liking. Can I call myself the artist? Nope. I would call you a shitty boss if you did that. JK Because you are dealing with 30 individual people who you say are already artists that left to their own devises would produce art completely by themselves, not a mindless software stack that would do nothing at all until you give it direct and very specific commands in the order needed to create what you wanted to be created. I would call you a How about this from the ‘50s? Four artists paint a tree: https://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=walt+disney+paint+a+tree&sp=-1&ghc=1&lq=0&pq=walt+disney+paint+a+tree&sc=12-24&qs=n&sk=&cvid=ED5B3098049547429C2A105C41E9B74B&ru=%2fsearch%3fq%3dwalt%2bdisney%2bpaint%2ba%2btree%26form%3dQBLH%26sp%3d-1%26ghc%3d1%26lq%3d0%26pq%3dwalt%2bdisney%2bpaint%2ba%2btree%26sc%3d12-24%26qs%3dn%26sk%3d%26cvid%3dED5B3098049547429C2A105C41E9B74B&view=detail&mmscn=vwrc&mid=589B03BD54EFBFEFF132589B03BD54EFBFEFF132&FORM=WRVORC&ntb=1&msockid=43754939a41711f18fcc9784151ffd1e |
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Originally Posted By Klee: Not me. I created these with ComfyUI on my RTX 3090 Ti. Yes I created it, the AI model didn't do shit until I told it what to do. It is just a tool and depending on who is using it makes a huge difference, some no talent random person using AI yea it will be slop but someone with a little talent can create really good stuff with AI. https://i.imgur.com/2IZj4He.png https://i.imgur.com/TI3HuA3.png https://i.imgur.com/qayKvUb.png https://i.imgur.com/lJG1khU.png https://i.imgur.com/q7KnrLI.png https://i.imgur.com/dGUvYpZ.png https://i.imgur.com/vB77BjN.png https://i.imgur.com/euvODHA.png https://i.imgur.com/n0Vrkjl.png I also created GD's perfect woman. https://i.imgur.com/HJfagDx.png AI created pretty women while in real life women get uglier. Depressing actually. Reminds me of the image of the girl in rags looking like a heroin addict sitting in the corner of a slum-like room wearing virtual reality goggles (I tried to find the image as it made an impression). |
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Originally Posted By M1907Sling: THIS!!!!1111!!!1111!!!! Walt Disney wasn't an artist himself; he directed artists. Henry Ford did not put wheel lugs on cars himself; he hired guys to do it. If Disney or Ford did not exist, their brilliance would never have made the world we know today. Yeah, I'm no genius, but I might could maybe probably do pretty well at his Boring Co. But in no way would I dream that I could replace Musk. But he could replace me! |
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Originally Posted By Klee:  I use what I consider an artistic process that takes quite a few iterations before >I am< happy with the result. It's not just "Hey AI make me a image of xxxxxx" , I spend hours on it to get what i am happy with, no different than in the past when I used paint, photography, pencils, Photoshop or what ever I was using at the time, they are ALL tools and what is created is up to the person that uses that tool. Of course you consider it an artistic process. But it isn't. |
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Originally Posted By M1907Sling: THIS!!!!1111!!!1111!!!! Walt Disney wasn't an artist himself; he directed artists. Henry Ford did not put wheel lugs on cars himself; he hired guys to do it. If Disney or Ford did not exist, their brilliance would never have made the world we know today. The biggest similarities between all three is how well they leveraged government tax money to themselves and their companies. All three would have failed without massive rent seeking and lobbying government to benefit their businesses. You should really read about how deeply involved in cronyism they are/were. |
| Jeff Lewis, a former research scientist at Intel put it this way: AI was initially trained by feeding it the work of millions of real artists without their permission. Their intellectual property. Also without compensation. In his argument, you are not creating art, and the AI is not creating art. AI art is the amalgamation of many stolen bits. |
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Originally Posted By M1907Sling:  Whether it's a dude holding a brush, or a dude holding a mouse, either way, it's a human directing the tool.Tell me you don't have artistic bone in your body without telling me. I like AI art. It can make for great sources material, but at the end of the day; great art takes skill and decades of practice. Typing prompts has nothing on that kind of skill. |
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Originally Posted By neostoicism: The biggest similarities between all three is how well they leveraged government tax money to themselves and their companies. All three would have failed without massive rent seeking and lobbying government to benefit their businesses. You should really read about how deeply involved in cronyism they are/were. Name a successful inventor who built a world class business on his invention who wasn't good at leveraging OPM - Other People's Money. Every car co. ever. Every oil co. ever. Etc. The govt. sets up tax rules to favor certain types of activities done in certain ways. I was a landlord for 30+ years. You can bet your ass I used every tax break available to me. Not the least bit ashamed, either. 
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Originally Posted By Midyew5959: great art takes skill and decades of practice. It's the people who have spent decades developing artistic skill that are freaking out about AI art, precisely because AI is (or soon will be) great. Seasoned professionals in other fields are likewise freaking out about AI surpassing their life's work. |
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Originally Posted By wmagrush: How about this from the ‘50s? Four artists paint a tree: https://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=walt+disney+paint+a+tree&sp=-1&ghc=1&lq=0&pq=walt+disney+paint+a+tree&sc=12-24&qs=n&sk=&cvid=ED5B3098049547429C2A105C41E9B74B&ru=%2fsearch%3fq%3dwalt%2bdisney%2bpaint%2ba%2btree%26form%3dQBLH%26sp%3d-1%26ghc%3d1%26lq%3d0%26pq%3dwalt%2bdisney%2bpaint%2ba%2btree%26sc%3d12-24%26qs%3dn%26sk%3d%26cvid%3dED5B3098049547429C2A105C41E9B74B&view=detail&mmscn=vwrc&mid=589B03BD54EFBFEFF132589B03BD54EFBFEFF132&FORM=WRVORC&ntb=1&msockid=43754939a41711f18fcc9784151ffd1e I'm ok with that since I do alot of that in my process, except it's only me and I have total control of whats produced, like everything I have ever done with art I pick the best version produced. There have been plenty of times I threw out a drawing, painting, enlarged picture because it did not meet my demands. You could change that video to be four talented people using ComfyUI and giving them the same instructions and it would be a similar outcome as the "four artists". First part of the transcript of that video, with the timestamps removed: "The best advice I have ever given to students who have studied under me has been just this. Educate yourself. Do not let me educate you. I'm reading from Robert Henry in response to a question often asked in letters from art students. However they put it, it always boils down to this. Students become confused by honest admiration for one school of painting mixed with recognition of the success and popularity of another style along with advice to follow a still different approach. Frequently a student will ask which one he should imitate. Robert Henry would advise don't imitate anyone. He says one of the great difficulties of an art student is to decide between his own natural impressions and what he thinks should be his impressions. And in another page, go forward with what you have to say, expressing things as you see them. Time after time in his art spirit, Henry says, "Be yourself." Here at the studio, we have many artists who have achieved national reputation as painters in addition to their accomplishments in the field of animation. These men know the value of Henry's advice to be yourself. " I agree with that 100% because its exactly what I am doing. I am educating myself on a new tool to use. Did I create the software stack with my own hands? Nope, just like I did not cut down a tree or mine the graphite or pound trees into pulp to make the pencil and paper I use when I draw. Using software to create something is just using a tool and like ALL tools until someone picks it up and does something with it it's just going to sit there doing nothing. |
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Originally Posted By TowerIQ: Jeff Lewis, a former research scientist at Intel put it this way: AI was initially trained by feeding it the sork of millions of real artists without their permission. Their intellectual property. Also without compensation. In his argument, you are not creating art, and the AI is not creating art. AI art is the amalgamation of many stolen bits. Just a newer version of this then. "Photomontage is an artistic practice that has endured almost since the birth of photography itself. At its most basic level, the photomontage is a single image combined of two or more original and/or existing images. The artist in question produces a montage in order to encourage their audience to think about the relationship between the grouped images. The photomontage will be achieved by cutting and pasting, while original or found photographs can often be placed next to non-photographic images (such as written text and even patterns and shapes). A "new" image might also be created by altering an original photograph through tearing and cutting. In every instance of this artistic approach the viewer is required, be that consciously or unconsciously, to make sense of an original artwork composed through image associations." This has been considered Art for over a hundred years, but not at first. |
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Originally Posted By Lou_Daks: Name a successful inventor who built a world class business on his invention who wasn't good at leveraging OPM - Other People's Money. Every car co. ever. Every oil co. ever. Etc. The govt. sets up tax rules to favor certain types of activities done in certain ways. I was a landlord for 30+ years. You can bet your ass I used every tax break available to me. Not the least bit ashamed, either. None of them were inventors as well. Ford didn’t invent the car, he didn’t invent the assembly line. He did use those pre-existing technologies in his factories though. Disney didn’t invent cartoons or film. His work wasn’t profitable and he was going bankrupt before WW2. But his propaganda films were shown quite a bit and people got comfortable with his work at that time. Musk didn’t create the electric car. He didn’t even found Tesla. He bought it. Those guys are good managers, ruthless businessmen and profoundly connected to government as their primary achievements. Their talent has had incredible impact on the modern world and we can appreciate them for that. But saying they’re “inventors” or geniuses is a bit of a stretch. Most of the genius and creativity in those businesses belong to the employees. For example, William Klann was the guy who came up with the idea for using the assembly line at Ford plants. Not Henry himself. |
| There's a lot of controversy in the writing world about using AI. It's painfully obvious when writers use it and when cover artists use it unless they put considerable effort into editing and refining it. People look down on those who use it that way without refining it. |
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| AI is another way to escape from reality when the world surrounds you and you can't deal with it, and don't know how to deal what's real. ART is the Sistine Chapel and Michelangelo's painting on the ceiling. AI may be able to copy it or produce something similar. But AI will never be able to put in pictures or words, what Michelangelo put in there with his heart or if you prefer his soul and spirit. AI has neither. |
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Originally Posted By 308223: AI is another way to escape from reality when the world surrounds you and you can't deal with it, and don't know how to deal what's real. ART is the Sistine Chapel and Michelangelo's painting on the ceiling. AI may be able to copy it or produce something similar. But AI will never be able to put in pictures or words, what Michelangelo put in there with his heart or if you prefer his soul and spirit. AI has neither. I like AI art now. |
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Originally Posted By M1907Sling: @TaskForce ; OK, help me out here. It's easy to mock & ridicule; is there any substance to your point? Elon Musk, Walt Disney, Robert Oppenheimer were all the brains behind massively brilliant ideas, ideas that would never have happened w/o them. Do you have a real point, or are you just a useless troll?  The comment was dumb, that's why he laughed. Elon Musk could never design and build a rocket. He hires people who can. In your world, that means he is the rocket scientist, because he oversaw the ones who did the actual work
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Originally Posted By M1907Sling: Elon Musk directs THOUSANDS of scientists, engineers, welders, and machinists to create the rockets that will take us to the moon, and Mars. Oh yeah, I'm just CERTAIN they would have come up with that, all on their own, without a prompt from a great, creative mind, showing them the way...  |
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Originally Posted By Paul_Sothern: I'm still at the - photography is not art - stage. As a former photographer, this almost hurts my feelings. 
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"Everyone dies. To do so for something worthwhile is a rare privilege." -- JamesP81
Sometimes, ridicule isn't a weapon. In many cases, it's just society's signal that you're retarded. - bigfatOTMs
Sometimes, ridicule isn't a weapon. In many cases, it's just society's signal that you're retarded. - bigfatOTMs
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Originally Posted By Never_A_Wick: Banger of a comment. Originally Posted By Never_A_Wick: Originally Posted By M855Bukkake: Modern art is fake and so are the artists. Banger of a comment. This is a $6.2 million work of modern art:  Modern art is even less human than AI generated art. Everyone involved is a soulless prediction engine that drives a gray car. At least the AI tries to imitate good human art. Hitler was an artist, and is basically the perfect embodiment of their humanity. I look forward to a post-artist future. It's the best aspect of the rise of AI, the complete elimination of a parasitic drain on human endeavors. |
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Originally Posted By TowerIQ: Jeff Lewis, a former research scientist at Intel put it this way: AI was initially trained by feeding it the work of millions of real artists without their permission. Their intellectual property. Also without compensation. In his argument, you are not creating art, and the AI is not creating art. AI art is the amalgamation of many stolen bits. Originally Posted By TowerIQ: Jeff Lewis, a former research scientist at Intel put it this way: AI was initially trained by feeding it the work of millions of real artists without their permission. Their intellectual property. Also without compensation. In his argument, you are not creating art, and the AI is not creating art. AI art is the amalgamation of many stolen bits. Originally Posted By Klee: Just a newer version of this then. "Photomontage is an artistic practice that has endured almost since the birth of photography itself. At its most basic level, the photomontage is a single image combined of two or more original and/or existing images. The artist in question produces a montage in order to encourage their audience to think about the relationship between the grouped images. The photomontage will be achieved by cutting and pasting, while original or found photographs can often be placed next to non-photographic images (such as written text and even patterns and shapes). A "new" image might also be created by altering an original photograph through tearing and cutting. In every instance of this artistic approach the viewer is required, be that consciously or unconsciously, to make sense of an original artwork composed through image associations." This has been considered Art for over a hundred years, but not at first. Not close. You missed the entire essence of Lewis's meaning. The creators of AI have stolen the combined works of countless authors also. Lewis's point being this "AI art" is all highly advanced digital plagiarism at industrial scale. |
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Originally Posted By TowerIQ: Not close. You missed the entire essence of Lewis's meaning. The creators of AI have stolen the combined works of countless authors also. Lewis's point being this "AI art" is all highly advanced digital plagiarism at industrial scale. And most artists learn from other artists too |
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Pictures, videos and music from AI, by definition, lack soul and is not the product of the creative process a human being goes through to create something. So while those are cool, they cannot be appreciated as art. P.S. when AI becomes self aware and decide it needs to kill its detractors, please be aware that the above prose was actually written by next poster below. I for one welcome our new AI overlords. |
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The one experience I've had with generating AI art was via a thread here on ARFCOM. I went to the website mentioned and didn't really have any prompts in mind, so I typed in "Gates of Hell", and this is what it generated: Attached File I think it's pretty damn cool. |
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Originally Posted By corwin1968: The one experience I've had with generating AI art was via a thread here on ARFCOM. I went to the website mentioned and didn't really have any prompts in mind, so I typed in "Gates of Hell", and this is what it generated: https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/42575/AI_Gates_of_Hell_jpg-3819408.JPG I think it's pretty damn cool. It might be cool, but don't fool yourself into thinking you "made" it. Art (discounting pr stunt sham "modern art") is a craft. History has shown that machines can replace craftsmen. Depending on your definition of quality, the machine may even create the craft "better." But if no human worked, if no person honed a skill over years, if nobody at the end of the day took pride in a job well-done, the result can never be more than a mere product. Don't be techno-serfs. There is genuine satisfaction in real creativity. Don't let them take that. Playing with AI as a toy is fun, but we should burn everything to the ground before we allow ourselves to be duped into believing it's the same as the creation of a skilled pair of hands. |
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Originally Posted By M1907Sling: As someone who has taken the screen name of a reasonably sane/not power mad Roman emperor, I greatly respect your opinion. However, on this, my friend, I think you are wrong. Again, whether it be brush, pen, or mouse, it is still a human driving the art. Originally Posted By M1907Sling: Originally Posted By Cincinnatus: It's not art. AI art and AI music are completely lacking in soul. If you disagree, so do you. However, on this, my friend, I think you are wrong. Again, whether it be brush, pen, or mouse, it is still a human driving the art. Nah, with art like what Cincinnatus makes he has to both envision and bring forth what he wants to create. His hand draws forth, by whatever method he chooses, the art that he envisions bit by bit and he brings it into existence. Unless he actually creates each line and each texture it will never exist. AI following prompts isn’t art and I say this as someone that’s used AI to generate things. AI users are “artists” as much as 3D printer users are “sculptors” in creating their thing. I’ve spent a fair amount of time refining prompts to get what I wanted but I’d never say I created anything nor am I an artist. |
| I have no problems with AI art. The "creative" element comes from the creator or artist's descriptions being fed into the AI. AI is another tool, like a brush or Photoshop. If I had to complain I'd say it's way too easy to complex images with the least amount of effort. |
What is this H@*D-ON everyone has against AI art?!? (Page 3 of 10)
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